U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 11-01-2015, 06:42 PM
 
6,319 posts, read 5,716,275 times
Reputation: 11933

Advertisements

If they wipe their butt with their left hands, they're Muslim.

And kinda gross.

 
Old 11-01-2015, 08:08 PM
Status: "I CRAVE Canine-stew" (set 10 days ago)
 
Location: Brawndo-Thirst-Mutilator-Nation
16,446 posts, read 16,545,301 times
Reputation: 12452
Oh brother, reminds me of the propaganda-push to make $h17bulls into some sort of sweety-pie dogs.
 
Old 11-01-2015, 08:59 PM
 
Location: University City, Philadelphia
22,592 posts, read 12,332,190 times
Reputation: 15493
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyster View Post

You do know, don't you, that the Crusades were a DEFENSIVE act against violent Muslim incursions into the West. You know that, right? Or maybe you don't.
Tyster, there are some things I agree with you ... but on this one point you are very wrong.

The Crusaders massacred tens of thousands perhaps hundreds of thousands of Jewish civilians living peaceably in both Europe and in present day Israel. Killed them - men, women and children ... and demolished their synagogues and desecrated their cemeteries. What is "defensive" about that???

The Crusader's goal was to capture Jerusalem, and there is nothing defensive about that. Jerusalem is not in Europe.

The bloodthirsty Crusades cannot be defended. The horrors of the Spanish Inquisition cannot be defended.

Just as the bloody pogroms in the 19th and early 20th Centuries cannot be defended.
 
Old 11-01-2015, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Montgomery County, PA
14,659 posts, read 9,709,922 times
Reputation: 12210
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clark Park View Post

The bloodthirsty Crusades cannot be defended.
But you must admit. They had a cool name.
 
Old 11-01-2015, 10:41 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
22,455 posts, read 10,395,261 times
Reputation: 20311
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyRider View Post
The left has made a career out of besmirching the history of the country. They are even teaching it in grade schools, making doubly sure that the kids know George Washington and the rest were slave owners and the Southwest was taken from Mexico and it is effectively Occupier Territories. New Immigrants see that and feel empowered.
Well, they were slaveholders. And we did often push illegally into new territories.

Don't like history?
 
Old 11-01-2015, 10:51 PM
 
12,651 posts, read 10,492,420 times
Reputation: 17539
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
Well, they were slaveholders. And we did often push illegally into new territories.

Don't like history?
Native Americans also sold land. Colonists bought essentially the whole state of NJ from natives, I believe the Lenape.

"Native Americans" also at one point migrated from elsewhere - Asia. So some Europeans built ships and decided to attempt to sail to Asia, and "found" some new land, then colonized it themselves? Circle of life. Kind of like now waves of immigrants from south of our border are entering America and demographics are changing again. By 2050 and 2100 US demographics will look a hell of a lot different. Now Europe is being inundated with migrants, too. It's how the world works and always has. The problem is kids are being taught that we have to apologize for it. In 100 years should all the descendants of illegals apologize for what their ancestors did to America? And how they changed the demographics, and who knows what else will change in the future as demographics shift? Will future generations be taught US history much like it's taught now, except focusing on a different group of people who "took over" when they probably shouldn't have?
 
Old 11-01-2015, 11:28 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
22,455 posts, read 10,395,261 times
Reputation: 20311
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
...The problem is kids are being taught that we have to apologize for it. ...
1. Could you show me an example of that curriculum?

2. But you're right. We shouldn't apologize for stealing land and making the Indians become nearly extinct! That's good stuff. We should probably do it more often for the glory of God and the United States.
 
Old 11-01-2015, 11:50 PM
 
12,651 posts, read 10,492,420 times
Reputation: 17539
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi View Post
1. Could you show me an example of that curriculum?

2. But you're right. We shouldn't apologize for stealing land and making the Indians become nearly extinct! That's good stuff. We should probably do it more often for the glory of God and the United States.
1. Personal experience. It's not a "curriculum" as much as it's the way it is taught, the tones the teachers and books take on, the subtle disses towards America and our leaders at the time. Just read an American history book for, say, middle or high school. And college? Oh, forget it. I could write a book on my experiences with the anti-American history professors on that. I was a history major! Step onto any college campus and it's a PC, apologist haven.

2. The diseases Europeans brought over when they unintentionally landed in the Caribbean, thinking it was Asia (good old Columbus), are really what decimated native populations. That was accidental. People living here had never been exposed to European diseases, so they had no immunity. And when they first arrived, Europeans had not a clue how diseases were transmitted. Science hadn't gotten that far for at least 100 more years. Regardless of violence, millions of Native Americans died from disease, and that is no one's fault. Even if things had been peaceful, the populations still would have been decimated.

"Stealing" land is simplified a bit too much. Like I said, land was often bought and sold. It was traded. It was also taken, undeniably, sometimes, but not always. I think the worst thing America did was the forced westward movement. If only they could have thought to build reservations everywhere rather than force everyone west. It would have been better than what they did.

But interesting that you did not address the rest of my post, how one could argue there is a new "takeover" in certain countries today. It's a fact that demographics will change here in the next 100 years. Whites will be a minority in this country for the first time ever, and Hispanics will be a majority. We already know there's an existing illegal population problem here. So is this as equally not okay? The illegalls entering a country illegally and taking resources, driving up crime in areas, and draining money? In the future, will American children be taught in school of how this happened? How millions illegally crossed the border for years and helped change America? Will they, the eventual majority, also be taught to apologize and feel bad for it, as if their history was terrible, too?

How about Merkel in Germany, to stay a bit more on topic? Allowing all of these refugees from ISIS and civil war torn areas to enter Germany, where people claim things are already changing in spots where many refugees are settling? What will future Europeans be taught of how and why their countries and demographics changed forever? Because it better be the same "white guilt" kids are taught today, except it won't be "white" in these cases in our future.

Or are white Americans/Europeans just that special, that we don't get a pass on what has always happened throughout history with all ethnic groups, countries, and races? Perhaps people should look into the histories of other empires. Arab ones were especially brutal. Mughals, Ottomans. Empires are harsh. It's the way it works. Even today, questionable things happen.
 
Old 11-02-2015, 05:50 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,276,969 times
Reputation: 7407
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
1. Personal experience. It's not a "curriculum" as much as it's the way it is taught, the tones the teachers and books take on, the subtle disses towards America and our leaders at the time. Just read an American history book for, say, middle or high school. And college? Oh, forget it. I could write a book on my experiences with the anti-American history professors on that. I was a history major! Step onto any college campus and it's a PC, apologist haven.

2. The diseases Europeans brought over when they unintentionally landed in the Caribbean, thinking it was Asia (good old Columbus), are really what decimated native populations. That was accidental. People living here had never been exposed to European diseases, so they had no immunity. And when they first arrived, Europeans had not a clue how diseases were transmitted. Science hadn't gotten that far for at least 100 more years. Regardless of violence, millions of Native Americans died from disease, and that is no one's fault. Even if things had been peaceful, the populations still would have been decimated.

"Stealing" land is simplified a bit too much. Like I said, land was often bought and sold. It was traded. It was also taken, undeniably, sometimes, but not always. I think the worst thing America did was the forced westward movement. If only they could have thought to build reservations everywhere rather than force everyone west. It would have been better than what they did.

But interesting that you did not address the rest of my post, how one could argue there is a new "takeover" in certain countries today. It's a fact that demographics will change here in the next 100 years. Whites will be a minority in this country for the first time ever, and Hispanics will be a majority. We already know there's an existing illegal population problem here. So is this as equally not okay? The illegalls entering a country illegally and taking resources, driving up crime in areas, and draining money? In the future, will American children be taught in school of how this happened? How millions illegally crossed the border for years and helped change America? Will they, the eventual majority, also be taught to apologize and feel bad for it, as if their history was terrible, too?

How about Merkel in Germany, to stay a bit more on topic? Allowing all of these refugees from ISIS and civil war torn areas to enter Germany, where people claim things are already changing in spots where many refugees are settling? What will future Europeans be taught of how and why their countries and demographics changed forever? Because it better be the same "white guilt" kids are taught today, except it won't be "white" in these cases in our future.

Or are white Americans/Europeans just that special, that we don't get a pass on what has always happened throughout history with all ethnic groups, countries, and races? Perhaps people should look into the histories of other empires. Arab ones were especially brutal. Mughals, Ottomans. Empires are harsh. It's the way it works. Even today, questionable things happen.
There never has been any major Arab invasions. The Arab people never really spread much beyond the Arabian peninsula, However the Arabic language did and that became the Arab Empire, although the people were not Arabs.

The Moghuls were not Muslim until after they conquered India and the Arabian peninsula. .However their conversion to Islam did result in the largest Westward spread of Islam

Quote:
Berke Khan (Unknown-1266)

As the grandson of the great Mongol conqueror, Genghis Khan, Berke Khan was an important figure in the Mongol world in the mid-1200s. Like other Mongols, he originally practiced a form of pagan shamanism. As the leader in the Golden Horde – a Mongol army – he was sent to the North Caucasus Mountains and Eastern Europe to subdue the Kipchak Turks. He eventually managed to lead armies all the way into Hungary.
Hulagu Khan's army attacking Baghdad

Hulagu Khan’s army attacking Baghdad

Then during his travels back towards the Mongol homeland, he stopped in Bukhara where he questioned local Muslims about their beliefs. He was convinced of the message of Islam and converted, becoming the first Mongol leader to accept Islam. After his conversion, many of the soldiers in his army also converted, leading to tension with the other Mongol armies, who were ravaging Muslim lands, including the ancient capital of the Abbasids, Baghdad.

After hearing of the sack of Baghdad in 1258 by his cousin, Hulagu Khan, Berke promised vengance, declaring, “He (Hulagu) has sacked all the cities of the Muslims, and has brought about the death of the Caliph. With the help of God I will call him to account for so much innocent blood.” By allying with the Mamluk Sultanate of Egypt, Berke managed to hold back Hulagu’s army enough to prevent a major invasion (and destruction) of the remainder of Muslim lands in Egypt, Syria, and the Hijaz.
Lost Islamic History | 6 Great Converts To Islam
Possibly this is the reason the Muslims in Northern Europe sided with the non-Muslim Europeans against the Ottomans. The European Muslims are Lipkas (Tatar) and predominately Moghul.

Now going back to the post:

I am very much sympathetic towards the plight of the Native American and by marriage do consider myself to be Lakotah. I am a supporter of AIM and like many Lakotah see the Wasicu (White invaders) as illegally occupying the "Republic of Lakotah" in blatant violation of the Treaty of Laramie. the Native American history of America does differ from the presentation in the White Schools.

Native American Children are still being taken from the reservations and forced into Christianity. My wife and I used to live near the Cheyenne River Rez and this still happens:

Quote:
A little while ago, I was supposed to attend a Halloween party. I decided to dress as a nun because nuns were the scariest things I ever saw," says Willetta Dolphus, 54, a Cheyenne River Lakota. The source of her fear, still vivid decades later, was her childhood experience at American Indian boarding schools in South Dakota.
Soul Wound: The Legacy of Native American Schools | Amnesty International USA
We also spend quite a bit of time on Pine Ridge.


Genocide on Pine Ridge

The Genocide of American natives, their language and their culture is very real and continues to today. This is a side of our American History the Schools must teach if the atrocities are to end.

Yes I am Muslim, but I am also an American by Birth and a Lakotah by marriage. I can not change history but I can do my share to try to bring justice to the Lakotah and part of that is to make my fellow Americans aware of what we Americans did to these beautiful people.

__________________
When posting as a MOD my posts will be in red

No advertising, no copyrighted material, no personal attacks


MODERATOR OF: Buddhism: Judaism: Paganism:

When in doubt read the TOS MOD LIST FAQ's
 
Old 11-02-2015, 07:51 AM
 
17,497 posts, read 10,655,505 times
Reputation: 6746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
There never has been any major Arab invasions. The Arab people never really spread much beyond the Arabian peninsula, However the Arabic language did and that became the Arab Empire, although the people were not Arabs.

The Moghuls were not Muslim until after they conquered India and the Arabian peninsula. .However their conversion to Islam did result in the largest Westward spread of Islam

Possibly this is the reason the Muslims in Northern Europe sided with the non-Muslim Europeans against the Ottomans. The European Muslims are Lipkas (Tatar) and predominately Moghul.

Now going back to the post:

I am very much sympathetic towards the plight of the Native American and by marriage do consider myself to be Lakotah. I am a supporter of AIM and like many Lakotah see the Wasicu (White invaders) as illegally occupying the "Republic of Lakotah" in blatant violation of the Treaty of Laramie. the Native American history of America does differ from the presentation in the White Schools.

Native American Children are still being taken from the reservations and forced into Christianity. My wife and I used to live near the Cheyenne River Rez and this still happens:

We also spend quite a bit of time on Pine Ridge.


Genocide on Pine Ridge

The Genocide of American natives, their language and their culture is very real and continues to today. This is a side of our American History the Schools must teach if the atrocities are to end.

Yes I am Muslim, but I am also an American by Birth and a Lakotah by marriage. I can not change history but I can do my share to try to bring justice to the Lakotah and part of that is to make my fellow Americans aware of what we Americans did to these beautiful people.

I think it is important you don't generalize Christians. Christians are independent and organized. If you notice it was organized churches, plus the government doing this to the Indians, not ALL Christians.

In Muslim countries Christians are not free......plus the genocide of the Yazidi people in the ME, by Muslims is very comparable to the NA. It does seem it is the people doing the genocide.

NA are free to leave the reservation in any state in America, are they not?

In Idaho many white people live on tribal land, with no conflicts and no hatred. Matter of fact, many in the Nez Perce tribe are very Christian with no intention of leaving their faith.

Local News | Nez Perce Indians In Idaho Celebrate Their Christian Traditions | Seattle Times Newspaper
The Talmaks recent celebration was nothing like a powwow or traditional Indian encampment.
No one wore feathers or moccasins. There were no stick games, drumming or traditional dancing. Fry bread wasn't even a staple at the dinner table.
Except for the tepees, the atmosphere was more like a summer camp. An American flag hung above the doorstop of nearly every cabin. Red, white and blue streamers decorated the poles, the buildings, even the antennas on cars.
"You don't have to wear buckskin and headdresses to be Indian," said camp elder Cecil Corbett of Scottsdale, Ariz.

Notice the difference (her sense of grace) in this 65 year old woman, compared to the woman you gave as an example;
Strombeck, 65, can hardly see or walk. Her hair is gray and her face wrinkled and she moves slowly with a cane.
Still she doesn't skip a camp meeting. The only time she couldn't come when she was a missionary, preaching among the Hopis and Navajos in Arizona.
"When I come up here, I feel closer to the Lord," said Strombeck, a Nez Perce elder with a rich, bass voice.
Talmaks, which means "thunder over the buttes" in Nez Perce, has become a place of renewal for the Presbyterian Nez Perce, Corbett said. "It is a sanctuary for the worship of God."
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top