What happens when Muslims try to protest against terrorists
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"In the last five years I have personally visited over 250 Islamic Centers, Mosques, and Islamic Schools throughout America. The goal of my research has been to determine what Islamic leaders are teaching the young and innocent Muslim children. The findings are abhorrent, sad, unbelievable, frightening, and most disturbing is the fact our government is keeping this dangerous fact from the American people. Muslim children attending mosques and Islamic schools are being taught to hate America, our government, our military personnel, and its non Muslim population. In this article I will identify three significant mosques in America that are leading the way in teaching Muslim children to hate and to influence them to commit violent acts inside our country."
Canada: Toronto Islamic School Caught Teaching Anti-Semitic Material Will Not Face Criminal Charges
The Algemeiner – “A Toronto Islamic school whose teaching materials disparaged Jews and encouraged boys to keep fit for jihad will not face criminal charges but police did issue a warning and said they had identified passages in school materials that were of concern."
'Hate literature easily found at UK mosques'
Extremist literature that encourages hatred of gays, Christians and Jews can be easily found at many of Britain's mosques, according to a new survey.
Preachers of hate who spread their violent word on British TV channels
Muslim fundamentalists have used British television channels to preach in favour of violent crime and killing “apostates”.
"The unquestionably radical nature of the Islamic Society of Boston mosque and its counterpart the Islamic Society of Boston Cultural Center (called “small one” and “big one” by locals) illustrates the worst of Islamist subversion. Whether the Tsarnaev brothers attended to the degree that the mosque was a key part of their radicalization is unknown, but it could not have been a mitigating influence in their conversion to terrorism. The pedigree of convicted terrorists that have emerged from IBS/IBSCC incubation, the close Muslim Brotherhood connections, the terror group ties, and the criminal convictions of leadership figures lead one to wonder how much more radical activism still seethes within this mosque community."
"ACCORDING TO the Muslim, Muhammad Hisham Kabbani, who testified before the U.S. State Department, 80 percent of mosques in America preach "extremist ideology."
Coming from an entirely different source, the Mapping Sharia Project sent trained people into mosques in the U.S. to find out how many of them are calling for jihad against America. They discovered that the majority of the mosques they've investigated so far do, in fact, promote jihad against America, in the Friday "sermons" (known as "khutbah") and in the literature available at the mosques.
In a speech by Mark Steyn, he said (when answering a question) Canadian Mounties did a survey of Canadian imams. It found 85 percent of the imams in Canadian mosques were "hardcore radical jihadists."
How many Mosques were visited? In the USA there are about 2300 Mosques but less than 700 Imams. What mosques are Kabbani speaking of?
while figures are hard to find, many US Imams are NOI and often they do not have a Mosque, but preach in the Prisons.
Kabaani is an extremist Sufi whom would love nothing more than to put down mainstream Sunni Islam as well as Salafis and Shias. He's hardly an unbias source.
But when the original poster of such information learns his Islam from people like Sam Shammoun, it's hardly surprising that he wouldn't know the historical background of Kabanni.
"many US Imams are NOI and often they do not have a Mosque, but preach in the Prisons."
Yes, I know.
U.S. Prisons Churning Out Thousands Of Radicalized Inmates
Back in 2006, then FBI director Robert Mueller prophetically described the radical Islamist conversion machine operating throughout U.S. prisons, to a Senate committee. He said that prisons were a “fertile ground” for Islamic extremists, and that they targeted inmates for introduction to the militant Wahhabi and Salafist strains of Islam.
The recent so-called “lone wolf” terrorist attacks in Oklahoma City, New York, and just over our northern border in the Canadian capital of Ottawa, may be the product of such radicalization.
In April 2010, Larry James murdered his mother, pregnant wife, 7-month-old son, 3-year-old niece and 16-year-old niece for refusing to convert to Islam. James converted in 2007, while in a U.S. prison.
Then two months ago Colleen Hufford, a 54-year-old grandmother and factory worker in Oklahoma, was beheaded with a produce knife by Alton Nolen who likely converted to Islam in a U.S. prison. Nolen is being charged with workplace violence.
Last month NYPD officer Kenneth Healey, 25, was axed to death with a hatchet to the side of the head. He was not attacked by a “lone wolf,” but by ex-con Zale Thompson. New York City Police Commissioner William Bratton has called it a terrorist attack, and the NYPD might want to look at Thompson’s record in California where he did two brief terms in California prisons.
The statistics are staggering, and woefully out of date. One out of three African-American inmates in U.S. prisons convert to Islam while incarcerated.
...15 percent of the total U.S. prison population or 350,000 inmates are Muslim."
Note: 0.9% of the USA population were Muslims in 2010 according to Wikipedia.
America’s Academies for Jihad A radical imam threatened me with death—and was later hired to preach in U.S. prisons. I was surprised, but I shouldn’t have been.
Prisons are breeding grounds for jihadists
Prisons have become recruitment and training centers for future jihadists. It is an escalating crisis that is taking a toll, as Americans are murdered by those who convert to Islam in prison.
The rising influence of Islam in our prisons is due to a disproportionately high number of Muslims who are incarcerated, skyrocketing conversion rates, powerful Muslim gangs, the proliferation of Muslim chaplains, an uninformed prison power structure, and the outside influence of Islamic terror organizations.
One in three black inmates converts to Islam in prison
The key to conversion success is clear. Our government has been contracting and paying Muslim Brotherhood front groups, such as GSISS (The Graduate School of Islamic and Social Sciences) and ISNA (Islamic Society of North America) to screen and assign Muslim prison chaplains for at least 8 years.
While Egypt and Saudi Arabia have banned the Muslim Brotherhood, classifying it as a terror group, the White House, U.S. prisons, and the Departments of Justice and Homeland Security continue to work with Muslim Brotherhood groups.
For example, Paul Pitts served 14 years in prison for murder, where he converted to Islam and became Imam Abdu-Shahid. He was paroled in 2001 and hired as a prison chaplain in 2007 with an annual salary of $49,471. In Feb 2010, he was caught trying to bring scissors and razor blades into the Manhattan Detention Complex.
A New York City corrections department source told the New York Post: “It’s a disgrace that taxpayers are funding Muslim chaplains who not only have criminal records, but also are promoting violence.”
"many US Imams are NOI and often they do not have a Mosque, but preach in the Prisons."
Yes, I know.
U.S. Prisons Churning Out Thousands Of Radicalized Inmates
Back in 2006, then FBI director Robert Mueller prophetically described the radical Islamist conversion machine operating throughout U.S. prisons, to a Senate committee. He said that prisons were a “fertile ground” for Islamic extremists, and that they targeted inmates for introduction to the militant Wahhabi and Salafist strains of Islam.
The recent so-called “lone wolf” terrorist attacks in Oklahoma City, New York, and just over our northern border in the Canadian capital of Ottawa, may be the product of such radicalization.
In April 2010, Larry James murdered his mother, pregnant wife, 7-month-old son, 3-year-old niece and 16-year-old niece for refusing to convert to Islam. James converted in 2007, while in a U.S. prison.
Then two months ago Colleen Hufford, a 54-year-old grandmother and factory worker in Oklahoma, was beheaded with a produce knife by Alton Nolen who likely converted to Islam in a U.S. prison. Nolen is being charged with workplace violence.
Last month NYPD officer Kenneth Healey, 25, was axed to death with a hatchet to the side of the head. He was not attacked by a “lone wolf,” but by ex-con Zale Thompson. New York City Police Commissioner William Bratton has called it a terrorist attack, and the NYPD might want to look at Thompson’s record in California where he did two brief terms in California prisons.
The statistics are staggering, and woefully out of date. One out of three African-American inmates in U.S. prisons convert to Islam while incarcerated.
...15 percent of the total U.S. prison population or 350,000 inmates are Muslim."
Note: 0.9% of the USA population were Muslims in 2010 according to Wikipedia.
America’s Academies for Jihad A radical imam threatened me with death—and was later hired to preach in U.S. prisons. I was surprised, but I shouldn’t have been.
Prisons are breeding grounds for jihadists
Prisons have become recruitment and training centers for future jihadists. It is an escalating crisis that is taking a toll, as Americans are murdered by those who convert to Islam in prison.
The rising influence of Islam in our prisons is due to a disproportionately high number of Muslims who are incarcerated, skyrocketing conversion rates, powerful Muslim gangs, the proliferation of Muslim chaplains, an uninformed prison power structure, and the outside influence of Islamic terror organizations.
One in three black inmates converts to Islam in prison
The key to conversion success is clear. Our government has been contracting and paying Muslim Brotherhood front groups, such as GSISS (The Graduate School of Islamic and Social Sciences) and ISNA (Islamic Society of North America) to screen and assign Muslim prison chaplains for at least 8 years.
While Egypt and Saudi Arabia have banned the Muslim Brotherhood, classifying it as a terror group, the White House, U.S. prisons, and the Departments of Justice and Homeland Security continue to work with Muslim Brotherhood groups.
For example, Paul Pitts served 14 years in prison for murder, where he converted to Islam and became Imam Abdu-Shahid. He was paroled in 2001 and hired as a prison chaplain in 2007 with an annual salary of $49,471. In Feb 2010, he was caught trying to bring scissors and razor blades into the Manhattan Detention Complex.
A New York City corrections department source told the New York Post: “It’s a disgrace that taxpayers are funding Muslim chaplains who not only have criminal records, but also are promoting violence.”
The NOI are the ones with the prison ministry. Up until recently it was required to be African American to join them. They do have membership requirements. They call them self Muslims and are what many American's believe are Muslims.
They are a bit different. They believe Muhammad(saws) was replaced by Elijah Muhammad in the 1930s and the current Prophet is Louis Farrakhan The do have Scriptures that sort of replace the Qur'an
"They call them self Muslims and are what many American's believe are Muslims.
They are a bit different."
"Every person who states they are a Muslim is accepted as being a Muslim, we might disagree fully with their interpretation of Islam and how they practice Islam. "
" It is impossible for any person to prove he/she is Muslim---That is a personal commitment between each person and Allaah"
??
Anyways, I have proved that Islamic terrorism is being taught in both mosques and in prisons in the USA.
The NOI are the ones with the prison ministry. Up until recently it was required to be African American to join them. They do have membership requirements. They call them self Muslims and are what many American's believe are Muslims.
They are a bit different. They believe Muhammad(saws) was replaced by Elijah Muhammad in the 1930s and the current Prophet is Louis Farrakhan The do have Scriptures that sort of replace the Qur'an
Though important, the most critical issue is not whether they are NOI, Salafi, Sunni, Shia or others.
The MOST critical issue is the existence of SOME evil-laden verses in the holy texts and evil elements within the ethos that catalyze the evil prone Muslims in whatever group they belong to.
Therefore there are two critical elements [note weightages in %] we need to deal with, i.e.
1. Evil laden elements in the holy texts and ethos of the religion -80%
2. Evil prone people amongst the believers. - 20%
The problem is most Muslims and apologists deny [1.] exists when it is a fact it does.
When the majority of Muslims and the apologists recognize [1.] exists as a fact and the inherent nature of humans to be religious, then it will facilitate the resolution of all Islamic-related evils committed around the world.
Note Buddhism for example [other Eastern religions are similar],
because there are no* evil laden elements in their holy texts, there are no Buddhism-related evils and violence around the world. There is no opportunity any Buddhist to commit evil and violence by quoting any verses from the holy texts of Buddhism. Since the Buddha's life example are non-martial nor violence, no believers can refer to any evil examples from the life of the Buddha.
I don't deny there are Buddhists-related violence but that has nothing to do with Buddhism per se rather it is the evil in the human nature of those Buddhists as humans.
Therefore when we recognize the evil elements in any religious texts, i.e. [1.] above and deal with it, we will be able to resolve most of the religion-related evils and violence.
Though important, the most critical issue is not whether they are NOI, Salafi, Sunni, Shia or others.
The MOST critical issue is the existence of SOME evil-laden verses in the holy texts and evil elements within the ethos that catalyze the evil prone Muslims in whatever group they belong to.
Therefore there are two critical elements [note weightages in %] we need to deal with, i.e.
1. Evil laden elements in the holy texts and ethos of the religion -80%
2. Evil prone people amongst the believers. - 20%
The problem is most Muslims and apologists deny [1.] exists when it is a fact it does.
When the majority of Muslims and the apologists recognize [1.] exists as a fact and the inherent nature of humans to be religious, then it will facilitate the resolution of all Islamic-related evils committed around the world.
Note Buddhism for example [other Eastern religions are similar],
because there are no* evil laden elements in their holy texts, there are no Buddhism-related evils and violence around the world. There is no opportunity any Buddhist to commit evil and violence by quoting any verses from the holy texts of Buddhism. Since the Buddha's life example are non-martial nor violence, no believers can refer to any evil examples from the life of the Buddha.
I don't deny there are Buddhists-related violence but that has nothing to do with Buddhism per se rather it is the evil in the human nature of those Buddhists as humans.
Therefore when we recognize the evil elements in any religious texts, i.e. [1.] above and deal with it, we will be able to resolve most of the religion-related evils and violence.
Yes I did say that all who call them self Muslim are considered Muslim unless they say different or continuously deleberatly refuse to do any of the 5 Pillars. the NOI do not do the First Pillar as they do not believe Muhammad(saws) is the final Prophet.
How come there are no Baha'i terrorists. They also use the Qur'an and believe Muhammad(saws) is a true Prophet. They retain a very large level of Shi'ism that they derived from.
The Bahai religion: past and present
Historical and Religious Context
As Christianity was born out of Judaism and Buddhism grew out of Hinduism, the Bahá'í Faith has its roots in Shi'ite Islam. A major doctrine of "Twelver" Shi'ite Islam is the expected return of the 12th imam (successor of Muhammad), who will renew religion and guide the faithful.
Yes I did say that all who call them self Muslim are considered Muslim unless they say different or continuously deleberatly refuse to do any of the 5 Pillars. the NOI do not do the First Pillar as they do not believe Muhammad(saws) is the final Prophet.
Whether you like or not, the NOI claimed themselves to be 'Muslims' thus is in 'brotherhood' with other Muslims in general. However as I mentioned in the above, the elements and question of 'Muslim' is only 20%.
What is critical is the Quran and its holy texts which the NOI would have subscribed to fully.
Because the Quran and its holy texts has evil laden verses, these catalyze the so-called Muslims to commit evil. Thus the Quran and its holy texts are the direct cause, regardless of what the NOI called themselves and the recognition of their last prophet.
Note the analysis is from top-down, i.e. actual evidence of evils and violence being traced to their roots, i.e. the Quran and the related texts.
Quote:
How come there are no Baha'i terrorists. They also use the Qur'an and believe Muhammad(saws) is a true Prophet. They retain a very large level of Shi'ism that they derived from.
The Bahai religion: past and present
Historical and Religious Context
As Christianity was born out of Judaism and Buddhism grew out of Hinduism, the Bahá'í Faith has its roots in Shi'ite Islam. A major doctrine of "Twelver" Shi'ite Islam is the expected return of the 12th imam (successor of Muhammad), who will renew religion and guide the faithful.
The critical analysis is we start from real evidences to the root causes.
There are real evidence of evils and violence committed by Muslims and the effective approach is to trace these violence to the root causes. In the case of real violence by Muslims, we can trace its root causes to the Quran [in part], the hadiths, the Sira, other texts, the clergy, the ethos of Islam.
There are no evidence of much and obvious violence from the Bahais. Since there are no cases of violence there is no basis to trace it to its roots causes. E.g. no murder = no murderer to be hunted.
It is reasonable to be suspicious of Baha'i and their followers since they do trace their roots to Islam quite significantly. Upon further research, one will note the Bahais do not rely exclusively or significantly on the Quran but merely extract selectively the positives from Islam and other religions.
Bahai is a new religion and merely used the Quran as a reference for anything that is positive therein. The Bahai faith has its own main holy texts, i.e. the Kitáb-i-Aqdas.
Note the distinct difference between Baha'i and Islam;
1.Bahai is a religion having origins from Islam and Islam has its roots from Christianity.
2.The followers of Islam are known as Muslims and the followers of Bahai are called as Bahais.
3.The holy book of Muslims is the Quran and that of Bahais is the Kitáb-i-Aqdas.
4.Bahai is a combination of religion and science while Islam is purely a religion based on the teachings of the Prophet.
5.The main principles of Islam are based on the Quran and teachings of the Prophet. Bahai has a more scientific and modern approach and focuses on issues like equality of the genders, world peace, adoring one God, and combining science and religion.
6.A Bahai is supposed to learn the scriptures of the religion as well as that of other religions. Muslims are not supposed to learn about other religions.
It is the same for the Ahamadiyahs.
There are no notable violence and evils from the Ahamadiyyahs.
As such there is no basis to investigate them in relation to violence.
There are violence and evils from Buddhists in Myanmar, Sri Lanka, Tibet and elsewhere.
Therefore we should investigate and find the root causes.
The result is it has nothing to do with Buddhism and its holy text but rather it is due to the evil nature of some believers as human beings and ethnic tensions.
It is so glaring there are notable and terrible evils and violence by some Muslims.
The root causes [80% weightage] are the SOME-evil-elements from the Quran, hadiths, Sira, other texts, clergy, and the general martial ethos of Islam via Muhammad's life examples.
Therefore it is only logical and rational that we must deal with these root causes if we are to resolve the related evils and violence.
It is critical that all Muslims recognize, understand and acknowledge the fact of those root causes.
Whether you like or not, the NOI claimed themselves to be 'Muslims' thus is in 'brotherhood' with other Muslims in general. However as I mentioned in the above, the elements and question of 'Muslim' is only 20%.
What is critical is the Quran and its holy texts which the NOI would have subscribed to fully.
Because the Quran and its holy texts has evil laden verses, these catalyze the so-called Muslims to commit evil. Thus the Quran and its holy texts are the direct cause, regardless of what the NOI called themselves and the recognition of their last prophet.
Note the analysis is from top-down, i.e. actual evidence of evils and violence being traced to their roots, i.e. the Quran and the related texts.
The critical analysis is we start from real evidences to the root causes.
There are real evidence of evils and violence committed by Muslims and the effective approach is to trace these violence to the root causes. In the case of real violence by Muslims, we can trace its root causes to the Quran [in part], the hadiths, the Sira, other texts, the clergy, the ethos of Islam.
There are no evidence of much and obvious violence from the Bahais. Since there are no cases of violence there is no basis to trace it to its roots causes. E.g. no murder = no murderer to be hunted.
It is reasonable to be suspicious of Baha'i and their followers since they do trace their roots to Islam quite significantly. Upon further research, one will note the Bahais do not rely exclusively or significantly on the Quran but merely extract selectively the positives from Islam and other religions.
Bahai is a new religion and merely used the Quran as a reference for anything that is positive therein. The Bahai faith has its own main holy texts, i.e. the Kitáb-i-Aqdas.
Note the distinct difference between Baha'i and Islam;
1.Bahai is a religion having origins from Islam and Islam has its roots from Christianity.
2.The followers of Islam are known as Muslims and the followers of Bahai are called as Bahais.
3.The holy book of Muslims is the Quran and that of Bahais is the Kitáb-i-Aqdas.
4.Bahai is a combination of religion and science while Islam is purely a religion based on the teachings of the Prophet.
5.The main principles of Islam are based on the Quran and teachings of the Prophet. Bahai has a more scientific and modern approach and focuses on issues like equality of the genders, world peace, adoring one God, and combining science and religion.
6.A Bahai is supposed to learn the scriptures of the religion as well as that of other religions. Muslims are not supposed to learn about other religions.
It is the same for the Ahamadiyahs.
There are no notable violence and evils from the Ahamadiyyahs.
As such there is no basis to investigate them in relation to violence.
There are violence and evils from Buddhists in Myanmar, Sri Lanka, Tibet and elsewhere.
Therefore we should investigate and find the root causes.
The result is it has nothing to do with Buddhism and its holy text but rather it is due to the evil nature of some believers as human beings and ethnic tensions.
It is so glaring there are notable and terrible evils and violence by some Muslims.
The root causes [80% weightage] are the SOME-evil-elements from the Quran, hadiths, Sira, other texts, clergy, and the general martial ethos of Islam via Muhammad's life examples.
Therefore it is only logical and rational that we must deal with these root causes if we are to resolve the related evils and violence.
It is critical that all Muslims recognize, understand and acknowledge the fact of those root causes.
Question: Does the rate of violence among Muslims actually differ from the rate for other groups?
Any large city in the USA seems to have a very high rate of Violence,. The drug Cartels in Mexico seem to be giving ISIS a run for it's money. The number of Beheadings in Mexico by the drug cartels has exceeded ISIS. North Korea with no religious influence has done a bit of violence.
If Islam were to disappear I doubt there would be any reduction in world violence.
When you look at the violent death rate by Nation Most of the Islamic nations show a lower rate than the USA
Question: Does the rate of violence among Muslims actually differ from the rate for other groups?
Any large city in the USA seems to have a very high rate of Violence,. The drug Cartels in Mexico seem to be giving ISIS a run for it's money. The number of Beheadings in Mexico by the drug cartels has exceeded ISIS. North Korea with no religious influence has done a bit of violence.
If Islam were to disappear I doubt there would be any reduction in world violence.
When you look at the violent death rate by Nation Most of the Islamic nations show a lower rate than the USA
This fallacy is very frequently paired with the guilt by association fallacy, so that the person engaging in the fallacy need not even show that the other person's actions are inconsistent with their position; rather, it is merely shown that the actions of some other person somehow associated with that person did something inconsistent with that person's position. For instance, if someone criticizes Bill Clinton for his dishonesty, the common rejoinder is to bring up Bush's dishonesty.
Similarly, when Islam is criticized for its evil and violence you have this tendency to bring in 'what about others.'
This deflection does not serves any strength for your argument but reflect badly upon your intellectual competence and integrity due to desperation. I know you have at least average intellectual competence, but drowning in a religion [faith = belief without reason nor proofs] forces and drag one's intellectual integrity down.
When resorting to such a fallacy, it actually reinforces the opponent's point. You are readily admitting Islam does promote evil and violence [which is a fact any way] but you are trying to point out it is lesser than others.
If you want to compare Islamic-related evil and violence with those of the secular, I believe Islam pose a much greater threat to humanity from hereon towards the future and could even cause humanity to be extinct prematurely. This has to be done on another thread.
In the meantime, this topic is related to Islam re the OP within the 'Islam' section of this site.
Therefore we should stick to topic and not deflect away from it.
Point is, there is a critical correlation between Muslim terrorists and the religion [in part] itself.
Thus:
It is so glaring there are notable and terrible evils and violence by some Muslims.
The root causes [80% weightage] are the SOME-evil-elements from the Quran, hadiths, Sira, other texts, clergy, and the general martial ethos of Islam via Muhammad's life examples.
Therefore it is only logical and rational that we must deal with these root causes if we are to resolve the related evils and violence.
It is critical that all Muslims recognize, understand and acknowledge the fact of those root causes.
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