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Old 12-23-2014, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Canada
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Fundamentalist muslim countries and many islamic scholars consider Apostasy as punishable by death in Islam. Even where muslims cannot exercise sharia law, apostates are often threatened with violence after being disowned by their own loved ones.

Woodrow, as a muslim, what is your opinion on Apostasy?
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Old 12-23-2014, 02:38 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sophion View Post
Fundamentalist muslim countries and many islamic scholars consider Apostasy as punishable by death in Islam. Even where muslims cannot exercise sharia law, apostates are often threatened with violence after being disowned by their own loved ones.

Woodrow, as a muslim, what is your opinion on Apostasy?
I believe an Apostate has committed a very serious sin and is risking eternal punishment.

But like most who follow the Hanafi Madhab I do not believe it is a Hadud crime that we have a right to punish a person for. It is an issue between the individual and Allaah(swt) not one we have the right to punish a person for.
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Old 12-23-2014, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Canada
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^ good to hear that, woodrow.
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:57 PM
 
Location: Dangling from a mooses antlers
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
I believe an Apostate has committed a very serious sin and is risking eternal punishment.

But like most who follow the Hanafi Madhab I do not believe it is a Hadud crime that we have a right to punish a person for. It is an issue between the individual and Allaah(swt) not one we have the right to punish a person for.
That may be your belief but it's not in line with what most muslims in the middle east believe. I think at some point you have to be honest with yourself and admit that you live in a glass bubble. Muslims in the true Islamic countries behead and hang apostates every single day of the year. Maybe you can go over there and give them a piece of your mind. In these current times your religion is the most violent that our world knows. Defintely not a religion of peace.
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Old 12-23-2014, 11:51 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Originally Posted by stiffnecked View Post
That may be your belief but it's not in line with what most muslims in the middle east believe. I think at some point you have to be honest with yourself and admit that you live in a glass bubble. Muslims in the true Islamic countries behead and hang apostates every single day of the year. Maybe you can go over there and give them a piece of your mind. In these current times your religion is the most violent that our world knows. Defintely not a religion of peace.
While nearly all reported executions for apostasy have been in Saudi, Iraq and Pakistan they are not common and usually contain other reasons.

Contrary to popular belief Iran has never executed a person for Apostasy, although they have threatened to many times.

While there are very many stories of Apostates being executed. It is almost impossible to find verification of such. I can only find the names of 7 people known by name and verified to have been executed for apostasy worldwide. At least 2 of them were Christians that were executed for leaving Christianity
LINK

Apostates are known to have been murdered in Pakistan and Iraq by family members but not by law.

In the 4 madhabs of Sharia apostasy is not a capital offense unless it results in treason or another capital crime.

there are Christian Missionaries in every Islamic Nation, converting Muslims. But I have not heard of any mass arrests or executions of apostates

While the Mideast has the worse reputation for apostate they are only about 25% of the world's Muslims

In Indonesia the world's largest Muslim nation, the sternest action I have heard of is a woman apostate has been forbidden to change her state ID to Christian.
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Old 12-27-2014, 07:06 AM
 
Location: quiet place
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Never heard about in Saudi Arabia, there are many atheists or apostates though never been killed. I want to make it clear, there is huge difference when you insult the religon or the prophet and when you choose to be apostate calmly. Liberal Saudi network is very famous page on www. I by here do not showing any tolerance or liking to Atheism. Doesn't mean to aim my gun to one of them
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Old 12-27-2014, 09:48 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
While nearly all reported executions for apostasy have been in Saudi, Iraq and Pakistan they are not common and usually contain other reasons.

Contrary to popular belief Iran has never executed a person for Apostasy, although they have threatened to many times.

While there are very many stories of Apostates being executed. It is almost impossible to find verification of such. I can only find the names of 7 people known by name and verified to have been executed for apostasy worldwide. At least 2 of them were Christians that were executed for leaving Christianity
LINK

Apostates are known to have been murdered in Pakistan and Iraq by family members but not by law.

In the 4 madhabs of Sharia apostasy is not a capital offense unless it results in treason or another capital crime.

there are Christian Missionaries in every Islamic Nation, converting Muslims. But I have not heard of any mass arrests or executions of apostates

While the Mideast has the worse reputation for apostate they are only about 25% of the world's Muslims

In Indonesia the world's largest Muslim nation, the sternest action I have heard of is a woman apostate has been forbidden to change her state ID to Christian.
Looking at your link, LI, the Christians executed seemed to be in antiquity.

While executions for apostasy from Islam do not seem common (nor do the stonings, beating and killings of women for the crime of being raped, but -from what you say - they have been reported and are utter condemnation of a religion - if it does not of itself condemn such acts) they happen. They may happen in countries that may be regarded as less liberal about Islamic practices, but, they happen, they happen in contemporary countries and, again, if Islam does not condemn them, then it is as good a reason to have feelings of revulsion just as we should for the cover -up of Child abuse by Vatican (and I'll risk a years' pay it is still being covered up) and indeed human rights abuses in undemocratic regimes which have an atheist dogma.
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Old 12-27-2014, 01:41 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Originally Posted by AREQUIPA View Post
Looking at your link, LI, the Christians executed seemed to be in antiquity.

While executions for apostasy from Islam do not seem common (nor do the stonings, beating and killings of women for the crime of being raped, but -from what you say - they have been reported and are utter condemnation of a religion - if it does not of itself condemn such acts) they happen. They may happen in countries that may be regarded as less liberal about Islamic practices, but, they happen, they happen in contemporary countries and, again, if Islam does not condemn them, then it is as good a reason to have feelings of revulsion just as we should for the cover -up of Child abuse by Vatican (and I'll risk a years' pay it is still being covered up) and indeed human rights abuses in undemocratic regimes which have an atheist dogma.
Here is what many people do not understand.

if Islam does not condemn them

There is no spoke person for Islam. There is no hierarchy of authority, no Muslim has religious authority over another Muslim. there is no ordained clergy, there is no central figure that sets down the rules. We each answer only to Allaah(swt) and it is our responsibility to use the Qur'and Sunnah as guides.
We each can say that an action is not Islamic and give reasons why we believe so, but it is up to the individual to agree or disagree.

When we speak out against what we perceive as atrocities and Misuse of Islam we each speak only for our self.
Now world wide many of us do speak our opinions and do protest what we believe are abuses. But it is rare to get any attention for doing so.
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Old 12-28-2014, 08:14 AM
 
7,378 posts, read 6,734,207 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Here is what many people do not understand.

if Islam does not condemn them

There is no spoke person for Islam. There is no hierarchy of authority, no Muslim has religious authority over another Muslim. there is no ordained clergy, there is no central figure that sets down the rules. We each answer only to Allaah(swt) and it is our responsibility to use the Qur'and Sunnah as guides.
We each can say that an action is not Islamic and give reasons why we believe so, but it is up to the individual to agree or disagree.

When we speak out against what we perceive as atrocities and Misuse of Islam we each speak only for our self.
Now world wide many of us do speak our opinions and do protest what we believe are abuses. But it is rare to get any attention for doing so.
I'm curious, how have you, or anyone you've known, protested against these abuses? I'd like to know what we can do to attract attention to these protests.
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Old 12-28-2014, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,291,704 times
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Originally Posted by Amaznjohn View Post
I'm curious, how have you, or anyone you've known, protested against these abuses? I'd like to know what we can do to attract attention to these protests.
For starters see these links:

Muslims in Europe rally against extremist violence - CBS News

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-0...t-against-isis

Muslims against terrorism and extremism | Free Muslims Coalition

Anti-Terror Muslims Rally in Toronto Against Radical Islam - Breitbart

Muslims rally against radical Islam - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk

American Muslims Speak Out Against Radical Islam, Support NYPD - Forbes

Mainstream Muslims Speak Out Against Radicals

Muslims issue manifesto against radical Islam

Norwegian Muslims hold demonstration against radical Islamic militants | Fox News
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