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Old 05-17-2008, 07:18 AM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
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A Muslim lecturer has stated that the Koran has different interpretations. The book, like the Bible, seems to contradict itself in many places. So, there are holy people who interpret this book, some are in conflict.

Mainly, I am against any religion that would run a state. I think a religion that claims it is the only one is ignorant. I think many conflicts in the world would be avoided if people would not think that they are in any way special because they are a member of a particular faith.

The Muslim religion does not believe in a secular state whose goal is to treat all religions, or the lack of religion, equally. It considers that its law trumps that of the society around it.

The more religions that feel this way, the greater the likelihood of war.

In a world in which every country can bomb its neighbor, we cannot afford such childishness.

Most people in most religions have put aside the parts of their religions that have sprung from primitive tribalism. Most have learned to live with their neighbors. The ones which have not are the ones which are starting wars.

Often it is fundamentalist Christians and Jews and Muslims who are the cause of such discontent in the world. This is not to say that they are all evil people, but the unthinking blind following of dogma should be treated as a disease, in my opinion.
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Old 05-17-2008, 08:53 AM
 
Location: egypt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
A Muslim lecturer has stated that the Koran has different interpretations. The book, like the Bible, seems to contradict itself in many places. So, there are holy people who interpret this book, some are in conflict.
yes we have different interpretations for quran , is he told you that these interpretations contradict which each other ? if yes give me example

at least we still have the original book , and it's one book

Quote:
Mainly, I am against any religion that would run a state. I think a religion that claims it is the only one is ignorant. I think many conflicts in the world would be avoided if people would not think that they are in any way special because they are a member of a particular faith.
well , i don't think also that there are any relegion motivate to violence , so if each state consider the relegion with running the state , there will be peace in the world .

ecah nation consider their relegion the only truth one
are you think that may be God accept many differnt relegions?

anyway thank you for your share , i really appreciate that , but it's not my point for post this thread .
many people denying sharia because it's came from a relegion , while they dont know what sharia is and what is it's issues , and may be they know wrong information or lack of knowledge , so that i made this thread to know what within sharia made anyone from other relegions to be upset , that's all

see you around
peace
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Old 05-17-2008, 02:14 PM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
yes we have different interpretations for quran , is he told you that these interpretations contradict which each other ? if yes give me example

at least we still have the original book , and it's one book


well , i don't think also that there are any religion motivate to violence , so if each state consider the religion with running the state , there will be peace in the world .

each nation consider their religion the only truth one
are you think that may be God accept many different religions?

anyway thank you for your share , i really appreciate that , but it's not my point for post this thread .
many people denying sharia because it's came from a religion , while they don't know what sharia is and what is it's issues , and may be they know wrong information or lack of knowledge , so that i made this thread to know what within sharia made anyone from other religions to be upset , that's all

see you around
peace
If I decided to research inconsistencies in the Koran, I am pretty sure I would be met with one of the interpretations that is supposed to explain everything.

I think God exists apart from what we call 'religion', which is a man made thing. Most religions are basically there to ensure a smoothly running society. There is no ONE religion that is correct, for man has made them all.

It is the concept that 'I have the one, true, religion' that causes much hatred in the world. Honestly, God made us all individuals and there are probably as many religions as there are people. We are each, in all of our God-given differences, expressions of the divine. We are not to have our joy squashed out of us by a religion that tries to shove each of us into a tiny hole of conformity.

God does not create us as individuals so that we can turn into robots.

The true glories of the mid-East were found, in my opinion, back in the middle ages, when western nations were backwards and ruled by religion and persecuting knowledge and it was the east that finally gave us so much of the knowledge that made for a good civilization. Back then, it was the West that was imprisoned by the shackles of a repressive religion. We learned then that too much power in the hands of religion is a very bad thing.

Yes, sharia is a form of religious rule which is imposed upon a state and I believe that to be wrong because it does not give people freedom of thought. It is from freedom of thinking that we can know who god is. It must be an individual choice and not something forced upon us by society.

Having it forced upon us by state law will eventually cause the demise of the religion. It is the evolution of all religions that are backed up by the state.

If you are thinking of the Western bible, you are correct. There are no original documents known to exist. Many scholars speculate that the main books of the New Testament of the bible, the first 3 or 4, were copied from another, which has since disappeared. This is why they tend to agree on so much. The figure and life of Christ is extremely similar to the lives of other 'gods', both before and during the time when he is purported to have lived. Also, there is nowhere in the bible where there is reference to a 'trinity', 3 gods in one.

Many religions which appear to have multiple deities say that god is so vast as to be unthinkable by humans, and each of the deities is but a different face of the same, one god. It makes god more approachable.

Every religion has inconsistencies, but their adherents somehow deny this or explain them away with some far-fetched story.

There was a time when people I knew (old people) would cross the street rather than walk in front of a place of worship of another religion. There was a time in which one church forbade their followers to enter the house of worship of another.

Darn! The religion I was pushed into as a child said others were going to hell for not believing what we believed. This is all very sick. So, to me, religions are here to separate people from one another. It fosters suspicions and hatred. I cannot get my mind around the idea that mature people would actually fight over a chunk of land in the mid-east.

Because of religions the world is teetering on the brink of nuclear war. This is so very anti whatever a god would want, and must make god excessively sad.
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Old 05-17-2008, 05:42 PM
 
Location: Sheffield, England
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Why am I against Sharia? I am pro-life and believe that, regardless of whether there is a god or not (I'm agnostic), it is not our right as human beings to decide whether another human being lives or dies. Yes, I know murderers have already broken that but by killing them aren't you really just saying to the world, "Hey look at us, we're being hypocritial bastards"? Because of my views on capital punishment I could not possibly have any form of support for a law and belief system which advocates the death penalty on so many occasions.

As Ghandi once said: "An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind."
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Old 05-17-2008, 06:02 PM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
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As a religion grows older, people put aside the more radical teachings, like the one in the bible saying to stone your children if they disobey. Newer religions tend to have more people who follow every dictate and debate what every word from 'the devine' means.
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Old 05-18-2008, 09:46 AM
 
Location: egypt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
I think God exists apart from what we call 'religion', which is a man made thing. Most religions are basically there to ensure a smoothly running society. There is no ONE religion that is correct, for man has made them all.
even you think that all relegions are false , and yours is the correct one


Quote:
Yes, sharia is a form of religious rule which is imposed upon a state and I believe that to be wrong because it does not give people freedom of thought. It is from freedom of thinking that we can know who god is. It must be an individual choice and not something forced upon us by society.
how it dosn't give the people freedom of thought ?
sharia dosn't force anyone to any relegion
sharia is just crime laws according to nonmuslims , nothing more ,some points which differs between relegions as marriage and divorse , sharia dosn't impose for it
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Old 05-18-2008, 01:36 PM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
even you think that all relegions are false , and yours is the correct one



how it dosn't give the people freedom of thought ?
sharia dosn't force anyone to any relegion
sharia is just crime laws according to nonmuslims , nothing more ,some points which differs between relegions as marriage and divorse , sharia dosn't impose for it
Yes, but it is the countries which adhere to sharia that persecute people, and they claim it is because of the law of some strange and mean god.
I do not think my religion is correct because I belong to no religion. I have personal thoughts on god, which I did not get from any book or any teaching of a guru or leader or saint or prophet. They are mine. See, I have freedom of thought.

There are countries that forbid, even the importing of bibles. Now, I might not agree with the bible, but I will be damned if I would forbid the import of them. They also have people who read mail coming in and black out things they don't like.
Women, all women, not just Muslems are forced into a peculiar dress code.
A wife or daughter cannot leave the country without permission of her husband, and often when permission must be gotten by a woman, if her male family members are not there, but only her eight year old son, then she must ask HIM permission!
Sorry, that is not religion to me, just sexist crap!
In some places women cannot hold jobs without permission, and sometimes not at all, even with it.
If a woman is raped, it is she who is punished for it, as being unclean.
Sharia may be close to a man's heaven, but for a woman it is a nightmare!
And many women who are reared this way agree in their adult years because by that time they are totally subjigated, like slaves.
Some of our Morman cults have done that to our women in the USA. Zombies. Little girls brainwashed since infancy into slavery.
That should be a crime.
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Old 05-19-2008, 12:47 PM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,042,291 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
Yes, but it is the countries which adhere to sharia that persecute people, and they claim it is because of the law of some strange and mean god.
this is the reason i made this post for
tell me how sharia persecute people ?

Quote:
I do not think my religion is correct because I belong to no religion. I have personal thoughts on god, which I did not get from any book or any teaching of a guru or leader or saint or prophet. They are mine. See, I have freedom of thought.
i agree with you
but muslims believes that the laws of sharia are better from any other law in the world , so you are wellcome if you wanna to compare between them , to find out which of them is better for all

Quote:
There are countries that forbid, even the importing of bibles. Now, I might not agree with the bible, but I will be damned if I would forbid the import of them. They also have people who read mail coming in and black out things they don't like.
are you mean sudia , it's the only country you have to claim that it's from sharia
anyway there is no issues in sharia prohibit the books of other relegions , saudia is special , there are just 1% christians all of them are foreign (not nationals) so its local laws are satisfy all people of saudia (100% muslim ) , and foreign must respect these laws

Quote:
Women, all women, not just Muslems are forced into a peculiar dress code.
in the other hand they banned hijab in france and turky , isn't it right ?
beside i don't thnk that we force them to wear as muslims , but there are limits for that

Quote:
A wife or daughter cannot leave the country without permission of her husband, and often when permission must be gotten by a woman, if her male family members are not there, but only her eight year old son, then she must ask HIM permission!
it's up to you , if you like for your wife to leave the country and leave her children , or even to sleep with another guy , it's your culture
in islamic culture there are rights for women toward his husband , and there are rights for husband toward his wife , may be you didn't know the benefits of women in islam , so you need to get knowledge about that also

Quote:
In some places women cannot hold jobs without permission, and sometimes not at all, even with it.
in some places as what ? it must be reasons for that
you must know that wife in islam have responsibilities toward her children and her husband , if she going to leave some of this responsibities , she must take a permission , why do you look at situation as to be persecution for women
For Muslims, it is a husband's primary duty to financially maintain his wife and children, with any contribution the wife makes being voluntary.

Further, to avoid disputes later on, the wife is given a set financial sum at the time of the marriage, which is written down as a term of the 'Nikah' or marriage contract. This sum is known as 'Haq Mehr', and is intended to give the wife enough to survive on in the event of divorce or widowhood.

Quote:
If a woman is raped, it is she who is punished for it, as being unclean.
Sharia may be close to a man's heaven, but for a woman it is a nightmare!
And many women who are reared this way agree in their adult years because by that time they are totally subjigated, like slaves.
Some of our Morman cults have done that to our women in the USA. Zombies. Little girls brainwashed since infancy into slavery.
That should be a crime.
wrong

read my respond no. 7 in this thread
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Old 05-19-2008, 01:24 PM
 
Location: Toronto; Canada
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Default Sou yo are climing that some artistic men could also accept Sharia.

What if I accept Sharia not because it leaves me accepting Islam for its worth as allowing Equality of all, but because it receives me the understanding that someone else has accepted Islam for laws which seem very harsh in expectation of the personal state of matrimony, like Cat Stevens. You see, I'm a man; is he no longer a man in my estimations?
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Old 05-19-2008, 04:37 PM
 
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ElWill, you have mentioned a few times that Sharia affords rights and responsiblities of wives towards their husbands and husbands towards their wives. We have talked about some of the responsibilities a woman has towards her husband under Sharia ----- could you please tell us what a husbands responsibilities are toward his wife under Sharia? Also, could you explain more the differences between Sharia law vs. cultural law? You had once wrote that things such as honor killings are not Sharia, but rather cultural. How is that viewed in the rest of the Muslim world and specifically by Imams?

As always, thank you for your time!
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