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Old 12-18-2016, 01:00 AM
 
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verse 50
O Prophet! Verily Ohllna you wives who came wages and possessed right hand, which Allah has bestowed on you and daughters of your uncle and daughters Amatk and daughters uncle and daughters Khalatk who have migrated with you and a woman locked that devote herself to the Prophet, the Prophet wanted to Istnkhaa pure you without the faithful have learned what we imposed on them in their spouses and possess their oaths lest you be critical of Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful
in verse 51

Note the Prophet authority
He admits he wants from them

While verse 52

Not lawful for you women, nor to change them for other pairs if you like Hassanhn only what possessed right hand of God was on everything sergeant

Are orders to the Prophet
That does not alter his wives even if he liked the beauty of women
But only the right of ownership of any slaves

Will the Muslim able to remove this contradiction between these three verses from the Koran
This particular verses in the personality of Muhammad only
I repeat
Verses 50-51- 52
From Surat Alihzab

 
Old 12-18-2016, 03:03 AM
 
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There is no contradiction in the verses except in their number (50, 51, 52). The contradiction is only in your understanding of these verses. Now don't think that I am contradicting myself.

Have a Merry Christmas but don't get tipsy or else you will see many more contradictions.
 
Old 12-18-2016, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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For our non-Muslim members that do not understand Arabic, here are 3 Translations.

Al-Ahzab (The Confederates) – 33

O PROPHET! Behold, We have made lawful to thee thy wives unto whom thou hast paid their dowers, [57] as well as those whom thy right hand has come to possess from among the captives of war whom God has bestowed upon thee. [58] And [We have made lawful to thee] the daughters of thy paternal uncles and aunts, and the daughters of thy maternal uncles and aunts, who have migrated with thee [to Yathrib]; [59] and any believing woman who offers herself freely to the Prophet and whom the Prophet might be willing to wed: [60] [this latter being but] a privilege for thee, and not for other believers - [seeing that] We have already made known what We have enjoined upon them with regard to their wives and those whom their right hands may possess. [61] [And] in order that thou be not burdened with [undue] anxiety - for God is indeed much-forgiving, a dispenser of grace – - 33:50 (Asad)

Al-Ahzab (The Confederates) - 33:51
[know that] thou mayest put off for a time whichever of them thou pleasest, and mayest take unto thee whichever thou pleasest; and [that,] if thou seek out any from whom thou hast kept away [for a time], thou wilt incur no sin [thereby]: [62] this will make it more likely that their eyes are gladdened [whenever they see thee], [63] and that they do not grieve [whenever they are overlooked], and that all of them may find contentment in whatever thou hast to give them: for God [alone] knows what is in your hearts - and God is indeed all-knowing, for*bearing. [64] - 33:51 (Asad)

Al-Ahzab (The Confederates) - 33:52
No [other] women shall henceforth be lawful to thee [65] nor art thou [allowed] to supplant [any of] them by other wives, [66] even though their beauty should please thee greatly -: [none shall be lawful to thee] beyond those whom thou [already] hast come to possess. [67] And God keeps watch over everything. - 33:52 (Asad)


Al-Ahzab (The Confederates) – 33

O Prophet! We have made lawful to thee thy wives to whom thou hast paid their dowers; and those whom thy right hand possesses out of the prisoners of war whom Allah has assigned to thee; and daughters of thy paternal uncles and aunts, and daughters of thy maternal uncles and aunts, who migrated (from Makka) with thee; and any believing woman who dedicates her soul to the Prophet if the Prophet wishes to wed her;- this only for thee, and not for the Believers (at large); We know what We have appointed for them as to their wives and the captives whom their right hands possess;- in order that there should be no difficulty for thee. And Allah is Oft- Forgiving, Most Merciful. - 33:50 (Y. Ali)

Thou mayest defer (the turn of) any of them that thou pleasest, and thou mayest receive any thou pleasest: and there is no blame on thee if thou invite one whose (turn) thou hadst set aside. This were nigher to the cooling of their eyes, the prevention of their grief, and their satisfaction - that of all of them - with that which thou hast to give them: and Allah knows (all) that is in your hearts: and Allah is All- Knowing, Most Forbearing. - 33:51 (Y. Ali)

It is not lawful for thee (to marry more) women after this, nor to change them for (other) wives, even though their beauty attract thee, except any thy right hand should possess (as handmaidens): and Allah doth watch over all things. - 33:52 (Y. Ali)


Al-Ahzab (The Confederates) – 33

O Prophet! Lo! We have made lawful unto thee thy wives unto whom thou hast paid their dowries, and those whom thy right hand possesseth of those whom Allah hath given thee as spoils of war, and the daughters of thine uncle on the father's side and the daughters of thine aunts on the father's side, and the daughters of thine uncles on the mother's side emigrated with thee, and a believing woman if she give herself unto the Prophet and the Prophet desire to ask her in marriage, a privilege for thee only, not for the (rest of) believers. We are aware of that which We enjoined upon them concerning their wives and those whom their right hands possess that thou mayst be free from blame, for Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. - 33:50 (Picktall)


Thou canst defer whom thou wilt of them and receive unto thee whom thou wilt, and whomsoever thou desirest of those whom thou hast set aside (temporarily), it is no sin for thee (to receive her again); that is better; that they may be comforted and not grieve, and may all be pleased with what thou givest them. Allah knoweth what is in your hearts (O men) and Allah is Forgiving, Clement. - 33:51 (Picktall)


It is not allowed thee to take (other) women henceforth nor that thou shouldst change them for other wives even though their beauty pleased thee, save those whom thy right hand possesseth. And Allah is Watcher over all things. - 33:52 (Picktall)

The main problem is when people with no Qur'anic knowledge attempts to explain the Qur'an.


Let the reader them self decide if there is any contradiction among those ayyat.

I will choose to quote some one more knowledgeable than myself on the meaning of those 3 ayyat

Quote:
In verses 50-52 a special regulation of marriage has been laid down for the Holy Prophet, which points out that he is an exception to the several restrictions that have been imposed on the other Muslims in regard to marital life.

In verses 53-55 the second step was taken towards social reform. It consists of the following injunctions: Restriction on the other men to visit the houses of the Holy Prophet's wives; Islamic etiquette concerning visits and invitations; the law that only the near relatives could visit the holy wives in their houses; as for the other men, they could speak to or ask them a thing from behind a curtain; the injunction that the Holy Prophet's wives were forbidden for the Muslims like their mothers; and none could marry any of them after him.

33. Surah Al Ahzab (The Clans) - Sayyid Abul Ala Maududi - Tafhim al-Qur'an - The Meaning of the Qur'an


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Old 12-18-2016, 02:34 PM
 
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There is no contradiction in the 3 verses. Those who have not studied the Qur'aan properly and do not know when these verses were revealed will imagine some contradictions. They would not know that the verse 33:52 was not revealed at the same time as the verse 33:50.

The verse 33:50 is a much earlier verse (an early period of wars after the migration to Madina). The verse 33:52 is of a much later period (by now no war from Meccan was expected after their utterly failed attack on Madina at the Trench).

Our non-Muslim posters may not know the background to these verses. Even though these are together in the chapter they were not revealed together.

Peace

Khalif
 
Old 12-18-2016, 08:14 PM
 
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OK
Studying verse 50 from surat -alahzab

1-O Prophet unto you Ohllna wives who came wages
[SIZE=5]يَا أَيُّهَا النَّبِيُّ إِنَّا أَحْلَلْنَا لَكَ أَزْوَاجَكَ الَّلاتِي آتَيْتَ أُجُورَهُنَّ
[/SIZE]

[SIZE=5][SIZE=5]أُجُورَهُنَّ=[/SIZE][/SIZE] wages

2-What possessed right hand, which Allah has bestowed you[SIZE=5]
وَمَا مَلَكَتْ يَمِينُكَ مِمَّا أَفَاء اللَّهُ عَلَيْكَ
[/SIZE]

[SIZE=5][SIZE=5]وَمَا مَلَكَتْ يَمِينُكَ[/SIZE]=[/SIZE]What possessed right hand
3-Your uncle and daughters and daughters Amatk uncle and daughters and daughters who have migrated with you Khalatk[SIZE=5]
وَبَنَاتِ عَمِّكَ وَبَنَاتِ عَمَّاتِكَ وَبَنَاتِ خَالِكَ وَبَنَاتِ خَالاتِكَ الَّلاتِي هَاجَرْنَ مَعَكَ
[/SIZE]

4-The woman locked to devote herself to the Prophet, the Prophet wanted to Istnkhaa pure you without believers
[SIZE=5]وَامْرَأَةً مُّؤْمِنَةً إِن وَهَبَتْ نَفْسَهَا لِلنَّبِيِّ إِنْ أَرَادَ النَّبِيُّ أَن يَسْتَنكِحَهَا خَالِصَةً لَّكَ مِن دُونِ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ
[/SIZE]

5-We have taught us what we assume they possess in their spouses and their oaths lest you be awkward, and Allah is Forgiving, Most Merciful[SIZE=5]قَدْ عَلِمْنَا مَا فَرَضْنَا عَلَيْهِمْ فِي أَزْوَاجِهِمْ وَمَا مَلَكَتْ أَيْمَانُهُمْ لِكَيْلا يَكُونَ عَلَيْكَ حَرَجٌ وَكَانَ اللَّهُ غَفُورًا رَّحِيمًا
[/SIZE]
These are the provisions of a special verse to Muhammad only
Any women who are unable to marry her
Or practiced with sex without marriage weakness[SIZE=5][SIZE=5]وَمَا مَلَكَتْ يَمِينُكَ[/SIZE]=[/SIZE]What possessed right hand

So is the state dedicated to Muhammad

Now we examine verse 51 from surat -al-ahzab

1-Terje wants from them[SIZE=5]
تُرْجِي مَن تَشَاء مِنْهُنَّ
2-[/SIZE]

And is home to you than you want[SIZE=5]وَتُؤْوِي إِلَيْكَ مَن تَشَاء
3-[/SIZE]

I Aptgat who are isolated do not stand you[SIZE=5]وَمَنِ ابْتَغَيْتَ مِمَّنْ عَزَلْتَ فَلا جُنَاحَ عَلَيْكَ
4-[/SIZE]

That minimum to acknowledge their eyes and sorrowful and Ardan including Atihn all of them, and God knows what is in your hearts, and Allah is Knower, meek[SIZE=5] ذَلِكَ أَدْنَى أَن تَقَرَّ أَعْيُنُهُنَّ وَلا يَحْزَنَّ وَيَرْضَيْنَ بِمَا آتَيْتَهُنَّ كُلُّهُنَّ وَاللَّهُ يَعْلَمُ مَا فِي قُلُوبِكُمْ وَكَانَ اللَّهُ عَلِيمًا حَلِيمًا
[/SIZE]
This verse explains verse before labyrinthi
They are complemented by 50-51
And verse 51 are the powers and authorities of the Muhammad Ali of his wives
And I did not get out of the text of the verses
Because I speak Arabic and type in the Arabic language
And I do not need to guide teach me understand words
Now we examine verse 52
Not lawful for you women, nor to change them for other pairs if you like Hassanhn only what possessed right hand of God was on everything sergeant
1-Not lawful for you women after[SIZE=5]لا يَحِلُّ لَكَ النِّسَاء مِن بَعْدُ
2-[/SIZE]

Nor to change them for other pairs[SIZE=5]وَلا أَن تَبَدَّلَ بِهِنَّ مِنْ أَزْوَاجٍ
3-[/SIZE]

If you liked Hassanhn[SIZE=5] وَلَوْ أَعْجَبَكَ حُسْنُهُنَّ
4-[/SIZE]

Except what your right hand possess
5-
God was everything sergeant
[SIZE=5] وَكَانَ اللَّهُ عَلَى كُلِّ شَيْءٍ رَّقِيبًا
[/SIZE]

Here we note restriction in replacing wives even if he liked the beauty of women

This is a contradiction
That verse 50 where legalization
And verse 52 where restriction

We note that theWhat possessed right hand are not covered

I relied on reading in these verses
It is especially in the personality of Muhammad
It does not include others
Note that Muhammad married a daughter-in adoptions
And those of any other
The theme of last
Will you join me study this service to Muslims who do not know Arabic well
 
Old 12-18-2016, 10:48 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mahasn sawresho View Post

We note that the What possessed right hand are not covered.
You are right, there is a contradiction.

The Quran allows 4 wives [context was actually orphans].

But in 33:52 the Quran allow more that 4 wives if the wives are 'what the right hand possessed' for the prophet.

Personally I believe 33:51-53 has more to do with legal sex and marriage is a side point.
It meant, henceforth [after this 33:51-52] the prophet can have sex with those 9 wives he already had married earlier and can have sex legally with his slaves any time.


Morally, a wise God would never get involved in the above matters in such a manner which allow ONLY men marrying 4 wives as an eternal divine law.
Note the present emotional and psychological turmoil caused to many women when lusty Muslim men decide to marry more than one up to four because Allah said so.
It is more like I [Muhammad or some group of men] said so.

From the perspective of human nature, the sexual lust is one of the most powerful human drive.
Because the Quran was authored by humans [God is impossible to exists] it inevitable will get entangled with sexual lusts.
 
Old 12-18-2016, 11:12 PM
 
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Reputation: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You are right, there is a contradiction.

The Quran allows 4 wives [context was actually orphans].

But in 33:52 the Quran allow more that 4 wives if the wives are 'what the right hand possessed' for the prophet.

Personally I believe 33:51-53 has more to do with legal sex and marriage is a side point.
It meant, henceforth [after this 33:51-52] the prophet can have sex with those 9 wives he already had married earlier and can have sex legally with his slaves any time.


Morally, a wise God would never get involved in the above matters in such a manner which allow ONLY men marrying 4 wives as an eternal divine law.
Note the present emotional and psychological turmoil caused to many women when lusty Muslim men decide to marry more than one up to four because Allah said so.
It is more like I [Muhammad or some group of men] said so.

From the perspective of human nature, the sexual lust is one of the most powerful human drive.
Because the Quran was authored by humans [God is impossible to exists] it inevitable will get entangled with sexual lusts.
Thank you
These verses written in the Koran
It is especially dedicated to Muhammad
Because in verse 50 offers a census to women allowed to Mohammed to marry them
In verse 51 where the powers of the Muhammad Ali of his wives
But in the third verse
It is 52
Is the apparent restriction to Muhammad that he will not be able to marry, even if he liked their beauty
It It excludes what the right hand possessed in verses 50 and 52

And put them in the standard right
Muhammad has a special standard in sexual relations
The believers have a special standard in sexual relationships
So what is the superiority
Did God put this discrimination
Or that God does not have a function that only census works to Muhammad's wives
What humanity benefit from this Islamic Thought
Questions sent to every free thinker
Note that the Koran is interpreted in his own words to it the status of God
I call on every person looking in Islam that he read these verses
 
Old 12-19-2016, 07:55 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You are right, there is a contradiction.
He is not right and you are wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
The Quran allows 4 wives [context was actually orphans].
The Qur'an allowed "up to" 4 wives at a time when there were many women in need of protection. This allowance was made with a condition or else only one (4:3).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
But in 33:52 the Quran allow more that 4 wives if the wives are 'what the right hand possessed' for the prophet.
The Qur'an allowed more than 4 wives anyway. Up to 4 is only for the believers at large.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Personally I believe 33:51-53 has more to do with legal sex and marriage is a side point.
There is no "legal sex without marriage" in Islam.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
It meant, henceforth [after this 33:51-52] the prophet can have sex with those 9 wives he already had married earlier and can have sex legally with his slaves any time.
Wrong!

33:52 means the prophet can't marry another free woman but still can marry any woman under his protection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Morally, a wise God would never get involved in the above matters in such a manner which allow ONLY men marrying 4 wives as an eternal divine law.
It's not an eternal divine law. Can you back up your claim that marrying 4 wives is an eternal dine law?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
Note the present emotional and psychological turmoil caused to many women when lusty Muslim men decide to marry more than one up to four because Allah said so.
It is more like I [Muhammad or some group of men] said so.
I married just one woman because that's all I am allowed according to the Qur'an; just one (4:3). There is no way I can meet the condition in 4:3 (4:129).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
From the perspective of human nature, the sexual lust is one of the most powerful human drive.
Because the Quran was authored by humans [God is impossible to exists] it inevitable will get entangled with sexual lusts.
Is it because of the Qur'an that you and I are entangled with sexual lusts?
 
Old 12-19-2016, 08:30 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,282,205 times
Reputation: 7407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Continuum View Post
You are right, there is a contradiction.

The Quran allows 4 wives [context was actually orphans].

But in 33:52 the Quran allow more that 4 wives if the wives are 'what the right hand possessed' for the prophet.

Personally I believe 33:51-53 has more to do with legal sex and marriage is a side point.
It meant, henceforth [after this 33:51-52] the prophet can have sex with those 9 wives he already had married earlier and can have sex legally with his slaves any time.


Morally, a wise God would never get involved in the above matters in such a manner which allow ONLY men marrying 4 wives as an eternal divine law.
Note the present emotional and psychological turmoil caused to many women when lusty Muslim men decide to marry more than one up to four because Allah said so.
It is more like I [Muhammad or some group of men] said so.

From the perspective of human nature, the sexual lust is one of the most powerful human drive.
Because the Quran was authored by humans [God is impossible to exists] it inevitable will get entangled with sexual lusts.
If a Muslim is actually following Islam it is doubtful he would have more than one wife. While it is permissible for a Muslim to have up to for wives, it is a great sacrifice few could do..Most Muslims do not have more than one wife.

If a man seeks an additional wife the purpose is to support and protect here. A man doesn ot have free choice as to who an additional wife, Can only do so if the eligible widows, divorcees and orphans in the community refuse to marry him.

For a Muslim man to have more than one wife he must provide each wife with her own private living quarters, preferably her own House. It is not a Harem type scenario, Each wife must be treated equally along with other conditions.
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Old 12-19-2016, 12:40 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
If a Muslim is actually following Islam it is doubtful he would have more than one wife.
In my community, more than 99.9% Muslim men have only one wife. My father had only one wife. I have never had another wife or the second wife. None of my brothers have had more than one wife. My son has just one wife. My grandson has just one wife.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
While it is permissible for a Muslim to have up to four wives, it is a great sacrifice few could do..Most Muslims do not have more than one wife.
It's not a bed of roses for a Muslim man to have more than one wife because the husband would be responsible for each wife's maintenance (she does not have to work and he must provide). Not only that but it is impossible to meet the condition for marrying more than one wife. It is impossible for a man to treat all wives equally and do justice to all (4:129). That rules me out having more than one wife at any one time.
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