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Old 09-01-2015, 03:22 PM
 
144 posts, read 107,103 times
Reputation: 90

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Quote:
Originally Posted by juju33312 View Post
"suicide is FORBIDDEN in Islam."

Let's take a look at something first, because this is a HUGE lie that Muslims tell.

You give us
5.32 (...) whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.

But what is that (...) leaving out? Let's see:

5:32 Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors.

This is not an order to Muslims. Don't pull this again.
Of course it is, as there's many other laws : like not eating pig, eating halal (like kosher), the law of retaliation etc
Everybody know that we have some similar laws.
And don't give me order, i'll put that again and again.

By the way the law was given to the Children of Israel because of the children of Adam.
And the children of Adam were not jews. Humanity in the Quran is called "Children of Adam", so this law is a law not only for the jews.

5.27 And recite to them the story of Adam's two sons, in truth, when they both offered a sacrifice [to Allah ], and it was accepted from one of them but was not accepted from the other.

And then you have the verse "5:32 Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land " (...)


Quote:
Originally Posted by juju33312 View Post
The point of the bomber/shooter/Muslim that flies planes into buildings isn't suicide - it is to kill infidels in battle. This is not just permitted by Muhammad/Allah, but encouraged with everlasting orgies. If a Muslim refuses to go on such a battle, eternal hell and torture awaits.
A suicide : someone who decide the place, the hour of his death
This is not permitted in Islam because only God decides that. You can go in a battle and come back with injuries or not, but you don't know if you'll die. Even if the person wanted to be a marthyr, he can't decide that himself, it's God who choose who will be a marthyr.

You are twisting the Words of God like those extremists because it would please you that much that they are right and are the "real muslims doing exactly what the Quran and Muhammad said" then you can call Islam "evil".
This is just not honnest at all, but if it pleases you to believe that, it's your problem.

You can say what you want but the verses condamning suicide are there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by juju33312 View Post
Quran (9:38-39) - "O ye who believe! what is the matter with you, that, when ye are asked to go forth in the cause of Allah, ye cling heavily to the earth? Do ye prefer the life of this world to the Hereafter? But little is the comfort of this life, as compared with the Hereafter. Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place." This is a warning to those who refuse to fight and be killed for allah, that they will be punished with Hell.

Quran (9:111) - "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Quran: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme."

Quran (48:17) - "There is no blame for the blind, nor is there blame for the lame, nor is there blame for the sick (that they go not forth to war). And whoso obeyeth Allah and His messenger, He will make him enter Gardens underneath which rivers flow; and whoso turneth back, him will He punish with a painful doom."

Quran (61:4) - "Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way"

Quran (61:10-12) - "O You who believe! Shall I guide you to a commerce that will save you from a painful torment. That you believe in Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad ), and that you strive hard and fight in the Cause of Allah with your wealth and your lives, that will be better for you, if you but know! (If you do so) He will forgive you your sins, and admit you into Gardens under which rivers flow, and pleasant dwelling in Gardens of 'Adn - Eternity ['Adn (Edn) Paradise], that is indeed the great success." .
All that was in time of war. Put all this in context.

Do you see Turkey, the Emirates, Indonesia or Morroco attacking a non muslim country ?
We are a lot of muslim countries but i haven't see that. On the contrary i see foreign armies in muslim soils : Afghanistan, Irak ... i've seen a lot of colonialism in muslim countries too.
Since when a muslim country attacked (or made jihad if you prefer) against a non muslim country ?

Or maybe you'll say we are not good muslims because we didn't kill all the non-muslim.
And ISIS and Al Qaida are, so we should do like them or we should abandon Islam because we are not "real muslims".
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Old 09-01-2015, 03:55 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,272,269 times
Reputation: 7407
Quote:
Originally Posted by juju33312 View Post
"suicide is FORBIDDEN in Islam."

Let's take a look at something first, because this is a HUGE lie that Muslims tell.

You give us
5.32 (...) whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.

But what is that (...) leaving out? Let's see:

5:32 Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors.

This is not an order to Muslims. Don't pull this again.

"suicide is FORBIDDEN in Islam."

The point of the bomber/shooter/Muslim that flies planes into buildings isn't suicide - it is to kill infidels in battle. This is not just permitted by Muhammad/Allah, but encouraged with everlasting orgies. If a Muslim refuses to go on such a battle, eternal hell and torture awaits.

Quran (9:38-39) - "O ye who believe! what is the matter with you, that, when ye are asked to go forth in the cause of Allah, ye cling heavily to the earth? Do ye prefer the life of this world to the Hereafter? But little is the comfort of this life, as compared with the Hereafter. Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place." This is a warning to those who refuse to fight and be killed for allah, that they will be punished with Hell.

Quran (9:111) - "Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Quran: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme."

Quran (48:17) - "There is no blame for the blind, nor is there blame for the lame, nor is there blame for the sick (that they go not forth to war). And whoso obeyeth Allah and His messenger, He will make him enter Gardens underneath which rivers flow; and whoso turneth back, him will He punish with a painful doom."

Quran (61:4) - "Surely Allah loves those who fight in His way"

Quran (61:10-12) - "O You who believe! Shall I guide you to a commerce that will save you from a painful torment. That you believe in Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad ), and that you strive hard and fight in the Cause of Allah with your wealth and your lives, that will be better for you, if you but know! (If you do so) He will forgive you your sins, and admit you into Gardens under which rivers flow, and pleasant dwelling in Gardens of 'Adn - Eternity ['Adn (Edn) Paradise], that is indeed the great success." .

Muslim (20:4696) - "the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: 'One who died but did not fight in the way of Allah nor did he express any desire (or determination) for Jihad died the death of a hypocrite.'

Bukhari 1:35 "The person who participates in (Holy Battles) in Allah’s cause and nothing compels him do so except belief in Allah and His Apostle, will be recompensed by Allah either with a reward, or booty ( if he survives) or will be admitted to Paradise ( if he is killed)."

Back then there were no suicide bombs, or planes, but there were suicide missions.

Quran-3:169-: Think not of those who are slain in Allah's way as dead. Nay, they live, finding their sustenance in the presence of their Lord;
Quote:
5:32 Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors.

This is not an order to Muslims. Don't pull this again.
We do recognize the Torah as being Holy Scripture and the commands given to the Jews applicable to all people.

Quote:
Back then there were no suicide bombs, or planes, but there were suicide missions.
to listen to some people one would believe Muslims are constantly flying planes into buildings.

How many planes have Muslims flown into buildings? This is not a egular practice of Muslims. It was a single attack carried out by 19 individuals on one day and involved 4 planes.

Deliberately Flying planes into buildings has occured several times, the majority of the time by non-Muslims

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_by_pilot

Sept 11, 2001 is the only instance of Muslims crashing planes into buildings.

Jihad does not relate to just physical fighting. My Jihad is to never deny being Muslim no matter what the threats against me are. Living in the US there is always a possibility a person will be killed simply because they are Muslims.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/12/us...lina.html?_r=0

Another Muslim Is Killed Is America. Anyone Care? - The Daily Beast

Texas Muslims fear for safety after Iraqi man shot dead in Dallas attack | US news | The Guardian

York

Anti-Islamic flyers found scattered in Revere | Local News - WCVB Home

Central African Republic: More than 50 Muslims killed in two attacks | Amnesty International USA

Even Sikhs are Murdered because people believe thy are Muslims.

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-h...staken-muslims

Making use of Continuums Bell Curve 20% of people have the potential for violence.

5.5 Billion billion people are not Muslim and have varying degress of anti-Muslim sentiments. If 20% of them have the potential for violence that means there 1,100,000,000 Potential anti-muslim terrorists. How many of them might be pushed, into acting out their violence, by viewing Media articles that call for the killing of Muslims?

Howmany of the 20% of the 5.5 non-Muslims can be enticed to commit violence against Muslims after seeing these levels of hatred being popularized in the world's media?

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Anti-...04201582969970

Anti-Muslim | Right Wing Watch

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.1461566

Neo-Nazi group Combat 18 plasters anti-Islam stickers over children's playground in Heidelberg West

While the media does not often show much of it, violence to Muslims by non-Muslims is widespread


Abeer al-Janabi: 14 year old girl gang raped and killed by US soldiers | DOAM - Documenting Oppression Against Muslims

American soldiers caught raping and torturing Iraqi women | Tune.pk

'I didn't think of Iraqis as humans,' says U.S. soldier who raped 14-year-old girl before killing her and her family | Daily Mail Online

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...5fb_story.html

The Central African Republic is seeing unprecedented violence as Christians hunt down Muslims.

The Gujarat massacre: New India's blood rite | Pankaj Mishra | Comment is free | The Guardian

Of the world's 1,100,000,000 (3 times the population of the USA) potential anti-Muslim terrorists (Using Continuum's bell curve methodology) HOW MANY will commit atrocities because of what they learn from anti-Muslim hate groups and sites?

Contrary to what we usually see, there are considerable atrocities committed by non-Muslims against Muslims.
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Old 09-01-2015, 11:17 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
3,440 posts, read 1,580,662 times
Reputation: 461
Quote:
Originally Posted by fazira View Post
From where does that come from ?
You always throw us in your posts pools, numbers but we don't know from where it comes from.
It's not because you put them in each posts that it makes it truer.

So if you do this kind of calcul for muslims, you do the same for christians, hindus etc ???
You divise people while we know that in the same group of criminals there can be people from different religions (like in drug deals).

How do you define "evil" ?
Does that mean cruelty (murder, rape) or do you count thiefs, verbal insults, drug deals too in your statistics ?
Do you believe it is done because of religion or because those kinds of acts exist everywhere but you class them by religion ?

There's muslims, christians, atheists and others in prison because for many crimes, but not related to their religion.
So i don't understand your "300 millions" because you put everything in it.
If you are still young or capable, I suggest you learn up a bit on Statistics.
Woodrow had no problem understanding the principles I used.

Note I had defined 'evil' in my post, i.e. in point 1 right in front of you;
1. Evil = any human act [of various degrees] that is negative to the well being of the individual and humanity.
Note I emphasis 'various degrees' thus it range from 1-low [lying, robberies] to 5-Medium [murder] to 10-High [genocide, mass rapes, etc]

I stated 20% of all human, i.e. 1 in 5 are vulnerable to any of the above evil. Of course not all of these 20% will commit genocide but some within this pool will commit genocide and mass rapes. This is a reality you cannot dispute.

If 20% of humans are has a potential for evil and because Muslims are also human, therefore 20% of all Muslims are vulnerable to evil.
Since there are 1.5 billion Muslims, therefore 20% of 1.5 billion would be 300 million Muslims who are potentials to evil [of various types and degrees].
You get this point?

If the principle applies to all humans, then 20% of Christians, Buddhists, ordinary people, political members, etc. are also evil prone. In whatever large group, there will be 20% who are evil prone.

BUT, in the case of Islam, SOME of the 20% Muslim who commit evil and violence are catalyzed and inspired by verses and doctrines in the Quran and the martial ethos of Muhammad. There are 300++ direct verses and thousands other indirect verses that fuel evils and violence.
You may not be a part of the 20%, but the fact is these 20% exists and with exposure to the tons of violent and evil verses, real evils and violence is manifested around the world.
If there is no Quran, then there will be no Quran related evils and violence.

The many within 20% of humans will still commit evil and violence but it will not be religion-inspired evil and violence. These will be human-nature-related violence, which could be political, drugs, social, tribal, etc.

There are Buddhist amongst the 20% evil prone who commit evils and violence but they are not inspired by any verses in their holy book. It is the same for Christianity which has an overriding limit of 'love your enemies.'



Quote:
It's not off target at all, the verses prove it.

But even without beeing religious we can say that money and celebrity don't necessary bring you hapinness.
In the religious point of view it may makes you turn from people (their misery, problems) or from God.
So i don't thing i missed something of God's message in the Quran concerning the "illusion" of this world.
I stated you misunderstood why the 'concept of illusion of this life' was introduced in the Quran.
I said if you have understood the Quran thoroughly, the primary purpose of this concept of illusion was to make a comparison that the life hereafter is much better.



Quote:
Yes, this is true, people generally don't live that much. Maximum around
100-120 years old, so for someone who believes in a heareafter it's not a scoop
that this life is short.
But the illusion is made by many things who may makes us forget many things
like working in good deeds and remembering God.
You misinterpret the concept wrongly.
Good deeds and remembering God are covered by God's demand that a Muslim must be steadfast in worship and perfect his DUTY strictly. There are hundreds of verses on this duty.

Note if I convinced you the life of this world is an illusion then you would place less importance on material things and life in this world.
Thus when I ask you to contribute to my charity organization [for God], it would be easier for you to part away with your wealth. You will not hoard but more likely to spend. Note Muhammad needed money for this wars and raids.
If there is a threat, it will be easier for you to sacrifice your life to fight on my behalf for God. After if you die for the cause of Allah, your reward would be more immense. Note Muhammad need soldiers.

I suggest you reread the whole of the Quran and see whether my argument fit or not.


Quote:
The verse 2.94 first of all was adressed to the jews who said that they are prefered by God and will be in good place with Him and won't be touched by the fire or exepted some little days.
So it was a way of talking, that they should ask for death if they really believe that.

"3:185. Every soul will taste of death"

Well isn't that true that everyone die ? That nobody is immortal ?
That's what explains/reminds us the verse, that then we we'll see our Lord and can't escape for that.
The believers who shouldn't forget that this life is short and that we we'll meet God and be judged.

The non-believers/polytheists prefer (some of them) to live their life as it's the only one :

45.24 And they say, "There is not but our worldly life; we die and live, and nothing destroys us except time.
Verse 2:94 was addressed to the Jews then, but it is also an eternal principle of Islam. Note this point in another verse;
62:6. Say (O Muhammad): O ye who are Jews! If ye claim that ye are favored of Allah apart from (all) mankind, then long for death [like Muslims] if ye are truthful.
If the Jews are favored by Allah [like all Muslims] then they should long for death.
This is a test to decide a quality of a Muslim.
This is because a Muslim is assured of eternal life in paradise [with virgins and other rewards] and since life in paradise is better than life in this world [illusion] it is implied they long for death in the physical world. It does not mean they should long for death all the time, but it is a principle to demonstrate what is a Muslim in this regard.

Since there is no God, a non-Abrahamic would by nature want to live as long as possible, but in time most will understand an accept the reality of inevitable mortality rather than clinging on to a LIE.
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Old 09-01-2015, 11:40 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
3,440 posts, read 1,580,662 times
Reputation: 461
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Making use of Continuums Bell Curve 20% of people have the potential for violence.

5.5 Billion billion people are not Muslim and have varying degress of anti-Muslim sentiments. If 20% of them have the potential for violence that means there 1,100,000,000 Potential anti-muslim terrorists. How many of them might be pushed, into acting out their violence, by viewing Media articles that call for the killing of Muslims?

How many of the 20% of the 5.5 non-Muslims can be enticed to commit violence against Muslims after seeing these levels of hatred being popularized in the world's media?
Of the world's 1,100,000,000 (3 times the population of the USA) potential anti-Muslim terrorists (Using Continuum's bell curve methodology) HOW MANY will commit atrocities because of what they learn from anti-Muslim hate groups and sites?

Contrary to what we usually see, there are considerable atrocities committed by non-Muslims against Muslims.
Yes, re 20% of evil prone, there would be 1,100,000,000 potential humans who are prone to evil.

Note 90% of this 1.1 billion belong to other religions where the major religions do not have evil and violence verses in their holy texts to catalyze SOME to commit evils and violence on non-believers.

The difference is there are tons of verses in the Quran and the martial ethos of Muhammad that directly inspire SOME within the 20% of evil prone Muslims to commit real terrible evils upon non-Muslims.

1,100,000,000 Potential anti-Muslim terrorists.
You got it wrong on the numbers.
Most of the 1.1 billion are Muslims apologists and very minimal are anti-Muslim terrorists. I wish there would be more but their numbers are very small at present.
Besides the anti-Muslim-terrorist are only reporters of evils and violence by jihadists. They do not belong to any ideological groups nor do they has any 'verses' exhorting anyone to kill Muslims wherever you find them, like Quran verse 9:5,29
In addition those who voice out the truths about evils and violence by jihadists are suppressed, oppressed or killed for merely expressing an opinion on the issue.

The truth is any evils and violence from the pool of the 1.1 billion non-Muslims are never religion-inspired like those from SOME Muslims.
Whatever evils and violence committed by them are addressed and dealt with accordingly by humanity, note Nazism, slavery, fascism, racism, communism, political evils, etc. Since they are non-religious related they are not dealt within this forum but necessarily elsewhere.

The biggest problem humanity faced today is the ostrich-like-attitude to the truth of evil and violence that are inspired by Islam-in-part when committed by SOME Muslims from the pool of 20% of the evil prone. When WMDs are introduced into this mixed it might be too late for all including the good moderate Muslims.
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Old 09-02-2015, 06:05 AM
 
144 posts, read 107,103 times
Reputation: 90
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post

If 20% of humans are has a potential for evil and because Muslims are also human, therefore 20% of all Muslims are vulnerable to evil.
Since there are 1.5 billion Muslims, therefore 20% of 1.5 billion would be 300 million Muslims who are potentials to evil [of various types and degrees].
You get this point?
If someone steals food or whatever from a supermarket or whatever what does it have to do with the fact that he is muslim and how can you compare that to an other type of crime like suicide bombing ? You give us a big number 300 millions and it sounds as there's a big muslim threat of 300 millions toward pthe world because of their religion.
You understand what i mean ? You mix religion with crime.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
BUT, in the case of Islam, SOME of the 20% Muslim who commit evil and violence are catalyzed and inspired by verses and doctrines in the Quran and the martial ethos of Muhammad. There are 300++ direct verses and thousands other indirect verses that fuel evils and violence.
So those who are drug dealers, thiefs do that because of Islam ? Really ...
You should give us a number among those supposed 20% who can commit evil and violence because of religion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You may not be a part of the 20%, but the fact is these 20% exists and with exposure to the tons of violent and evil verses, real evils and violence is manifested around the world.
If there is no Quran, then there will be no Quran related evils and violence.
You analyse the Quran and muslims by the acts made those 30-40 last years.
Principaly by new groups such as Al Qaida and ISIS that are known since the 80's or 90's.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I stated you misunderstood why the 'concept of illusion of this life' was introduced in the Quran.
I said if you have understood the Quran thoroughly, the primary purpose of this concept of illusion was to make a comparison that the life hereafter is much better.
Yes i know that. But the illusion stands in some aspects of this actual life that may makes us forget our final destination and then loose the other one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Note if I convinced you the life of this world is an illusion then you would place less importance on material things and life in this world.
Thus when I ask you to contribute to my charity organization [for God], it would be easier for you to part away with your wealth. You will not hoard but more likely to spend. Note Muhammad needed money for this wars and raids.
If there is a threat, it will be easier for you to sacrifice your life to fight on my behalf for God. After if you die for the cause of Allah, your reward would be more immense. Note Muhammad need soldiers.

I suggest you reread the whole of the Quran and see whether my argument fit or not.
You're correct, i never said otherwise.
By the way, i read and listen all the time the Quran so i know it quite well, thanks.

And knowing that this life is short and an illusion, doesn't prevent us to have a normal life.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post

Since there is no God, a non-Abrahamic would by nature want to live as long as possible, but in time most will understand an accept the reality of inevitable mortality rather than clinging on to a LIE.
You have difficulties to understand that when there's a fight (not a blind attack to die as soon as possible with innocents killed- again i have to precise) a muslim should go.
But in time of peace, muslims don't want to die, like everybody. Because we are HUMANS, and have children, we go to school, build houses, go to restaurants, do shopping etc ..

You have a big problem accepting that muslims don't fight all the time, and don't want to be at any price marthyrs.
It doesn't mean we are bad muslims as long we do the 5 pilars of Islam.
Islam is not a complicated religion, and if people were all longing to death, then there would be very few muslims left and wars all the time.
It's just that we should not forget God and do good deads, act of adoration like prayer, fast etc
If some dont want to build house, don't want clothes from brands etc it's their choice, and the one who want/like there's no blame on him as long as he practices his faith and avoid to spend too much money.

Solomon was rich, no ? But was a good believer.

And haven't you seen those Irakies and Syrian who flee from those countries ?
Aren't they people who want to live and save their famillies ?

Have you ever met muslims in your life ? Have you been in a muslim country ?
You only talk about death and marthyrs in your posts.
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Old 09-02-2015, 08:57 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
3,440 posts, read 1,580,662 times
Reputation: 461
Quote:
Originally Posted by fazira View Post
If someone steals food or whatever from a supermarket or whatever what does it have to do with the fact that he is muslim and how can you compare that to an other type of crime like suicide bombing ? You give us a big number 300 millions and it sounds as there's a big muslim threat of 300 millions toward pthe world because of their religion.
You understand what i mean ? You mix religion with crime.


So those who are drug dealers, thiefs do that because of Islam ? Really ...
You should give us a number among those supposed 20% who can commit evil and violence because of religion.
I have stated there is a potential pool of 20% or 300 million evil prone Muslims.
The evils and violence they are likely to commit can be categorized in two main groups.
1. Non-religious - in general, e.g. stealing from a supermarket, robberies, drugs and the likes.
2. Religion-inspired directly by verses in the Quran.
Non-religious crimes, evils and violence committed by Muslims are not relevant to this OP or this Religion and Spirituality Forum. They should be dealt within philosophy, politics, social and other non-religious forums. They are off topic here.

What we are more interested in this particular forum are religion-inspired, i.e. Islam-inspired evils and violence.

I started with 20% and of course this is a rough but nevertheless a safe estimate.
Even if I reduce this to merely 1% , that is still a frightening 15 million evil prone Muslims who are likely to act upon the evil laden verses in the Quran.
What is real and critical is even ONE evil prone Muslim inspired by the Quran [directly or indirectly] can cause terrible damage to humanity. It only took 18++ to do a 911. So can you imagine what great damage a possible potential of 15 million, i.e. merely 1% can do.

The evils and violence committed by evil prone Muslims inspired by verses in the Quran are real and terrible. I am sure you have read that on an almost daily basis.

Here is one well-substantiated evidence and figures of violence [26,811] by evil prone Muslims as inspired by verses in the Quran [& other texts];



Note the above is merely one example of evil and violence committed by evil prone Muslims, there are lots of other types of evils committed by evil prone Muslims against non-Muslims, e.g. mass raping, oppression against minority, etc. etc.


Quote:
Yes i know that. But the illusion stands in some aspects of this actual life
that may makes us forget our final destination and then loose the other one.
You still don't get it. I suggests you read the Quran again and note my point.
The main purpose of the concept of illusion in the Quran is not to ensure 'you may forget your final destination.' That is being taken care by Allah demanding you are steadfast to your DUTY and strive in the way/cause of Allah.

The main purpose of the concept of illusion in the Quran is to REDUCE the importance of the life and wealth in this world so that Muslims can give up their wealth and life to the cause of Allah, i.e. defend the religion fight the infidels, kuffar, kafara, etc. [actually is for the personal interest of Muahammad during this time]. The same is being practiced by ISIS and the likes. Since there is no central authority in Islam who can insist they are wrong in their practice of Islam as truer Muslims.


Quote:
And knowing that this life is short and an illusion, doesn't prevent us to have
a normal life.
That is true to you and the majority. However you should note the reality of the other 20% and the depressive amongst them.
There are those who are among the 20% who are willing to give up their life in this world [because the Quran said this life is 'cheap'] to go as soon as possible to Paradise [since this is very real to them].
Since they can stop this life, they might as well kill and commit evil upon non-Muslims [kuffar] for the cause of Allah [non-Muslims perceived as a threat to Islam for all sort of reasons] to get better rewards.

The problem is you are always focusing on yourself [presumably a good Muslims and human being] but you are blind to what is real out there amongst the potential 20% of evil prone Muslims and their response to the verses in the Quran.


Quote:
You have difficulties to understand that when there's a fight (not a blind attack to die as soon as possible with innocents killed- again i have to precise) a muslim should go.
But in time of peace, muslims don't want to die, like everybody. Because we are HUMANS, and have children, we go to school, build houses, go to restaurants, do shopping etc ..

You have a big problem accepting that muslims don't fight all the time, and don't want to be at any price marthyrs.
It doesn't mean we are bad muslims as long we do the 5 pilars of Islam.
Islam is not a complicated religion, and if people were all longing to death, then there would be very few muslims left and wars all the time.
It's just that we should not forget God and do good deads, act of adoration like prayer, fast etc
If some dont want to build house, don't want clothes from brands etc it's their choice, and the one who want/like there's no blame on him as long as he practices his faith and avoid to spend too much money.

Solomon was rich, no ? But was a good believer.

And haven't you seen those Irakies and Syrian who flee from those countries ?
Aren't they people who want to live and save their famillies ?

Have you ever met muslims in your life ? Have you been in a muslim country ?
You only talk about death and marthyrs in your posts.
What I am starting with my analysis and critique of Islam is based on real evidence. e.g. the 26,811 counts of evils by evil prone Muslims.
I have traced their root causes to Islam-in-part [not whole], 20% or even 1% of evil prone Muslims and the martial ethos of Muhammad.


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Have you ever met muslims in your life? Have you been in a muslim country ?
You only talk about death and marthyrs in your posts.
I can confirm I very familiar with Muslims and Muslim countries in real life.
My forte [strength] is in problem solving techniques.
In solving a problem one of the important and efficient element is to focus on the critical areas but not forgetting the other lesser ones. Note Pareto's 80/20 Principle.

If you have a lot of problems in life, don't you think you should focus on the ones that are likely to threaten your life at that present point in time?
That is why I focus in the critical, i.e. deaths, violence, extreme evils, martyrdom [Islamic], and the likes but I have not forgotten the lesser evils. Within a forum like this and due to time and space constraints we have to prioritize.
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