U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 12-30-2016, 02:57 AM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
3,440 posts, read 1,588,113 times
Reputation: 461

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif
And you are blind to hatred of the infidels against the Qur’aan. You are carrying on with that hatred because you do not believe in Allah and the Qur’aan tells us about believing Allah.
As I said I am very objective about human nature. Obviously there is animosity from the infidels against the Muslims. I have never denied that.
My point is, if Muhammad has not started with Islam based on some altered states of consciousness, there would be no animosity from the infidels.
Note this is human nature and happening everywhere.
The Quresh, Jews and Christians were living harmoniously without much evils and violence. It was only after Muhammad experience of altered states of consciousness that started it all when he started to preach his superior religions and condemn the religious practices of others.
There are lots of research done on the altered states of consciousness to the claim of being a Godman.
E.g. Link
I have read hundreds of such articles but I presumed you know nothing [or run away] of this reality and knowledge out there??

Quote:
Greater intensity? Where from did you get that charge against the Qur’aan of promoting “greater intensity”?

You ignorantly called “jihadan kabiran” a “greater intensity”, which means, “jihad” in your mind is now “intensity”.
I have given you the dictionary meaning where 'strive' is always associated with strenuous efforts, thus intensity and the related language of the Quran re 25:52.
This is proof you are the ignorant one of your own Quran which you claimed to have studied seriously for many years. But I am not surprised you overlooked what is the Quran's main message re 25:52.

Quote:
Your knowledge about “jihad” and, therefore, about the Qur’aan is now in serious question here. You are now fast becoming a mouth piece of the Qur’aan hating kuffar mentioned in the Qur’aan.
This is another libelous personal attack without proofs!!
What I have done is merely parroting the meaning of the Quran.
If the Quran said and meant X, then I said X objectively.
Looks your 'Jihadan kabiran" is totally off course from the actual meaning 'strive against' where strive involves greater strength than normal, greater intensity, and the likes.
There are many verses in the Quran where Muslims are exhorted to compete, vie with each other based on their best ability to please Allah. This is where 'jihad' and related [J H D] words are applicable. If another verse state 'fight', then a Muslim has to strive to fight harder.

Quote:
This hypothesis is nothing but ignorance about the Qur’aan. It ignores the vast majority of Muslims who read the same Qur’aan.
The evidence of the fact that there are SOME [not all] Muslims being involved in terrible evils and violence, and quoting the Quranic verses should enable any average person with average intelligence to formulate an 'effect from cause' hypothesis.
Firstly such hypothesizing must be encouraged.
The next step is to prove whether the hypothesis is true or not.
If true, then we do some thing about the conclusion.
If not true then we ignore it.
The point that you are trying to brush off my hypothesizing as a concern citizen of humanity is very telling of your nature.

Note when there was Ebola in West Africa, the whole world's attention in term of diseases was focus on that area. As such it is only natural that the rest of the world is ignored re this matter. Should we be complaining against this ignoring of others who did not suffer from Ebola. No because it is human nature to focus more on the problematic issue then the neutral issues. This is why bad news sell.

It is the same with Islam. Where there is a problem of evil with any relation to Islam, then it is only natural that humans should focus on the point of source of the problem which happened to the from a minority. Your complain of people ignoring the majority is wrong. I know you are basically intelligent, but when it comes to the issue of religion, your intelligent views are somehow suppressed

Quote:
Then you are collecting the only data that you think will help promote hatred against the Qur’aan, and you call it your “obvious hypothesis”.
You are complaining without understanding my basis. As I had stated, that was an omission. As far as the Quran is concerned there is no question of hiding data because the Quran is available for all to see.
You are imagining hatred.
I am merely a reporter, I report what is in the Quran and any one can counter check against the Quran.
Btw, whilst my error was an omission, your change of the texts is very deliberate to defy what Allah has intended to convey. To ya'budu Allah, you must understand and convey what Allah meant to convey.

The objectivity is to report what Allah intended to convey and if any verse has "X" elements [which happened to be evil from humanity's views] then we have to report and expressed as it is and not change it to suit our views.

Quote:
Should the believers love their enemies who were planning to sink them without trace after expelling them from their homes?
I can see why you wanted believers to love such infidel enemies.
There is no need for a God to give such advice. Human has the natural instincts to defend themselves. They may view others as enemies in the relevant circumstances & time and later mend fences to become friends.
With verses like 60:1 from an all-powerful God which is immutable there is no room to change and no one will dare to befriend non-Muslims even in secret because Allah knows all.
See the problem?

Quote:
You must be out of your mind if you think that those kuffar who had expelled Muslims from their homes, simply because they had believed Allah, were not their enemies. What happened to your famous rationality here?
Not sure of your point. What I had stated about 60:1 is Allah condoning Muslims not to befriend non-Muslims therein.

Quote:
You are lying here. You have failed to show me “evil and violence” is meant by the word “jihad” in the whole Qur’aan.
Prove to me the lie?
I stated many times in this reply, the term 'jihad' and its related JHD terms do not directly specify fighting and violence.

Quote:
You are now promoting hate against the Qur’aan and most Muslims who read the Qur’aan. This kind of hatred was promoted by those kuffar against Muslims 1400 years ago.
This is a personal attack and libelous based on your imagination.
Show me one verse of the Quran where I have wrongly interpreted?
I am repeating what the Quran has stated, if its verse expressed hate, evil and violence, then that the case as objectively proven by its own verses.
Note libel and slander others is a sin within the Quran.
104:1. Woe unto every slandering traducer
Quote:
LOL!
You LOL against your Allah's words? Note 104:1.

Quote:
What! You are equating peaceful infidels with those who had expelled the believers from their homes? You must have sold your rationality for hate.
Point here is the Quran has conflicting messages, i.e. DUCK-RABBIT verses.

Quote:
You have absolutely no chance of understanding the Qur’aan with this kind of statements after reading the Qur’aan 60+ times.

[60.1] O you who believe! Do not take My enemy and your enemy for friends: would you offer them love while they deny what has come to you of the truth, driving out the messenger and yourselves because you believe in Allah, your Lord? If you go forth struggling hard (jihadan) in My path and seeking My pleasure, would you manifest love to them? And I know what you conceal and what you manifest; and whoever of you does this, he indeed has gone astray from the straight path.

[60.8] Allah does not forbid you respecting those who have not made war against you on account of (your) religion, and have not driven you forth from your homes, that you show them kindness and deal with them justly; surely Allah loves the doers of justice.

[60.9] Allah only forbids you respecting those who made war upon you on account of (your) religion, and drove you forth from your homes and backed up (others) in your expulsion, that you make friends with them, and whoever makes friends with them, these are the unjust.

Proof enough that you will never understand the Qur’aan!

According to the Qur’aan (quoted above), infidels who have not waged war against Muslims because of their religion and have not expelled them out of their homes, and have not back up others in their expulsion, can be made friends, shown kindness and dealt with justly.
Point here is the Quran has conflicting messages, i.e. DUCK-RABBIT verses.

Quote:
Continuum, because of these lies against the Qur’aan, you are exposing yourself here as the Qur’aan hater and promoter of hate against the Qur’aan . Your argument here is a failed argument.
Note 104:1. As a Muslim it is sin for you. Though 104:1 is not applicable to me, I will refrain from stooping to that low level to counter slander.

Last edited by Continuum; 12-30-2016 at 03:08 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-30-2016, 04:25 AM
 
3,167 posts, read 1,042,053 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
It is obvious "“do not obey the kuffar” is negative, antagonistic and pejorative against the infidels thus support the point that believers must strive against them. I am ignoring them, I did not highlight them but any one can read them and their relevance to the term 'against'.
You are reading these verses with blinker on. You see a word ('against') in the verse that isn't even there and miss the word "bihi" ("with it") which is there and meant to be striving/struggling "with the guidance of the Qur'aan". Project? I now know what your project is. It is 'against' the Qur'aan and doomed to failure. The Qur'aan is the strength of Muslims. You may attack some ahadith which could be fabrication but you haven't an iota of hope in proving that the Qur'aan is the cause of evil and violence by some Muslims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I have said there is no mentioned of fight or killed in 25:52. What is convey is an antagonistic stance and posturing against the infidels with feeling of contempt and hate. The concept of warfare comes from other verses.
In which "jihad" isn't even mentioned. Those verses to do with fighting are in defense. You give me the verses that tell Muslims to fight peaceful infidels. Quote them here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
"strive against" is generally represented by the use of extra effort. Note,
1. to exert oneself vigorously; try hard:
2. to make strenuous efforts toward any goal:
to strive for success.
3. to contend in opposition, battle, or any conflict; compete.
4. to struggle vigorously, as in opposition or resistance:
Strive | Define Strive at Dictionary.com
"Strive against" is the same as "struggle against" in these verses. You are ignorant about this fact in the Qur'aan.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You are ignorant of the exact meaning of 'strive' and 'strive against' [see above] but have the cheek to condemn my vocabulary competence.
Your Arabic vocabulary comprehension has been proven to be useless in case of "jihad". Now you want to talk about vocabulary comprehension of "jahid" and "fight" and "expulsion from their homes"???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Now do you agree "strive against' imply 'great strength' [strenuous efforts] or do you still insist I am wrong [presumaby stupid]? I suggest you must eat back your own words on this issue.
You are exposing your ignorance here about this verse in which 'against' isn't even there. It is striving/struggling (jahid) "with it" (with the guidance of the Qur'aan). It means have patience and do not give up your deen but trust the guidance of the Qur'aan. You keep imagining it to be "evilish" jihad in your ignorance about the vocabulary in the verses of the Qur'aan.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I did agree the verses with 'jihad' re J H D' do not specific warfare specifically.
Now you know something about the vocabulary in the Qur'aan in reference to just one word "jihad". It is not warfare against peaceful non-Muslims. If you want to argue about vocabulary in English language then this is not the forum for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
As I had shown you the dictionary meaning of 'strive' you have to eat your own words on this and change your views on 25:52.
You couldn't be less serious here. Strive in 25:52 is struggle under pressure from kuffar. It is the same strive/struggle that an oppressed has to do. You will have to eat what you are cooking here the same way the you had to eat what you and others had cooked about the word "jihad".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I have not stated the 'strive against' in 25:52 is specifically and directly related to 'warfare.' 25:52 instigate the aggressive intense posturing and other verses [3,400] combine and culminate in inspiring SOME [not all] evil prone Muslims to fight and kill non-Muslims and other Muslims.
If "strive/struggle" in 25:52 is not specifically and directly related to 'warfare' against kuffar then what is it about? Think about it before you come up with another of your vocabulary and definition.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-30-2016, 06:03 AM
 
3,167 posts, read 1,042,053 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You missed the point.
I stated the texts of the revelation recited by Muhammad are immutable, i.e. cannot be changed.
But the specific treaty with the Qureshi are not immutable [has no more validity] in one sense at they are all dead.
It is not applicable now because of the context of those verses (they are all dead). All those kuffar are dead now. The strive/struggle was against those oppressors who are now dead. Why are you defending those oppressors now?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I would say you are very ignorant on this issue re jihad politicians and western media.
The term 'jihad' is in the English dictionary
Jihad | Define Jihad at Dictionary.com
and the origin was from mid 1800s.
Wrong! The word "jihad" is in the Qur'aan long before 1800s.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You missed the point.
I stated the texts of the revelation recited by Muhammad are immutable, i.e. cannot be changed.
But the specific treaty with the Qureshi are not immutable [has no more validity] in one sense at they are all dead.
That's right, those kuffar are dead. They did wage wars on Muslims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I would say you are very ignorant on this issue re jihad politicians and western media.
The term 'jihad' is in the English dictionary
Jihad | Define Jihad at Dictionary.com
and the origin was from mid 1800s.

If you read the wiki article on this, this term was promoted by SOME Muslims long ago, then in the 1800s to the dictionaries. The term jihad is not a brainwashed term by jihad politicians and Western medias. Get it! Stick to the truth and not lies.
It is in the Qur'aan and stupid people regard it as warfare by Muslims against the peaceful non-Muslims. You are now beginning to change your mind but won't admit it is being used incorrectly by the ignorant politicians, media and the English dictionaries.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Note the very false, stupid irrational term "Islamophobia" promoted by SOME Muslims and accepted by the majority.
Actually, there is a new term going to be invented soon if you carry on here with your Qur'aanphobia.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The term "jihad" currently is used within English to represent "holy war against the kuffar" and the majority understand it as "holy war against the kuffar" without fail.
"Jihad" as holy war in English is in ignorance. "Jihad" in the Qur'aan is not warfare against peaceful kuffar but strive/struggle when under oppression and hardship.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
It is the same with 'jihad' in the English language, where at present 'jihad' by default = "holy war against the kuffar."
What is "holy war" in English? What is "holy" about war?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
There is nothing wrong as far as language and vocabulary is concern because that is what the English dictionaries said so.
But the word "jihad" is Arabic in the Qur'aan. You accept it as the politicians and media are presenting it. It is not presented so in the Qur'aan. Thus they present it different from the Qur'aan in ignorance about the Qur'aan. Would you buy the same ignorance for your project?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
How this came about is from SOME zealous Muslims long time ago and not due to jihad politicians and the media. So stop bullsh:ting on this.
Funny how you ignore what is in the Qur'aan about "jihad" but want to rely on some unknown "Muslims long time ago". Is your project about the Qur'aan, and what is in it, or some unknown non-existing Muslims long time ago and politicians today?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I believe the term 'jihad' in the Arabic dictionary also has a meaning relating to 'holy war' [??]
What is the meaning of "holy war" in the same dictionary? I am certain it won't be warfare by Muslims against peaceful Muslims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Now as far as the Quran and Islam proper is concern, 'jihad' and the related words with J H D, do not mean specifically meant "warfare" or fight at all.
'Jihad' literally mean variously depending on context;
strive, struggle, put extra effort,
To strive or labour or toil, exert oneself or his power or efforts,
employ oneself vigorously or diligently or studiously,
take extra pains,
put oneself to trouble or fatigue,
very eagerly desire or long for something,
be in a state of extreme difficulty or trouble,
strive after, struggle against difficulties.
I have never translated 'jihad' in the Quranic language perspective directly into fighting or warfare.
(note I am learning 'The Language of the Quran')
There are other verses that combine to represent fighting and warfare.
O.K. I think you have made it clear that you are learning. Fair enough!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You always think your are right, but in many occasions I have demonstrated and proved you are wrong. Humbly, you have never on any occasion been able to prove I am wrong with certainty. As I explained your "jihadan kabiran" in (25:52) is only in your imagination and it is wrong in context of the verse.
As stated above, note the point bolded.
You are now backsliding once more. What do you think is 'jihadan kabiran' in 25:52?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
There you go again, putting words into my mouth. I have never translated "jihad" directly as warfare against infidels.
I will have to respond to this one later with proof of what you had stated about "jihad".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Yes, the term 'jihad' [per English dictionaries based on acts of some Muslims] is not in 60:1. I know about that. 60:1 promote an enmity stance but did not specify Muslims must specifically attack infidels.
60:1 mentions enmity of kuffar who had expelled Muslims from their homes. You ignore it completely and still moan about "enmity" due to them not making friends of their enemies. Your rationality here is in a twist. Pull yourself together!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
From the above, I have provided my rational, objective, intellectual right meaning from the perspective of the English dictionaries and the perspective of the Quran and Islam proper.
Not at all! We are not talking about the English dictionary here but the Qur'aan and Islam you are still learning about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
As I had stated these are SOME the verses related to 'fight' in contrast to verses with 'jihad' where 'fight' is not mentioned.
Yes, "jihad" is not fighting as warfare but inner struggle against hardship. The fighting allowed in the Qur'aan is in defense only. "Fight those who fight you" and stop when they stop is also principle in the Qur'aan. Would you now want to discuss your imagined offensive "fighting" too?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-30-2016, 09:09 AM
 
3,167 posts, read 1,042,053 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
As I said I am very objective about human nature. Obviously there is animosity from the infidels against the Muslims. I have never denied that.
Then be fair when talking about the verses of the Qur’aan in which there was animosity from the kuffar against Muslims.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
My point is, if Muhammad has not started with Islam based on some altered states of consciousness, there would be no animosity from the infidels.
He had started with Islam, not with animosity. It was the kuffar who had started the animosity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The Quresh, Jews and Christians were living harmoniously without much evils and violence. It was only after Muhammad experience of altered states of consciousness that started it all when he started to preach his superior religions and condemn the religious practices of others.
He had the right to preach. Preaching wasn’t killing anyone. The kuffar had killed Muslims and wanted to kill Muhammad too. The kuffar had even taken all the possessions from Muslim homes to sell them for money. Not only that but they followed Muslims to Madina some 325 miles from their homes in Mecca. Fighting and killings were started by the kuffars and not by the Muslims.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I have read hundreds of such articles but I presumed you know nothing [or run away] of this reality and knowledge out there??
Those articles are not from the Qur’aan. No point in saying what is in the article when talking about what is in the Qur’aan.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I have given you the dictionary meaning where 'strive' is always associated with strenuous efforts, thus intensity and the related language of the Quran re 25:52.
’Strive’ in 25:52 is ‘struggle’ in hardship. You are ignorant of such language of the Qur’aan.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
This is proof you are the ignorant one of your own Quran which you claimed to have studied seriously for many years. But I am not surprised you overlooked what is the Quran's main message re 25:52.
I have proven to you, and you have admitted already of your ignorance, about “jihad” in 25:52 that it is ‘struggle’ and not “intensity”, “strength” or even “great intensity”. This is a result of years of study on my part.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Looks your 'Jihadan kabiran" is totally off course from the actual meaning 'strive against' where strive involves greater strength than normal, greater intensity, and the likes.
You still haven’t understood that ‘jihadan kabiran’ does not mean “great intensity” or “great strength”. You are totally off course here as you think ‘kabiran’ is “intensity” or “strength”. What is ‘jihadan’ then; “greater”?
Can you even see your ignorance about ‘jihadan kabiran’ in your error?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
There are many verses in the Quran where Muslims are exhorted to compete, vie with each other based on their best ability to please Allah. This is where 'jihad' and related [J H D] words are applicable. If another verse state 'fight', then a Muslim has to strive to fight harder.
That is how you misinterpret “jihad” by slyly linking it to warfare. Don’t deny it after this comment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The evidence of the fact that there are SOME [not all] Muslims being involved in terrible evils and violence, and quoting the Quranic verses should enable any average person with average intelligence to formulate an 'effect from cause' hypothesis.
No average person with average intelligence ignore the effect of the Qur’aan verses on a VAST MAJORITY of Muslims.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Firstly such hypothesizing must be encouraged.
The next step is to prove whether the hypothesis is true or not.
If true, then we do some thing about the conclusion.
If not true then we ignore it.
The point that you are trying to brush off my hypothesizing as a concern citizen of humanity is very telling of your nature.
What is telling of your nature is that you want to concentrate on a minority and overlook the majority. That’s why your hypothesis will will prove to be nothing but hatred against the Qur’aan.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Note when there was Ebola in West Africa, the whole world's attention in term of diseases was focus on that area. As such it is only natural that the rest of the world is ignored re this matter. Should we be complaining against this ignoring of others who did not suffer from Ebola. No because it is human nature to focus more on the problematic issue then the neutral issues. This is why bad news sell.
That is another example given in ignorance. Other people did not have Ebola but in the case of the Qur’aan the MAJORITY read the same Qur’aan. Therefore the disease is not the Qur’aan but the disease is in the minds of those who do not try to understand the Qur’aan. You couldn’t understand the word “jihad” in the Qur’aan. It took me a few days to make you learn about this word in the Qur’aan. How long are you going to take to learn about the rest of the words of the Qur’aan? Years? Decades?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
It is the same with Islam. Where there is a problem of evil with any relation to Islam, then it is only natural that humans should focus on the point of source of the problem which happened to the from a minority. Your complain of people ignoring the majority is wrong.
It is ignorance to ignore the majority. It is never done in either a democracy or in a law court. You are selling here your ignorance about the Qur'aan and Islam.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I know you are basically intelligent, but when it comes to the issue of religion, your intelligent views are somehow suppressed
Give us a break, will you? Only an unintelligent person will learn about religion from a non-religious person.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You are complaining without understanding my basis. As I had stated, that was an omission. As far as the Quran is concerned there is no question of hiding data because the Quran is available for all to see.
Exactly my point too; the Qur’an is there for all to read. It is the misrepresentation of it that we will always expose whether it is from people like you or any other evil one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You are imagining hatred.
I am merely a reporter, I report what is in the Quran and any one can counter check against the Quran.
You need to learn about the Qur’aan first before you can report about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Btw, whilst my error was an omission, your change of the texts is very deliberate to defy what Allah has intended to convey. To ya'budu Allah, you must understand and convey what Allah meant to convey.
Allah had intended and did convey that humans and jinn must not worship any other god than Allah. That is the quite obvious but you can't understand it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The objectivity is to report what Allah intended to convey and if any verse has "X" elements [which happened to be evil from humanity's views] then we have to report and expressed as it is and not change it to suit our views.
Exactly my point. Don’t you represent the whole humanity when you have just begun to understand just one word (“jihad”) properly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
With verses like 60:1 from an all-powerful God which is immutable there is no room to change and no one will dare to befriend non-Muslims even in secret because Allah knows all.
See the problem?
I see your problem. Read 60:8-9 and your ignorance about 60:1 should vanish.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Not sure of your point. What I had stated about 60:1 is Allah condoning Muslims not to befriend non-Muslims therein.
Non-Muslims who had expelled the Muslims from their homes for no reason other than that they believed in One God rather than 360. Are you blind to that point?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Prove to me the lie?
I stated many times in this reply, the term 'jihad' and its related JHD terms do not directly specify fighting and violence.
You are being two-faced here. Here is what you had said:
“Do not befriend infidels but strive in Allah Way which include evils and violence is tons of verses in the Quran.”
That is how you had portrayed strive/struggle (“jihad”) in Allah’s Way. It was a lie. Do you want more like this that you had said?
“Therefore to deliberate on this issue we must take into account all the 3,400+ verses to understand how they inspire SOME Muslims to commit evils and violence.”

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
This is a personal attack and libelous based on your imagination.
Show me one verse of the Quran where I have wrongly interpreted?
Which verse of the Qur’aan to do with “jihad” did you interpret as, “Do not befriend infidels but strive in Allah Way which include evils and violence…”?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
I am repeating what the Quran has stated, if its verse expressed hate, evil and violence, then that the case as objectively proven by its own verses.
Repeat the verse that says, “Do not befriend infidels but strive in Allah Way which include evils and violence...”

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Note libel and slander others is a sin within the Quran.
exposing their lie is not sin.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
104:1. Woe unto every slandering traducer
You LOL against your Allah's words? Note 104:1.
No. I LOL against your words:
“Infidels are even threaten if they secretly befriend non-Muslims. Allah will know if they do so even secretly and they will be sent to Hell. You did not realize why I LOL. Have another LOL!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Point here is the Quran has conflicting messages, i.e. DUCK-RABBIT verses.
Certainly not conflicting for me but may be conflicting for you and of the same intelligence to comprehend a written text.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2016, 12:56 AM
 
2,050 posts, read 663,807 times
Reputation: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
My friend you appear to be in a very strong Jihad to destroy Islam by any means available to you.

At the same time it is my jihad to defend Islam by peaceful means and to do my best to point out where I find error.

Perhaps if you can understand you are fighting in the promotion of your beliefs(engaging in aggressive Jihad), you will understand that Jihad is not a command for violence
Islamic Jihad is obligatory
So why do you deny this fact
Jihad for the sake of God
It is an Islamic concept
It does not have any religion in the world calling for jihad for the sake of God
Jewish books in which no concept of jihad for Allah
Christian books in which no concept of jihad for Allah
Other religions and I think she did not know the concept of jihad for Allah
Why are you trying to hide the truth
A true Muslim is one of the calls for jihad
The seriousness of Islam he brain washed followers
When you see that the killer is a hero
The best example
Is Muhammad
While Mohammed gave the order for the slaughter of 500 Jews
Consider champion Muhammad and Prophet
When she marries a minor
When marry a wife slain
They consider the Prophet of mercy
This is a brainwashing
For this reason, despite all the evidence of the books of the Muslims are trying to twisting and turning
Is the jihad for Allah a Muslim hypotheses some call the sixth pillar of Islam, [64] [65]
This attitude of Muslim thinkers of Jihad
Why you trying to say that jihad is not present in Islam
I hope you for your honest؟؟؟؟؟
2-Jihad Continuous the Day of Resurrection
First constants: Jihad Continuous the Day of Resurrection: -
The world today but from the womb of God stands with all his strength Streptococcus and political, economic, media and cultural and folk, standing one-stop with all his strength, in front of the rituals of our religion is not a rite of jihad for the sake of God, the ritual imposed by God on us, saying { the books you dislike it for you and it may be that you dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. Allah knows and you know not.} and said, {O Prophet, struggle with the unbelievers and the hypocrites and be harsh against them and their abode is hell} and saying {fight those who believe not in Allah nor Day the other does not forbid what God and His Messenger, nor condemn the religion of truth from those who were given the book until they pay tribute out of hand and they are submissive} said in another thing that came down in the rule of jihad, stressing it {When the sacred months then kill the idolaters wherever ye find and take them and count them and sit you for them each observatory if they repent and establish regular prayers and regular charity, then they leave their way Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.}This ritual, which tried infidels erase them and call them terrorism and criminality, and marking their owners terrorists and extremists and the rebels and militias, and also helped them hypocrites on distorted and quarrying by baseball Satanic various Sometimes they say that jihad jihad pay not asked, or said that jihad is prescribed for the Liberation of the occupied territory only, or that jihad must The customer is at the behest of the Jews and the Crusaders ruling, and another time they said that jihad is over the death of the Prophet peace be upon him, or that jihad does not suit the present era of peace the new World order era seek refuge with Allah from such delusions.
Above all, he has told the Messenger of Allah and peace be upon him that the past jihad until God inherits the earth and them, and this news human constants that do not doubt it
He says, stressing it constantly Jihad in the last verse was revealed concerning Jihad, Ayatollah sword {When the sacred months then kill the idolaters wherever ye find and take them and count them and sit you for them all repent, and establish regular prayers and regular charity, then leave their way, God is Forgiving, Merciful} and evidence of continuing jihad book a lot .
The function is the continuation of the jihad of the year texts
----------------------------------------------------------
This any opinions Muslims for Jihad
So why misinformation
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2016, 04:33 AM
 
3,167 posts, read 1,042,053 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
My friend you appear to be in a very strong Jihad to destroy Islam by any means available to you.

At the same time it is my jihad to defend Islam by peaceful means and to do my best to point out where I find error.

Perhaps if you can understand you are fighting in the promotion of your beliefs(engaging in aggressive Jihad), you will understand that Jihad is not a command for violence
Woodrow LI,

When someone is brainwashed to believe since the day he came into this world that "jihad" in Islam is killing peaceful non-muslims, he has no hope of learning any other way about "jihad".

Salaam

Khalif
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2016, 10:25 AM
 
9,946 posts, read 8,197,218 times
Reputation: 13496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
Woodrow LI,

When someone is brainwashed to believe since the day he came into this world that "jihad" in Islam is killing peaceful non-muslims, he has no hope of learning any other way about "jihad".

Salaam

Khalif
Prior to the revolution in Iran I never heard of Islam (I'm 48 years old). My first connection with Islam was seeing what was described on the evening news as "Islamic students" holding American embassy workers hostage. Then came the cruise ship and airline hijackings by Muslims. In some of those hijackings American soldiers and a handicap Jewish man in a wheelchair were beaten, tortured, and executed. Then came the 1990s and the era of Bin Laden and multiple attacks around the world in the name of Allah. Seeing reports of Muslim terrorist attacks in the Philippines, Bali, Russia Israel, Egypt, Somalia, France, England, India, and USA. Seeing the things done to people in the name of Islam in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and other places where the nation's laws are the laws of Islam. And now we see the threat growing across Europe with gang rapes, Sharia patrols enforcing sharia laws on infidels, and more terrorist atttacks.

Sure, not every Muslim is a terrorist. But how many Muslims provide financial, technical, medical, material, and recruitment support for those terrorist?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2016, 01:15 PM
 
3,167 posts, read 1,042,053 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by victimofGM View Post
Prior to the revolution in Iran I never heard of Islam (I'm 48 years old).
I am not surprised; you were not even born yet.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2016, 03:19 PM
 
2,050 posts, read 663,807 times
Reputation: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
Woodrow LI,

When someone is brainwashed to believe since the day he came into this world that "jihad" in Islam is killing peaceful non-muslims, he has no hope of learning any other way about "jihad".

Salaam

Khalif
If you want to learn how to prevent diseases
You go and extrapolation books on medicine
And if you want to understand the meaning of the voltage and amps
You go and extrapolation books on Electricity
But the definition of Jihad and Mujahid
And the meaning for God's sake
Thou extrapolation books that explain these words
It Koran
And also the old Islamic books
And Islamic scholars in this time
If the verses of the Koran says jihad is obligatory on Muslims
It means that you can not cancel this duty
But they are obligatory offensive
This is drawn from the verses of the Koran
Jihad is not only to defend
But to attack in order to spread the word of Islam
This is the essence of Jihad in Islam
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-31-2016, 04:40 PM
 
9,946 posts, read 8,197,218 times
Reputation: 13496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
I am not surprised; you were not even born yet.
I'm talking about the one that took place in the late 1970s when the Shah of Iran became ill and later died.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top