U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 07-28-2016, 11:40 AM
 
2,050 posts, read 668,540 times
Reputation: 204

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Is there any indication there is less violence in nations where the majority are not influenced by the Qur'an? Such as Mexico, Argentina, Brazil, Haiti, Jamaica or even the USA. Should be a significant decline in violence as those 20% prone to evil have no influence from the Qur'an.

Any large city with no significant Muslim population should show little violence if your hypothesis is correct. Yet the overall rates of violence are not religious motivated nor by people that read the Qur'an. The over whelming incidences of violence are not terrorist attacks nor religious inspired, they are by your local, friendly, non-religious neighborhood criminal. Even the violence of ISIS is overshadowed by the violence of the drug cartels. Population density seems to be more of a causative factor of violence than religious influence. The most densely populated regions have the highest violence rate, the least densely populated regions have the lowest rates of violence.
In all countries of the world is no crime
At the time no evil
But crime is different from terrorism
Terrorism is motivated by ideology and texts
Thought, conscience
Differ from individual evil
Thought, conscience collective terror
This is Islam
Texts supports terrorism
And fighting for God
While crime for women or the ambitions of the world
The offender have personal motives
While the terrorist carries ideological motives
This is not to confuse crime and terrorism
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-28-2016, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,339,951 times
Reputation: 7407
Quote:
Originally Posted by mahasn sawresho View Post
In all countries of the world is no crime
At the time no evil
But crime is different from terrorism
Terrorism is motivated by ideology and texts
Thought, conscience
Differ from individual evil
Thought, conscience collective terror
This is Islam
Texts supports terrorism
And fighting for God
While crime for women or the ambitions of the world
The offender have personal motives
While the terrorist carries ideological motives
This is not to confuse crime and terrorism
But the fact is a person killed by criminal violence is just as dead as a person killed by religious violence. It is also true that the most violent Nations on earth are non-Muslim, but people are not concerned because it is not done by Muslims. The USA averages over 14 thousand Murders every year by criminal acts. Over 4 times the number of people killed on 9/11 and happening every year. But the concentration is on the acts labelled Islamic Terrorism. Outside of 9/11 virtually no Americans have been killed in America by Islamic Terrorists Even the horrific Boston Marathon bombing resulted in 3 Deaths. Boston has an average of about 40 murders per year, by non-Muslims.

the Truth is there is much more violence in non-Muslim nations than in Muslim nations. But people find them to be acceptable because they are not attributed to any religious belief. but they are no less dead.

When one looks at violence rates of the world that includes violence of all causes, most Muslim nations come out to be less violent than the non-Muslim Nations. The Drug cartels in Mexico commit far more murders than even ISIS

There are those that will holler those are not terrorist attacks, they don't count. Violence is violence, no matter what the alleged cause is and over all more violence is done by non-Muslims then by Muslims. To end the Qur'an would result in an increase of world violence.. The Qur'an does discourage violence by most of those that are prone to commit violence. To argue for an end or modification of the Qur'an is supporting an over-all increase in violence.

http://www.worldlifeexpectancy.com/c...ce/by-country/


The Staggering Death Toll of Mexico's Drug War | Drug Lord: The Legend of Shorty | FRONTLINE | PBS
Attached Thumbnails
How to Avoid Ending Up as a Jihadist-mexico_homicides-2.jpg  
__________________
When posting as a MOD my posts will be in red

No advertising, no copyrighted material, no personal attacks


MODERATOR OF: Buddhism: Judaism: Paganism:

When in doubt read the TOS MOD LIST FAQ's
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-28-2016, 02:29 PM
 
3,169 posts, read 1,051,162 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Yes, there is the Meccan and Medina Verses.
Actually, not all verses are either Meccan or Medinan verses. Several were revealed neither in Mecca nor in Madina.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The Meccan verses do not contain much evil laden elements.
Muslims were persecuted in Mecca but no Meccan army had attacked Muslims until they had migrated to Madina.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The Medinian verses contain lots of evil laden and malignant verses that inspire SOME Muslims who are evil prone to commit terrible evils and violence. The Medinian verses also contain good elements but only SOME.
The so-called "evil laden and malignant verses", the Medinan verses, are "justice laden verses" in response to wars being waged by Meccans, and those who aided and abetted, against Muslims of Madina.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
In this case we cannot put ALL Muslims into one basket [as the same].

Say [Duck=evil, Rabbit=Good].
The guy who puts ALL Muslims into one basket is a bunny without brain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I believe
-80% of all Muslim are good human beings
-20% are evil prone.
You believe wrong; very few are good human beings and most are evil prone. A brainless bunny will agree with me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The 80% of Muslims will see the Rabbit [good element] in the Medinian verses.
All who read the Qur'an see good element in even the Medinan verses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Most of these 80% of Muslims will be blind [cannot see the evil elements] in the Medinian.
It's because there are no evil Medinan verses. Only a blind brainless bunny can see an evil verse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
A few % may see both Rabbit [Good] and Duck [evil] but there are not many.
There are none because none are like blind brainless bunny.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Even if they see the 'evil' elements they will always find excuses for it. Khalif and Woodrow LI [I take it they are good Muslims] are always doing that.
They are trying to literally help you but they are not learning any lesson from the Qur'an 27:80.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The 20% [note a pool of 300 millions Muslims] will see the Duck=evil elements.
Continuum is a good swimmer; he has met all 300 million Muslims in the middle of a pool.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
A potential of 300 million evil prone is a scary number because only one can cause a lot of damage to humanity, what more if 300 million!
If one can make you feel so much terror, blaming 300 millions would be foolish. Declaring crusade against them was a very bad move. Try diplomacy next time!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
When influenced and inspired by the Duck=evil elements they will commit terrible evils upon non-Muslims.
You can't tell the difference between a duck and a rabbit; they have been committing terrible evils upon Muslims, including Muslim children.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Some of these evil prone Muslims will practice Tagiya due to circumstances but their overall psychology tend towards evil and will be evil most of the time. They will strike evil whenever the opportunity arise, e.g. ISIS within a weakened Syria and Iraq due to weak politics.
These evil prone Muslims are soldiers of evil prone Baghdadi reacting to bombings in their countries by the evil prone non-Muslims. Where they are all going wrong is that they are all killing innocent people but are blind to see that these innocent people are not collateral damage but real human beings subjected to death by the evil prone from a much larger pool of 1500 million.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-28-2016, 02:48 PM
 
3,169 posts, read 1,051,162 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
To argue for an end or modification of the Qur'an is supporting an over-all increase in violence.
Those who support an end of or modification of the Qur'an are supporting creation of Hell on earth.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-28-2016, 03:06 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,339,951 times
Reputation: 7407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
Those who support an end of or modification of the Qur'an are supporting creation of Hell on earth.

If the history of the world from the Time of Jesus(as) until the revelation of the Qur'an is any indication You are correct.
__________________
When posting as a MOD my posts will be in red

No advertising, no copyrighted material, no personal attacks


MODERATOR OF: Buddhism: Judaism: Paganism:

When in doubt read the TOS MOD LIST FAQ's
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-28-2016, 10:55 PM
 
2,050 posts, read 668,540 times
Reputation: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
But the fact is a person killed by criminal violence is just as dead as a person killed by religious violence. It is also true that the most violent Nations on earth are non-Muslim, but people are not concerned because it is not done by Muslims. The USA averages over 14 thousand Murders every year by criminal acts. Over 4 times the number of people killed on 9/11 and happening every year. But the concentration is on the acts labelled Islamic Terrorism. Outside of 9/11 virtually no Americans have been killed in America by Islamic Terrorists Even the horrific Boston Marathon bombing resulted in 3 Deaths. Boston has an average of about 40 murders per year, by non-Muslims.

the Truth is there is much more violence in non-Muslim nations than in Muslim nations. But people find them to be acceptable because they are not attributed to any religious belief. but they are no less dead.

When one looks at violence rates of the world that includes violence of all causes, most Muslim nations come out to be less violent than the non-Muslim Nations. The Drug cartels in Mexico commit far more murders than even ISIS

There are those that will holler those are not terrorist attacks, they don't count. Violence is violence, no matter what the alleged cause is and over all more violence is done by non-Muslims then by Muslims. To end the Qur'an would result in an increase of world violence.. The Qur'an does discourage violence by most of those that are prone to commit violence. To argue for an end or modification of the Qur'an is supporting an over-all increase in violence.

VIOLENCE DEATH RATE BY COUNTRY


The Staggering Death Toll of Mexico's Drug War | Drug Lord: The Legend of Shorty | FRONTLINE | PBS
Crime has reasons to be tackling crime laws
But terrorism can not be manipulated
Crime would be contrary to God
While Islamic terrorism comes from God
Killing and fighting is one of God's commands
God offender and killer is in the Koran
So the two is no different
God in the Koran terrorist
Killer and criminal
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-28-2016, 11:08 PM
 
2,050 posts, read 668,540 times
Reputation: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
Those who support an end of or modification of the Qur'an are supporting creation of Hell on earth.
Jesus did not take part in any combat operation
Jesus did not take away the spoils
Jesus did not marry his son's wife
Jesus Athar person on earth
Mohammed, who killed the people
And the looting of the spoils
And assaulted the symptoms of people
There is no difference between Mohammed and the Christ
Christ said God so loved the world
While Muhammad said the enemy of Allah and your enemy
The teachings of peace and love of Christ
While the teachings of Muhammad fighting and killing and sex is cheap
Middle East has been governed by two forces
Persian Empire
Empire Romania
The Persian Magi and Zoroaster
But the Romans were Christians
But the wars were for the minimum
This is the difference between Christians wars
Wars are honest
Do not say that God sent them orders to fight
Muslim gangs have emerged and spread quickly because of barbarism
Porn looting and booty
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-28-2016, 11:08 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
3,440 posts, read 1,597,945 times
Reputation: 461
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
That's my point too. You take individual verses to illustrate your point and reject the rest, and so do your friends the same way. I take the whole Qur'an into account.
Turn your argument the other way round and it will be my argument too.
That is a straw man. I have already told you I do not rely on individual verses but rather take the individual and group of verses in the context of the whole Quran.

Note your persistence in quoting those very rare verse 60:8-9 to support that the Quran is just is evidence you are merely relying on individual and rare verses which are not in line with the overall context of the Quran.

Quote:
It is foolish to use this argument when the Qur'an as a whole is against taking life, killing innocent people (Muslims as well as non-Muslims) and doing any evil act.
That is the problem with you because you have only read the Quran 6-7 times at one go. In addition you are so ignorant of human nature and your own inherent nature.

Btw, you did not provide answers for what you see in the images I posted?
This is not fooling around but serious knowledge based on personal experience.

Quote:
What you do not understand is that a vast majority of evil prone do not pray or fast. They do not go to mosques to pray but to kill worshipers. They do everything possible that is forbidden in the Book. Do you believe that they read the Qur'an like those who go to pray in a mosque every day? Not a chance! No guy reads the Qur'an who does not pray every day.
I disagree with you that the majority of evil prone Muslims do not pray.
It is true some Muslims [evil prone and good Muslims] are not serious Muslims but once they become serious Muslims they will pray 5 times a day otherwise they will fear not going to Paradise. When the evil prone Muslims get serious, then they become potential killers when influenced by the evil laden verses.

Note as I said, I am very voracious reader and I have read hundreds of articles where the jihadist and other evil doers support their evil deeds with verses from the Quran and Ahadith [not4you].

Here is one;

Quote:
Brutal killing
Bouyeri had told the court he had acted out of religious conviction.
Clutching a copy of the Koran, he said that "the law compels me to chop off the head of anyone who insults Allah and the prophet".
BBC NEWS | Europe | Van Gogh killer jailed for life
What I did not do is to compile all these evidence to throw them at you.

However I bet the root cause of the following statistics can be traced to the Quran; [28,899]! it was 28,895 a few hours ago.



Quote:
You are blind to the overall message of the Qur'an because you deliberately, in your bias, disregard the overriding, central and the fundamental verses. Your friend Baghdadi does the same. The difference between you two is that Baghdadi uses the ignorant ones as pawns (so-called soldiers on foot) in his game and you only support his evil game with your ducks and rabbits.
I suggest you retract this personal attack "Your friend Baghdadi does the same" because Al Baghadi is not my friend.

Note I am not blind as you and this why I suggest you do the RABBIT-DUCK experiment with other images and understand the full picture of the Quran and Islam, i.e. the good, the evil, the bad, the ugly and the whole picture of Islam.
The point is believers will always have a bias towards their religion and that is worse when the religion contain evil laden elements that spur their evil prone believers to commit terrible evils and violence in the name of their religions as in Islam [part].

Quote:
Come back when you have understood the Qur'an properly. Until then even you will see only a duck or a rabbit in each verse. You are, therefore, a sitting duck for the Shaytan.
I am a non-theist why should I bother about an illusional Shaytan. If you insist, prove God and Shaytan exist in the first place.

As for understanding of the Quran, it is obvious [assuming both of us are average people] that my >50 reading of the Quran [one go] enable me a greater understanding of the Quran than your ONLY 6-7 reading [one go] of the Quran. In addition as a believer you MUST be bias when reading the Quran and that restraint you from knowing the whole truth of the Quran within the reality box.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-28-2016, 11:13 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
3,440 posts, read 1,597,945 times
Reputation: 461
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
O.M.G. Why do the unbelievers understand others' nature but not the others?
Not sure of your point.

My suggestion of you doing the exercise is for you to understand your own nature which is the same as all human being.
Then it is easy for us to discuss when we are on the same platform to make communication easier so to avoid talking apples with oranges a and talking pass each other.

I suggest you continue with the game to understand your own human nature.

So what did you see in those images I posted?
Did you see one or two images, if so what are they?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-28-2016, 11:25 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
3,440 posts, read 1,597,945 times
Reputation: 461
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Is there any indication there is less violence in nations where the majority are not influenced by the Qur'an? Such as Mexico, Argentina, Brazil, Haiti, Jamaica or even the USA. Should be a significant decline in violence as those 20% prone to evil have no influence from the Qur'an.

Any large city with no significant Muslim population should show little violence if your hypothesis is correct. Yet the overall rates of violence are not religious motivated nor by people that read the Qur'an. The over whelming incidences of violence are not terrorist attacks nor religious inspired, they are by your local, friendly, non-religious neighborhood criminal. Even the violence of ISIS is overshadowed by the violence of the drug cartels. Population density seems to be more of a causative factor of violence than religious influence. The most densely populated regions have the highest violence rate, the least densely populated regions have the lowest rates of violence.
The point here is humanity must addressed ALL types of violence.

At present it is very obvious ALL [100%] the evils and violence can be categorized into the main two categories;
1. Secular based evils and violence
2. Religious related [Islam] evils and violence.
As for 1. Secular based evils and violence, we can trace the root causes to
A. 20% of evil prone humans
B. Secular evil laden elements that trigger the above to commit evils.

As for 2. Religious related [Islam] evils and violence, we can trace the root causes to
A. 20% of evil prone Muslims.
B. Evil laden elements in the Quran that trigger the above to commit evils.

Since we have already identify and trace the root causes of all the evils and violence in the world at present there is no need to go into your proposals which is a diversion.

The solution for 2. Religious related [Islam] evils and violence is to get rid of the evil laden elements in the Quran so there is nothing from the Quran to trigger the evil prone Muslims. While this resolved the sources of evil from the religion, it does not cure the inherent evil tendencies of the evil prone Muslims.

The evil prone Muslims will not be above to commit Quran-inspired-violence when we get rid of the evil laden elements in the Quran, but they will continue to commit secular evils.

Once we get rid of the root cause of Quran-inspired-violence, then humanity can focus on preventing ALL secular evils.

Then humanity must address the root causes of all secular evils, i.e.
A. 20% of evil prone humans
B. Secular evil laden elements that trigger the above to commit evils.

In the short run humanity must deal and get rid of all secular evil laden elements that triggers the evil prone to commit evils and violence. This will not be a 100% because the very hardcore evil prone will find ways to satisfy their lusts for evil.

Thus humanity must find ways to get rid [actually totally suppress] of the active evil tendencies within the brain of the evil prone. This is quite impossible at present without drugs and their side effects, but I am optimistic humanity will in the near future be able to suppress the evil tendencies in the evil prone without side effects.

Then there will be greater peace on Earth.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top