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Old 10-15-2014, 08:37 AM
 
226 posts, read 123,717 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lippa View Post
And why should I care what the sheikh says?
Well maybe it is true?

Where would the religion be without force?
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Old 10-15-2014, 03:05 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheProcess View Post
Well maybe it is true?

Where would the religion be without force?
I need proof that shows it is true. If there was force, the the lands the the Arabs and Muslims conquered would not have remained mostly non-Muslim for centuries.
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Old 10-15-2014, 06:16 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lippa View Post
I need proof that shows it is true. If there was force, the the lands the the Arabs and Muslims conquered would not have remained mostly non-Muslim for centuries.
Historically, whenever countries conquer another, the three main things they being with are,
their architecture,
their language,
and their religion.

You also need to occupy the country,
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Old 10-15-2014, 06:40 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lippa View Post
I need proof that shows it is true. If there was force, the the lands the the Arabs and Muslims conquered would not have remained mostly non-Muslim for centuries.
Saudi Arabia is a good example, as are a lot of other countries.

His own homemade cures, such as bathing in seven skins of water from seven different wells, didn’t help. But before he died, he managed to make the Middle East an even worse place by ordering the ethnic cleansing of Jews and Christians.


“Two deens (religions) shall not co-exist in the Arabian Peninsula,” Mohammed declared. “If I live, if Allah wills, I will expel the Jews and the Christians from the Arabian Peninsula.”


Bukhari:V1B1N6 "Just issue orders to kill every Jew in the country

This particular verse was written right after muhammeds death, and made by a Persian general, following orders that are still enforced today.
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Old 10-16-2014, 02:34 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lippa View Post
And why should I care what the sheikh says? Amusingly, Westerners seem to think that Muslims have to readily obey the commands and commentaries of any imam. One can easily post an article or video of a scholar disagreeing with the death sentence rule. And no, it is irrelevant if they are the minority.

So then, people are being oppressively killed because of the mainstream teachings of Islam. It's not merely "extremists" that cause a problem. It's just regular normal Islam that creates a problem for the world.
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Old 10-16-2014, 02:40 AM
 
226 posts, read 123,717 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lippa View Post
I need proof that shows it is true. If there was force, the the lands the the Arabs and Muslims conquered would not have remained mostly non-Muslim for centuries.
What? That some people stuck to their religion hardly shows much.

There was "force" in conquering land. There is then "force" in how non-Muslims are then treated as second class citizens.
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Old 10-16-2014, 07:38 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheProcess View Post
What? That some people stuck to their religion hardly shows much.

There was "force" in conquering land. There is then "force" in how non-Muslims are then treated as second class citizens.
What happened to the conquerors?

I nearly every majority Islamic nation the people are still the original indigenous people. No outside ruler. the people living in the Nations accepted Islam.

India has the third largest Muslim population on Earth but it is still Majority non-Muslim with only about 15% of the people in India beieng Muslim. None of which are none-Indian they are Punjab, Bengal etc that accepted Islam.

Indonesia has the largest Muslim Population in the world, Nearly 25% of the Worlds Muslims live in Indonesia but there has never been an invasion by Muslims. Not even any mass migration.
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Old 10-16-2014, 08:58 AM
 
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In most nations the indigenous people still survive, if they adapt to the ruling norm.

In Islamic countries the specific enemies are the jews and Christians, but in many cases they too, are allowed to survive, under Dhimine status..

However it takes a ruling by the powers that be, to protect them, because Allah wants them dead, and when the country suffers an internal takeover, the jews, christians, and other non-believers, are the first to go.
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Old 10-16-2014, 11:06 AM
 
26 posts, read 17,884 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheProcess View Post
So then, people are being oppressively killed because of the mainstream teachings of Islam. It's not merely "extremists" that cause a problem. It's just regular normal Islam that creates a problem for the world.
You haven't convinced me that that is the case. You should know that when it comes to Islam, the importance of providing proof is essential when it comes to showing what is lawful or not. Being the majority doesn't matter; it's how people reason to their conclusion based on the available evidence. And since reason has died long ago in the Muslim world, I honestly don't care what the majority think.
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Old 10-16-2014, 11:19 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheProcess View Post
What? That some people stuck to their religion hardly shows much.

There was "force" in conquering land. There is then "force" in how non-Muslims are then treated as second class citizens.
The fact that Muslims were a significant minority for centuries does indeed prove that Muslims were not interested in forcing people to convert to Islam.

As to conquering the land, the Arabs simply conquered it from the Romans or Persians. But since the latter two were not Muslim, they obviously didn't conquer the Levant and other regions because their religions told them to do so. No, only the Arabs conquered for purely religious reasons. For some reason, when looking at the Muslim world, some Westerners remove their secular lenses and look at things from a sectarian perspective.

As to second class citizens, what was so "second class" about it? Do non Americans enjoy the same rights and benefits that Americans do? If not, why should non-Muslims enjoy the same rights Muslims do? After all, Islam is a fusion of the political and religious- one's passport was his religion in those times.
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