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Old 05-21-2008, 10:22 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,801,920 times
Reputation: 1573

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Originally Posted by HsvMike
Quote:
You see, this is why I tell you that you can't talk like an expert on the United States, because you really just don't know enough about it.
I never claimed to be an expert on the US, but I admit that I do have some knowledge about the general history of the world.

Quote:
In this country, for the most part, if you want to work, there is a job.
Ah, but why should a surgeon earn more than a street sweeper?
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Old 05-21-2008, 10:28 AM
 
537 posts, read 1,173,746 times
Reputation: 144

YouTube - Total Onslaught- The Islam-Catholic Connection Part 1

The Roman Catholic-Islam connection, enjoy!
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Old 05-21-2008, 10:37 AM
 
Location: Huntsville, AL
2,221 posts, read 2,658,338 times
Reputation: 482
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
I never claimed to be an expert on the US, but I admit that I do have some knowledge about the general history of the world.
General knowledge of the world is good, but does not help when discussing intricacies of a single country. Especially one you don't live in or have first hand knowledge about.

Quote:
Ah, but why should a surgeon earn more than a street sweeper?
Because a surgeon saves lives and spends thousands upon thousands to learn his/her trade. A street sweeper can do it without any schooling and isn't the most difficult job out there. Now we are talking about compensation, not about self worth.
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:30 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,801,920 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by HsvMike
Quote:
Because a surgeon saves lives and spends thousands upon thousands to learn his/her trade.
So?
No one forced anyone to be a surgeon.
So a surgeon only saves lives if he is getting paid for it?
Quote:
A street sweeper can do it without any schooling and isn't the most difficult job out there. Now we are talking about compensation, not about self worth.
I heard that Italy has a problem with their garbage not being picked up. Picking up garbage would not require that much education, right?
I guess garbage disposal also is big business, otherwise it would have been settled weeks ago.
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:45 PM
juj
 
Location: Too far from MSG
1,657 posts, read 2,333,336 times
Reputation: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
Originally Posted by juj LoL, I guess you have problems with the fact that people do have a choice if they really wanna live or wish to stop suffering?
I guess you also find taking responsibility for the choices in your life also a burden?
Some people rather live in denial than face the tuth.
Simply because they can't handle the truth.
Killing yourself is, while a possible choice, should never actually be considered a choice. If things get better, you won't be in a position to take advantage of it. And plainly speaking, it's a chicken shi# approach to life. It's the same chicken shi# approach that results in abortions and divorce (I am talking about divorces caused by not getting along reasons and falling out of love. I am not talking about spouses turning gay, adultry or abuse).
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Old 05-21-2008, 12:58 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,801,920 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by juj
Quote:
Killing yourself is, while a possible choice, should never actually be considered a choice.
The fact still is that suicide is an option.
Whether you find this just is irrelevant.
Divorce, abortion, adultry etc are all choices too.

If a patient is suffering from a terminal disease or from dementia but have it in their will to have euthanasia performed on them whenever this occurs, it is their personal choice too.
Even Jesus chose death over using violence.
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Old 05-21-2008, 03:32 PM
 
Location: Huntsville, AL
2,221 posts, read 2,658,338 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
So? No one forced anyone to be a surgeon.
So a surgeon only saves lives if he is getting paid for it?
I wouldn't see someone getting into huge debt, to do something that pays as much as a job that does not require any additional education. Sounds like a horrible financial decision. Well someone has to hire a surgeon in order for him/her to do their job, right?

Quote:
I heard that Italy has a problem with their garbage not being picked up. Picking up garbage would not require that much education, right?
I guess garbage disposal also is big business, otherwise it would have been settled weeks ago.
As I said, I was just talking about a workers compensation, not how important a job is. It is a big business, but the guy that throws the trash into the truck does not make a lot, his bosses do.
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Old 05-21-2008, 11:38 PM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,801,920 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by HsvMike
Quote:
Sounds like a horrible financial decision.
And here I thought that education is only an investment.
You make it sound as if surgeons lead a horrible life and that they only become surgeons because of the money they earn.
There are some doctors who go to 3rd world countries and perform surgery there under 'primitive' conditions, not because of the money they earn (which is 'nothing' compared to what they would make if they stayed in their own country), but because they are living their dream and do work that they find is essential.

Quote:
As I said, I was just talking about a workers compensation, not how important a job is. It is a big business, but the guy that throws the trash into the truck does not make a lot, his bosses do.
To human society picking up trash and performing surgery are both equally important.
Surgeons cannot perform surgery without nurses so nurses are as important to health care as the surgeons.
The fact that a surgeon sees himself as a 'bigger' cog in the machine is irrelevant.
Without the many cogs the machine will fall apart.

So a surgeon needs his nurses as much as a patient needs health care.
The problem is that the 'free market' encourages choosing for your own best interest, which explains why surgeons need to pay a lot to earn a lot (because everyone has to make a profit).
The thing is that a surgeon needs his patients as much as a patient needs a surgeon, but a surgeon can pick and choose while a patient cannot.
Which essentially means that in a ‘free economy’ the doctors can control the price, because a surgeon has time on his side.
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Old 05-22-2008, 12:03 AM
juj
 
Location: Too far from MSG
1,657 posts, read 2,333,336 times
Reputation: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricky D View Post
Originally Posted by juj The fact still is that suicide is an option.
Whether you find this just is irrelevant.
Divorce, abortion, adultry etc are all choices too.

If a patient is suffering from a terminal disease or from dementia but have it in their will to have euthanasia performed on them whenever this occurs, it is their personal choice too.
Even Jesus chose death over using violence.
There's a little difference between suicide and a government killing you. But of course, with your intense negativity, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference.
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Old 05-22-2008, 12:11 AM
 
Location: southern california
55,647 posts, read 74,595,623 times
Reputation: 48140
many people hide behind religion, not just islam.
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