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Old 11-09-2014, 08:27 PM
 
1,727 posts, read 1,085,208 times
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Originally Posted by Woodrow LI
I was not speaking of Atheism as a religion.

My first sentence reads:



Atheism is an ideology.



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Here again, you just will not accept it.

An ideology requires certain things to be an ideology, and to be an atheist is not any of them.

An atheist is a disbelief, not a belief. nothing more, no ideology to it.
No different than not believing in Santa, or unicorns.
There is no ideology behind them.
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Old 11-09-2014, 08:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamsiam View Post
Typical of "Western culture"--religion and philosophy are separated...as they are in this forum (and often in Universities). For Eastern "religions"/Philosophies...this "unnatural" division causes problems because in the East both are the same.
Unnatural you say.

Not hardly.

People needed religion in the past, everything that could not be explained was attributed to the Gods.

People have evolved, and on longer have to depend on magical men in the sky to help them survive.

The sooner the earth is rid of all of these, the sooner we can grow/evolve.
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Old 11-09-2014, 11:08 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamsiam View Post
A better definition of "religion" is---(Wikepedia)

A religion is an organized collection of beliefs, cultural systems, and world views that relate humanity to an order of existence.[note 1] Many religions have narratives, symbols, and sacred histories that are intended to explain the meaning of life and/or to explain the origin of life or the Universe. From their beliefs about the cosmos and human nature, people derive morality, ethics, religious laws or a preferred lifestyle.



The Arabic word "deen" is often translated as "religion" but because English words come from a Western, Christian-centric world view---such translations are inaccurate. A better understanding would encompass "way of life" including the rules of living (law) and ethico-moral principles and philosophy(world-view)
Pointing out something I like about atheism, It takes so little of my time, there are no rituals, no rules, no philosophy, nothing to learn, nothing to discuss.

I can go about life without a doctrine telling me what to do.
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Old 11-10-2014, 08:59 PM
 
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Each to his own...I like the pursuit of knowledge...I find it fascinating.......

We have all been created with varying potentialities....that is what makes us interesting and different from each other.

Those Atheists who do ponder the "meaning of life" and the "origin of the Universe" and various other things have more or less 2 main philosophical themes...humanism and naturalism

humanism = "an outlook or system of thought attaching prime importance to human rather than divine or supernatural matters. Humanist beliefs stress the potential value and goodness of human beings, emphasize common human needs, and seek solely rational ways of solving human problems."

naturalism = "the philosophical belief that everything arises from natural properties and causes, and supernatural or spiritual explanations are excluded or discounted."

These are interesting philosophical views, but I find them inadequate for myself.
What I find inadequate about humanism is "Equality and Justice".
Let us presume that full justice cannot occur without an adequate concept of equality. By "Equality" I mean the concept that all humanity has an equivalent degree of human worth (equivalent value). Humanity is diverse and therefore solutions to human problems (law) can be varied...so which or whose solution does one accept? To accept the "solutions"(law) of one group of people and enforce them even on those who disagree is oppression. Oppression leads to injustice.

In humanism, because there is no Divine, it is upto one group of human beings to establish the foundations of ethico-moral principles that govern Justice and "the way of life". Thus, the biases, agendas, and privileges of that group will become primary over others. (the U.S. is a good example...another is colonialism). On the other hand, in non-Christian theisms, the Divine (not a human group) establishes the foundations of the ethico-moral principles which are then expanded upon by the human intellect and reason into a "way of life" or "law". Equality (equivalent human value) is better served when all participants can agree to the foundational principles. Therefore, a society/nation can have many "ways of life"/"laws" which the participants choose willingly. This means that oppression can be avoided and without oppression, Justice is better served.

Sharia is such a system that is based on Equality (All humanity is of equivalent degree of human worth) and thus expresses Justice more wholistically. Divine law can be used to empower the many where as "human law" can be abused to empower the few.

What I find inadequate about naturalism for myself.
Naturalism posits "natural causes" for "everything"---to put another way---"Nature" is the cause of all causes. This force that is labeled "Nature" IMO, is simply an inadequate substitute for the force that theists understand as "Divine". Such a world-view divides knowledge into segments. The discoveries of each segment of knowledge (Biology, physics, mathematics, philosophy...etc) is attributed to whomever is thought to have "discovered" it. (Galileo, Newton, Darwin...etc)
Such artificial divisions are a disservice to the human intellect and reason. In Islam (and also to a large degree in other Eastern religions) all Knowledge is a single body of revelation from the Divine. (....which is why in many non-Christian religions there is no separation between "religion" and "science") In Islam, all knowledge is from God. Knowledge is a pathway/pointer to the Divine, a way to see/understand "the Force" (God).
Thus, God is the cause of all causes and we "know" this because all knowledge is from the Divine. Thus, the pursuit of (all) knowledge leads to "knowing" the Divine. If we understand the Divine as "One" then a wholistic understanding unites all aspects of knowledge/revelation and this in turn serves to unite humanity.


To put it in Islamic terms...it all comes down to Tawheed(Unity) and Shirk (Division)....?.....
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Old 11-10-2014, 09:12 PM
 
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That made no sense whatsoever.

You are taking a person who does not believe in any of the Gods, and somehow equating that with ignorance, which is quite the opposite.

An atheist, if he choses to explore possibilities of the universe, is not held back by bronze age boundaries.
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Old 11-11-2014, 07:26 PM
 
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some Atheists may simply substitute the concept of "Divine" for another force such as "nature" or "human"......IMO, it is simply changing labels without any fundamental being changed.
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Old 11-11-2014, 07:31 PM
 
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Atheists are different as night and day, and have no set rules to follow as far as belief's go.
it is not their belief's that make them atheists,
It is their common disbelief.

some are UFO nuts
Some feel it is the end.
some believe in an afterlife.
There is no limit
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Old 11-11-2014, 10:10 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,305,624 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim_a49 View Post
Atheists are different as night and day, and have no set rules to follow as far as belief's go.
it is not their belief's that make them atheists,
It is their common disbelief.

some are UFO nuts
Some feel it is the end.
some believe in an afterlife.
There is no limit
I find Muslims to be just as diverse.
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:53 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
I find Muslims to be just as diverse.
I am sure that is so, however muslims do have a set of belief's and rules they are supposed to follow, and a written ideology.

Just because that exists, there will be a higher percentage who follow it.
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:08 PM
 
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Humanism also has written "manifesto" (3 of them!)
Humanist Manifesto - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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