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Old 05-20-2008, 08:43 AM
 
Location: Toronto; Canada
123 posts, read 281,656 times
Reputation: 20

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TrickyD made a point . But why the squabling over history? Is this the route to expect Democrat's at in the future? Msv Mike understands the MORAL of 'No Justice, NO Peace'; TrickyD wanted to portray the slavery issue from the existing development of let it be called appeased recognition of market values.

Oh man... what is the reason that we don't jsut dive the values of common people's sexually desirious Virtues and Vices? Western staples are to be subsitituted for a poor man's diet. Is this justifiable slavery for his family? I hear so much at 'slavery denial' in the heart of unemployed families (really generally that could be substituted for the term dysfuntctioned of wealthy morals families).

I was just wondering where are potatoes over-all farmed in the middle east? The masters would have their appropriate choice of Dahl, Pita, or Roti. Maybe the Dates plantations are less prevalent in iraq as well?
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Old 05-20-2008, 10:23 AM
 
Location: Earth
67 posts, read 185,739 times
Reputation: 37
There are good and bad people of all religions.
Lately the churches are in the news for sex crimes but it doesn't make all christian's/catholics perverts.
I think a lot of the muslms are fed up with how society is treating them and they're retaliating.
It's sad to have history repeat itself.
The black, the jewish, the chineese, the japaneese, Irish, etc, etc, etc.
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Old 05-20-2008, 12:33 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,804,653 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by HsvMike
Quote:
If you are a minimum wage worker, you have a choice not to work, you won't make any money but you do have a choice. A slave has no choice, they have no freedoms at all.
Many slaves (and other individuals for that matter) always have the choice to commit suicide.
The Austrian girl who was kept in a basement for most of her life and forced to give birth to her father's children had the choice to end her life, yet she did not.
We only have 1 choice in life and this is whether we wish to continue living or not. As long as slaves have the hope that their slavery will come to an end they will probably continue living.
I guess this also counts for many victims of long-term (sexual) abuse; that as long as they have the hope that their horrible ordeal will end they'll cling to life.

BTW in (modern) human society not having money = not having food = death.

Quote:
And Dr. King did use non-violent protest but he was protected at the same time.
Protected against what?
In the end King was still murdered for his convictions and he knew that his assassination would be a very likely outcome.

Quote:
Just don't attack us and everything will be fine.
Well I guess this is untrue, because the US finds nothing wrong with securing 'their' Middle East oil.
Then again, oil = power.
Especially in the Middle East.

I guess the main question is if followers of Jesus can be anything other than being pacifist?
The thing is that the abusers find nothing wrong with their behaviour and it will really become a problem when they start to find their abusive behaviour completely 'natural'.

Last edited by Tricky D; 05-20-2008 at 12:47 PM.. Reason: clarification
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Old 05-20-2008, 01:16 PM
juj
 
Location: Too far from MSG
1,657 posts, read 2,333,859 times
Reputation: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by HsvMike View Post
This is an insult to any person in any generation that was ever a slave. Low wages does not equate to being someones property, literally. If you are a minimum wage worker, you have a choice not to work, you won't make any money but you do have a choice. A slave has no choice, they have no freedoms at all.
So the only choice you have other than work a minimum wage job is not to work at all? Let's see, if I'm Half-Emp-D, I would just kill myself, and if I am you, I just would become a bum. Did it occur to either of you that many bad choices have already been made leaving them in their current position in the first place? But that's looking backwards. Looking forwards, there are government training programs and college grants and scholarships if you're poor enough. In addition, you could work hard for a fast food place like McDonalds and work your way up to manager. In a place like that you don't have to be highly educated, you just have to be reliable, dedicated, and work hard. Now that's my choice.
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Old 05-20-2008, 01:29 PM
 
Location: Huntsville, AL
2,221 posts, read 2,658,839 times
Reputation: 482
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
Many slaves (and other individuals for that matter) always have the choice to commit suicide.
The Austrian girl who was kept in a basement for most of her life and forced to give birth to her father's children had the choice to end her life, yet she did not.
We only have 1 choice in life and this is whether we wish to continue living or not. As long as slaves have the hope that their slavery will come to an end they will probably continue living.
I guess this also counts for many victims of long-term (sexual) abuse; that as long as they have the hope that their horrible ordeal will end they'll cling to life.
We have many "poor" people who choose not to work in this country, and they get by. Some even have nice cars and a lot of toys. I can only speak about what I know, I don't pretend to be a expert on the world's problems. No one is holding a gun to their heads to make them work those jobs, many immigrants have came here with nothing but the shirt on their backs and have built themselves up, legally. I just think it is a bad comparison, comparing someone who gets paid to work with a slave. It's funny how there are people that don't even live here, trying to be experts on this country.

Quote:
BTW in (modern) human society not having money = not having food = death.
We have a lot of programs in this country that helps out homeless / jobless people. More so I am sure than a lot of other countries. While it isn't the best life in the world, there are people who survive here without a job or home. You really need to learn about a country before you are an expert on it.

Quote:
Protected against what?
In the end King was still murdered for his convictions and he knew that his assassination would be a very likely outcome.
Now I am not an expert on this subject because it happened before I was born. And the civil rights era was very heated in this country. But there were laws to protect non-violent protest. So how well does non-violence work when it gets you killed? Like I said, it's hard to play by your set of rules when the enemy is playing by a totally different set. While I would love to see a peaceful world, as long as there are groups that will do whatever it takes to impose their will, there needs to be someone to stand up for everyone else to help fight them.

I have said this before, all of this is a domino effect. If the terrorists wouldn't have messed with us, none of this would be happening. Spin it any way u want, but that is the truth. We would have never been in Afghanistan and the President would have never been able to get anyone to side with him about going into Iraq. You can't deny any of that.

Quote:
Well I guess this is untrue, because the US finds nothing wrong with securing 'their' Middle East oil.
Then again, oil = power.
Especially in the Middle East.
Last I checked that is still Iraqi oil. Our gas has been skyrocketing in price, so I don't see it as being an advantage for us. If we didn't secure the oil fields, the insurgents would have had a field day blowing up the fields then Iraq would have been destroyed and broke.

Quote:
I guess the main question is if followers of Jesus can be anything other than being pacifist?
The thing is that the abusers find nothing wrong with their behaviour and it will really become a problem when they start to find their abusive behaviour completely 'natural'.
Now who exactly are the abusers? And if you are referring to the United States, who are we abusing, the people that attacked us?
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Old 05-20-2008, 01:33 PM
 
Location: Huntsville, AL
2,221 posts, read 2,658,839 times
Reputation: 482
Quote:
Originally Posted by juj View Post
So the only choice you have other than work a minimum wage job is not to work at all? Let's see, if I'm Half-Emp-D, I would just kill myself, and if I am you, I just would become a bum. Did it occur to either of you that many bad choices have already been made leaving them in their current position in the first place? But that's looking backwards. Looking forwards, there are government training programs and college grants and scholarships if you're poor enough. In addition, you could work hard for a fast food place like McDonalds and work your way up to manager. In a place like that you don't have to be highly educated, you just have to be reliable, dedicated, and work hard. Now that's my choice.
I don't think Tricky was referring to someone in this country. I would figure someone in like China that makes pennies an hour doing a job. I agree education and putting yourself in a position to excel is the best thing.
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:04 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,804,653 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by juj
Quote:
So the only choice you have other than work a minimum wage job is not to work at all? Let's see, if I'm Half-Emp-D, I would just kill myself, and if I am you, I just would become a bum.
Just because you don't like the results of certain choices does this mean that you have no alternatives.
It simply means that you do have alternatives only you do not like them.
The fact that you can end your life at any time of your own choosing is often the only real choice an individual has.


Originally Posted by HsvMike
Quote:
We have many "poor" people who choose not to work in this country, and they get by.
It seems to me that these people aren't poor at all.
Then again, I consider myself a rich person even when I am financially poor and do not own a house, or a car and other material stuff.

Quote:
I agree education and putting yourself in a position to excel is the best thing.
The thing is that education doesn't guarantee a job.
If there was only 1 job and 100 applicants who all are equally acceptable it still means that 99 people will remain jobless.
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Old 05-21-2008, 09:27 AM
juj
 
Location: Too far from MSG
1,657 posts, read 2,333,859 times
Reputation: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
Originally Posted by jujJust because you don't like the results of certain choices does this mean that you have no alternatives.
It simply means that you do have alternatives only you do not like them.
The fact that you can end your life at any time of your own choosing is often the only real choice an individual has.
Your negativity has dropped to NEW lows........ding ding ding........Attention, ladies and gentlemen! We have a winner. Half-Emp-D, is now the official most negative, depressing person in the world. Congratulations!

I am also changing your name from "Half-Emp-D" to "Emp-D." You must of used up the last of your mojo.
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Old 05-21-2008, 09:50 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,804,653 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by juj
Quote:
I am also changing your name from "Half-Emp-D" to "Emp-D."
LoL, I guess you have problems with the fact that people do have a choice if they really wanna live or wish to stop suffering?
I guess you also find taking responsibility for the choices in your life also a burden?
Some people rather live in denial than face the tuth.
Simply because they can't handle the truth.
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Old 05-21-2008, 10:02 AM
 
Location: Huntsville, AL
2,221 posts, read 2,658,839 times
Reputation: 482
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
It seems to me that these people aren't poor at all.
Then again, I consider myself a rich person even when I am financially poor and do not own a house, or a car and other material stuff.
You see, this is why I tell you that you can't talk like an expert on the United States, because you really just don't know enough about it. Our "poor" people probably live like kings compared to poor people in different countries. We just have a different lifestyle and way of living.

Quote:
The thing is that education doesn't guarantee a job.
If there was only 1 job and 100 applicants who all are equally acceptable it still means that 99 people will remain jobless.
In this country, for the most part, if you want to work, there is a job. It might not be the best job in the world, but there is one. Some people choose not to do jobs that might be "demeaning" and therefore say that they can't find a job.
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