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Old 04-11-2017, 09:16 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
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I would like to invite readers to review Aidid Safar's thesis,
Sol-laa (commitments) is not ritual prayer

https://mentalbondageinthenameofgod....ritual-prayer/

Quote:
To recap: Sol-laa comes from the root S-L which does not exist in modern Arabic and which defies definition by modern methods. Yet the Reading treats its meaning as self-evident. The religious elite have ascribed its own meaning to this word, a meaning which fails appallingly in certain Qur’anic contexts.

The word Sol-laa[1] or any of the derivatives from the same root word is never used in the Reading to refer to the act of worship or the performance of a set of body movements.
Its use always refers to the act of honouring, upholding, dedicating or observing of commitments, obligations, accountabilities, responsibilities etc. by consenting person or persons when the phrase ‘aqi-mu‘ is used. Literally the word Sol-laa means to ‘commit’.
The above section is about 10 pages.

Personally I do not agree totally with Aidid Safar but he does have logical and rational points in many areas of contention.

Please read these few pages and give your comments [with critical thinking please]. This is a good exercise of critical thinking [FKR; yatafakkaru] that the Quran advocated for the al-babi [men of understanding] and others who yearn for greater success on Judgment Day.
2:219 ... ...Thus Allah maketh plain to you [Muslims] (His) revelations, that haply ye [Muslims] may reflect [FKR; yatafakkaru]
The rest of the section are;
  • Sol-laa between people
  • Sol-laa to yourself
  • Sol-laa is about doing ‘deeds’
  • Abraham’s commitments
  • Moses’ commitments
  • Jesus’ commitments
  • Muhammad’s commitments
  • Ask for God’s help without rituals
  • Glorify God through commitments
  • Ritual prayer is not in the Qur’an
  • Ritual prayer is a conspiracy

Last edited by Continuum; 04-11-2017 at 09:29 PM..

 
Old 04-13-2017, 04:59 AM
 
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Which word in the Arabic Qur'aan is he writing in English as sol-laa (commitments)?
Verse number will also help.
 
Old 04-13-2017, 08:14 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
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Here is the relevant points from this section,
https://mentalbondageinthenameofgod....ritual-prayer/
Note the highlighted as extracted.

.. start extract:
To recap: Sol-laa comes from the root S-L which does not exist in modern Arabic and which defies definition by modern methods.
Yet the Reading treats its meaning as self-evident.
The religious elite have ascribed its own meaning to this word, a meaning which fails appallingly in certain Qur’anic contexts.

Since the Reading is the only place we know of which knows what this word means we have to look to it for the ways it uses this word and derive its meaning from the multitude of contexts. God says the Arabic in His Book is perfect. Thus, nobody should try to change its word constructions, spelling and grammatical forms.

A reading in Arabic without any crookedness therein so that they might observe. 39:28
The word Sol-laa[1] or any of the derivatives from the same root word is never used in the Reading to refer to the act of worship or the performance of a set of body movements.

Its use always refers to the act of honouring, upholding, dedicating or observing of commitments, obligations, accountabilities, responsibilities etc. by consenting person or persons when the phrase ‘aqi-mu‘ is used. Literally the word Sol-laa means to ‘commit’.

This root word (like all roots in Arabic) forms its various functions by use of vowels, prefixes and suffixes. The short vowels “i” or “u” (9:103,108:2 and 33:56) can be added resulting in ‘Sol-lee’ or ‘Sol-luu’ without changing the underlying, fundamental meaning of the word.

The word pronounced with a short vowel ‘a’ appears in the Reading twice, in 75:31 and 96:10 respectively.
In 96:10 it appears as “ ‘Abdan Ezaa Sol-laa” which means “A servant who is committed”. The context of this verse begins from 96:8-12 with the message “Indeed to your Lord is the final return. What do you think of those who prevent a servant who commits? What if he is actually on the right path, advocating people to be observant?” The message is clear. But translators give different meanings to this word for reasons only known to them.

In 75:31 it is written as Falla-sod-daqor-wa-Sol-laa and translators insist the word Sol-laa in both verses refers to ritual prayers. Obviously when we read the context, they do not make any sense at all.
This word pronounced with different vowels or prefixes appear in other passages of the Reading, and no religionists or Arabic scholars dare translate them as ‘ritual prayers’. So the best one can say is, consistencies exist because the leaders of the Arab religion interpret this root concept in various ways.

The paragraphs following will attempt to explain this particular quirk.

As mentioned, the Arabic language derives its vocabulary from the root words. Conjugations of the root word can produce new derivatives and generally, these derivatives are constructed in accordance with established vocalic moulds or patterns to which certain prefixes or suffixes are added. The Arabic verbs have two ‘voices’ – active and passive.

..end extract.

Last edited by Continuum; 04-13-2017 at 08:41 PM..
 
Old 04-13-2017, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
3,440 posts, read 1,581,295 times
Reputation: 461
continue from the above.


............
As mentioned, the Arabic language derives its vocabulary from the root words. Conjugations of the root word can produce new derivatives and generally, these derivatives are constructed in accordance with established vocalic moulds or patterns to which certain prefixes or suffixes are added. The Arabic verbs have two ‘voices’ – active and passive.

Derivational and inflexional forms make the Arabic language extensive. This complexity is matched by the regularity and symmentry of the form and is very logical and regular. There are almost no regular forms in the language. In addition to two tenses, perfect and imperfect, there are imperative forms, active and passive, and also energetic forms. Sol-laa or commit for example has many derivatives to form other words with the same shades of meaning like, binding, obligations, compulsion, pledge or promise etc.

Sol-laa Commit
Sol-luu Be committed
Sol-lee Binding
Mu-Sol-lan A person who is committed
Mu-Sol-leen Many people who are committed
Yu-Sol-laa They commit
Yu-Sol-lee Their commitments
Yu-Sol-luu They have committed
Ya-sil-luu Bind
Solaa-ta Commitment (singular)
Solaa-tee Commitments (dual)
Solaa-tu Commitments (Aorist)
Solaa-waa-tee Obligatorily
Solaa-waa-tun obligatory

Arabic in the Reading then, it is fair to say, is a highly developed language with a complex grammar via which it is possible to express concepts with a high level of accuracy. Unlike Latin, Old Greek, Aramic, or Sanskrit, Arabic of the Quran is a living language, spoken, written and understood by millions people around the globe.

There are scholars and religionists who insist that Arabic in the Reading lacks the ability to define sense exactly because they realize – once the message of the Quran is made clear to the people all their belief and preaching will be in vain, for example they translated the word Sol-laa-ta as the mandatory Arab ritual prayers to be observed by Muslims only.
But in the Quran the same word is also attributed for people of the past like Abraham, Moses, and Jesus, the disbelievers, strangers and others including the animal kingdom. I will explain in the next chapter how they shuffle this word by creating absurd meanings.

There are many lessons to be learned from the Quran especially about the previous people who received God’s revelations. One such community is the Children of Israel, who agreed to uphold their commitments upon receiving God’s covenant, and we are told they violated it by distorting ‘His words’ in the scripture (2:59) to create a new religion of Judaism.
We see the Arab religionists are doing exactly the same when they translate the Arabic words in the Quran to other languages. Although they have successfully introduced the manipulated meanings of many words into the translated Quran, but certainly they cannot change the original Arabic in the Quran, no matter how hard they try. God in His wisdom gave us His assurance in 15:9 that “He will preserve what He revealed”.
The outcome of any attempt to change His words, the spellings, or even modifying its grammar will result the translations riddled with contradictions defying all logics.

However, the subsequent twisting of the meanings of the original Arabic in the Quran by those who would force it into a pre-prescribed shape has marred many people’s reading of the book. For instance, we read in 75:31: falaa soddaqor walaa Sol-laa. The patrons of the Arab religion say it means ‘He was not truthful and not praying’. The true meaning is ‘He was not truthful and not committed’. Let us examine this word “Sol-laa” when it is used in other passages.

For example, in 2:43 God tells us that He instructed the Children of Israel: Wa-aqimus Sol-laa-ta wa-atuz zakaa.
The religionists say it means: ‘Observe the ritual prayers and pay the religious tithes’.
This instruction is spoken in the present tense, and if we read the context from 2:40 to 2:43 we will realize that God reminds the Children of Israel to commit to what they have committed before – i.e to uphold the covenant and maintain the purity of its tenets. He calls them to believe in what is revealed in the Quran confirming what they have, and do not trade away God’s revelations for a cheap gain. The message is simple and straightforward. God never asked the Children of Israel to perform the ritual prayers as suggested by the religionists.

As a matter of fact if we ask the Jews if they had at any time in history performed the five daily ritual prayers, they will answer in the negative. Even the Jews who received the earlier Scripture knew that five the ritual prayers were not part of the deen revealed by God.* It is not in the Torah and it is also not the Reading. Our common sense can easily tells us the true meaning of this particular passage is: ‘Uphold the commitments and keep them pure’. The Children of Israel understand this instruction very well because they have committed themselves to God’s deen through the Torah long before the Quran was revealed.

*[The 5 ritual prayers is very similar to those of Zoroastrianism, thus plagiarized from that source]

In 6:162, the Prophet and those who consented themselves to God are encouraged to remind themselves of their obligation as servants of God:
In-naa Sol-laa-ti wa-nusuki wamaa yahya wamamamati lilahi robil a’lameen.
This means: My commitments and my sacrifices and my life and my death are for God the Lord of the Universe.
The religionists twist their tongue and say this verse means, ‘My ritual prayers and my sacrifices and my life and my death are for God the Lord of the Universe’.

Among the previous people who use the word Sol-laa in the Reading are the people of Shuaib. At 11:87 they say, ‘Ya-shu-’aib aa-Sol-laa-tu-ka…..’ which means, ‘O Shuaib, does your commitment…?’. But in the Arab religion they say the people of Shuaib said, ‘O Shuaib, does your ritual prayer..…..?’, even though the context of this passage says that Shuaib was calling his people not to cheat but to trade equitably among themselves.

The history of Jesus in the Reading is another clear example. Jesus mentions the word Sol-laa as an infant. In 19:23 we are told that Jesus was born of the Virgin Mary and he spoke to his mother soon after the pangs surprised her.
The religionists ridiculously claim that Jesus performed the ritual prayer and paid the alms tax from the day he was born. At 19:31 whilst in his mother’s arms Jesus says, “I was enjoined with the commitments maintain it pure for as long as I live” (‘Wa-asoy-na bi-Sol-laa-ti wa zakaa-ti ma dumtum hai-yan’) which clearly implies that he will uphold his obligation diligently in reforming the Children of Israel.

Different words were used in various languages during over the centuries of prophets calling people to uphold their commitments or obligations. In the language of the Last Prophet it is called Sol-laa (or its derivatives). Abraham, the people of Midyan, the Children of Israel and Jesus were non-Arabs, but the Reading quotes interaction with them on the basis of an equivalent word in their own language to Sol-laa. In 21:73, for example, God instructs Isaac and Jacob with the same word, ‘wa-iqama-Sol-laa-ti-wa-ie-ta-zakaa-ti[2]’ which means: uphold your commitments and keep them pure after their father Abraham.

None of the prophets before Muhammad were talking about ritual prayers when they uttered the equivalent of Sol-laa in their own language. Therefore, the word Sol-laa or its derivatives cannot be translated to mean ritual prayers. To think otherwise is to err on a very large scale contextually.
The word Sol-laa and its derivatives appear in many verses in the Reading.
Modern Arab ‘translations’ will have us believe that there are many different meanings for the same word in different verses.

This ambiguity has generated much confusion. As a result, the word Sol-laa revolves around the ritualistic prayer performed according to a timetable accompanied by ritualistic physical movements. It is presumptuous to think that God would enjoin on us something quite so mundane.

........

*[= mine]

The above is merely Adid Safar's thesis which like any other must be opened to criticisms. I agree with Adid Safar's central theme 'The Arab's Conspiracy of the Quran' but I do not agree with some of his sub-themes.

Last edited by Continuum; 04-13-2017 at 08:35 PM..
 
Old 04-13-2017, 08:34 PM
 
Location: Not-a-Theist
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The above is merely Adid Safar's thesis which like any other must be opened to criticisms. I agree with Adid Safar's central theme 'The Arab's Conspiracy of the Quran' but I do not agree with some of his sub-themes.

Note Allah stated Salaat is not as critical as Dhikr. So no matter how wrong one interpret Salaat [commit and act upon it], the sin will not be that great [easily forgivable] as long there is no Shirk involved.

Therefore it not a big issue nor sin if one do away with the Ahadith [Arabs conspired] invented ritual prayers and formulate one's own way of 'salaat' [no conflict with Quran] as long as no shirk is involved.

If one has to follow the invented specific rituals [due to habit], this is no issue but one cannot insist it is from Allah in the Quran.
Thus one can do one's best and not feel guilty if one missed out anything due to unavoidable reasons or merely using one's discretion to follow what is most practical or not doing any rigid ritual prayers at all.
 
Old 04-14-2017, 02:12 AM
 
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O.M.G. I just wanted to know whether Aidid Safar is talking about Sol-laa or Salaat but you have copied and pasted the whole lot from what he had written. So he is talking about Al-salaat rather than Sol-laa.

The English word "commitment" translated into Arabic sounds nothing like either Al-salaat or Sol-laa. Even the root would be different.

Aidid Solar is living in his own world.

As for Al-salaat, I have already stated that it is a training ground (exercise) to learn how to stay away from doing evil. Therefore, the main thing is staying away from doing evil rather than the training. The same goes for fasting, giving in for charity, animal sacrifice, Hajj etc. All these acts are for training us to be good human being as vicegerent of Allah on earth (2:30) who would do good deeds and stay away from doing evil deeds. It is doing good deeds that will count towards getting to Paradise. The two main requirements to get to Paradise are (1) believing and (2) doing good deeds.

Aidid Safar is barking up the wrong tree. "al-salaat" (pronounced as "assalaat" is definitely prayer but the prayer on its own is not a good deed unless it leads one to do a good deed at other times. Some ulema in masajid say that the prayers will be counted first. In the Qur'aan, it will be the "good deeds" that will be counted along with bad deeds. Going to paradise or hell will depends not on number of prayers but on number of good and bad deeds. This is why my thrust in life is to be a good human being more than just Muslim. Being a Muslim is the first step. Being a good human being is the next step. We were created to be good human beings so that we could be vicegerents of Allah on earth. Being a Muslim is, therefore, a training ground to become good human being on earth.

Perhaps that's what Aidid Safar is saying but he is not making a good job of it.
 
Old 04-19-2017, 06:02 AM
 
Location: WV and Eastport, ME
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Far too much of these posts has been copied from other web sites. Please read the Terms of Service section on Copyrighted material for information. Use a link and a snippet, which is 2-3 sentences.

Because these covers so much of so many posts in this thread, the thread is closed.
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