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Old 10-19-2014, 11:11 AM
 
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Another monkey wrench,

The person you claim was not documented, but another wrote of it, about the same time as Taburi, early 900s.

We have a basic concept that was developed, but was done so by people in different parts of the muslim land, with no contact with each other.
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Old 10-19-2014, 11:14 AM
 
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A serious problem is in the saying, "We believe", which also contradicts your statements of muslims following their own path.
There is an organized set of belief's you are commanded to believe, and this can vary with sects.

There is nothing to document what you believe, other than what was created hundreds of years after the fact.
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Old 10-19-2014, 11:27 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim_a49 View Post
A serious problem is in the saying, "We believe", which also contradicts your statements of muslims following their own path.
There is an organized set of belief's you are commanded to believe, and this can vary with sects.

There is nothing to document what you believe, other than what was created hundreds of years after the fact.
When I use "We" I hope I am doing it in relation to the Pillars and the Basic beliefs all Muslims are to believe.

While there is no firm obligation to believe the Basic beliefs, but they are what most Muslims do believe.



Muslims have six main beliefs. That virtually all Muslims believe.

Belief in Allah as the one and only God
Belief in angels
Belief in the holy books
Belief in the Prophets...
Belief in the Day of Judgement..
Belief Allah is all Knowing...
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Old 10-20-2014, 09:48 AM
 
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And these belief's are issued to them
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Old 10-21-2014, 02:40 PM
 
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There are thousands of epigraphic evidence and writings of Arabic from the Arabs. Makkah goes back further than 4 century, where are you getting your info?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim_a49 View Post
The reason we know so little about these people is because they were almost all illiterate, and left nothing in writing, then we have the muslim attitude of destroy what does not conform, so much was lost to history.

What we do have paints a picture, but the accuracy is doubt full, We also have rulers writing what they want for themselves.
The first writer, from Malik's court wrote things about muhammed, the sunni reject, however the sunni use Bukhari, which is 300 years too late, and way to far from the source, to even be considered for accuracy.


All historians can do is sort through the writings that survived and make educated guesses.
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Old 10-21-2014, 02:42 PM
 
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What you have posted are the 6 articles of faith and they are in the Qur'an and said to follow just as the 5 pillars of Islam is in the Qur'an that a Muslim should follow. What's not obligatory is AHadith, which was done in 850 AD. The Sunna is the Qur'an.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
When I use "We" I hope I am doing it in relation to the Pillars and the Basic beliefs all Muslims are to believe.

While there is no firm obligation to believe the Basic beliefs, but they are what most Muslims do believe.



Muslims have six main beliefs. That virtually all Muslims believe.

Belief in Allah as the one and only God
Belief in angels
Belief in the holy books
Belief in the Prophets...
Belief in the Day of Judgement..
Belief Allah is all Knowing...
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Old 10-21-2014, 09:22 PM
 
1,727 posts, read 1,083,558 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahim4411 View Post
There are thousands of epigraphic evidence and writings of Arabic from the Arabs. Makkah goes back further than 4 century, where are you getting your info?


The Nabataean script is developed from aramic, and has the oldest piece on record, I forget the name. while the sana Qur'an's are from the Makan script ( bad spelling)

Most of these variations emerged from Phoniecian.

There are many scripts, in these development stages.

Islam tried to start history, claiming Clasical Arabic was the first language developed, and invented before man. Just proof of another of Islams lies.

And no, there is nothing in Mecca further back than the 4th century, and evidence of two tribes inhabiting it, the Juriam, and another. If you have proof of anything there please send me a link.

It was Qusayys grandfather who conquered it from the Juriam.
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Old 10-21-2014, 09:39 PM
 
1,727 posts, read 1,083,558 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahim4411 View Post
There are thousands of epigraphic evidence and writings of Arabic from the Arabs. Makkah goes back further than 4 century, where are you getting your info?

And BTW, This information is common knowledge and all over, you can even find it all over the web.

Would you like some links.
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