[Some] Marines trying to convert Muslims in Iraq (Abraham, language, human)

[Campbell34]

Originally Posted by Cirbryn

As should be obvious, the problem isn't just that people are proselytizing in Iraq. The problem is that representatives of the United States government are doing so. The Constitution prohibits the government from favoring one religion over another. And if that weren't enough, a little common sense ought to show it's a bad idea to try converting a country that doesn't trust us and that we are occupying militarily.

A Christians first responsibility is to God first. And if you don't like that, perhaps the government should kick all the Christians out of the military and replace them with Atheist. I doubt it is our government that is encouraging the service men to pass out coins. It is Christian American service men who are believers in Jesus Christ. You can't blame everything on the American government. And it is the American Constitution that states that we Americans have freedom of religion. Now that may be a freedom you would like to do away with, but thats a freedom that Americans have embraced from the beginning, and I see no reason to do away with it now.

[Campbell34]

Originally Posted by sanspeur

Unreal...Don't think, just do as commanded. When are you booking your flight?

It is because I am a thinker that I look forward to telling people about Christ. And it is because most people don't think, that they donot know who Jesus Christ is. And I do as commanded, because I know the truth. And that truth has set me free.

[Parti Rhinocéros]

Campbell, I'm not sure what thinking you've been doing -- I was raised an idiot Protestant Christian and I know exactly what type of thinking you have to excuse to remain shut in to that belief. This isn't to take anything away from people whom believe in a higher deity, but to close yourself off from reality, which is exactly what it takes to be a fundamentalist Christian in today's era, is both embarrassing and intellectually destitute.

I hope your Xian comrades in the military go straight to heaven after they get shot in the head for being such xenophobic idiots.

[camping!]

Originally Posted by Campbell34

A Christians first responsibility is to God first. And if you don't like that, perhaps the government should kick all the Christians out of the military and replace them with Atheist. I doubt it is our government that is encouraging the service men to pass out coins. It is Christian American service men who are believers in Jesus Christ. You can't blame everything on the American government. And it is the American Constitution that states that we Americans have freedom of religion. Now that may be a freedom you would like to do away with, but thats a freedom that Americans have embraced from the beginning, and I see no reason to do away with it now.

I think you need to take a civics course. Freedom of religion does not mean you can break laws to express your religion. For example, if your religion demanded a blood sacrifice ---- that would be illegal and you would suffer the consequences. If your religion demanded that you marry a child bride ---- that would be illegal and again, you would suffer the consequences.
In this case, proselytizing on foreign (and extremely hostile) soil is against the law, both Iraqi and military. So ---- he will and should suffer the consequences. If he or any other military personal want to convert the hostile masses of Iraq then as soon as their time is up, they should become missionaries. Then they can do as they please. Except of course they won't have guns at their disposal, and the backing of the US government. Most likely they will become imprisoned or even executed. But they aren't cowards! I'm sure they aren't hiding behind that machine gun and occupation forces status!!

[sanspeur]

Originally Posted by Campbell34

It is because I am a thinker that I look forward to telling people about Christ. And it is because most people don't think, that they donot know who Jesus Christ is. And I do as commanded, because I know the truth. And that truth has set me free.

You contradict yourself...You say you are a thinker, then say you do as commanded... I don't think you would last a day in Iraq if you went around spreading your "truth".

[stycotl]

Originally Posted by sanspeur

You contradict yourself...You say you are a thinker, then say you do as commanded... I don't think you would last a day in Iraq if you went around spreading your "truth".

while i agree that iraq is not the place to do this (and that law, both iraqi and american, as well as social contract theory and even just plain, honest morality, prohibit it), i have to point out that doing what you are commanded does not mean you are not thinking. sure, there are people that would rather have someone else think for them, but there are plenty of intelligent people that, even though they think for themselves (and indeed, sometimes because they think for themselves), they choose to obey commands.

[Cirbryn]

Originally Posted by Campbell34

A Christians first responsibility is to God first.

And what did your God tell you about rendering unto Caesar that which is Caesar's?

Originally Posted by Campbell34

And if you don't like that, perhaps the government should kick all the Christians out of the military and replace them with Atheist.

Why should it kick out all the Christians when it's just a small minority that want to violate the Constitution like that?

Originally Posted by Campbell34

I doubt it is our government that is encouraging the service men to pass out coins. It is Christian American service men who are believers in Jesus Christ.

I didn't say the government was encouraging it. I'm saying when they wear the uniform of the US armed forces they are acting as representatives of the US government. They can't promote a religion under those circumstances.

Originally Posted by Campbell34

And it is the American Constitution that states that we Americans have freedom of religion. Now that may be a freedom you would like to do away with, but thats a freedom that Americans have embraced from the beginning, and I see no reason to do away with it now.

No one's suggesting they can't worship as they please on their own time. But freedom of religion doesn't mean freedom to violate the other provisions of the Constitution. If it did then I could start a religion that required me to own a slave, and the government wouldn't be able to prevent it.

[Campbell34]

Originally Posted by Cirbryn

And what did your God tell you about rendering unto Caesar that which is Caesar's?



Why should it kick out all the Christians when it's just a small minority that want to violate the Constitution like that?



I didn't say the government was encouraging it. I'm saying when they wear the uniform of the US armed forces they are acting as representatives of the US government. They can't promote a religion under those circumstances.



No one's suggesting they can't worship as they please on their own time. But freedom of religion doesn't mean freedom to violate the other provisions of the Constitution. If it did then I could start a religion that required me to own a slave, and the government wouldn't be able to prevent it.

Jesus did say render unto Caesar, and from that time the Jews gave money owed to Caesar, and they also gave what they owed to God. Men in uniform can work for President Bush, and they can work for God at the sametime.

And tell me, what part of the Constitution tells our service men that he must refrain from telling people about God? PLEASE QUOTE THAT PART FOR ME.

[MontanaGuy]

I can see how Muslims in Iraq could be offended by someone telling them that their religion is wrong and that they should accept the religion that most of the citizens share in the nation that attacked their country. Muslims in general are pretty hostile to anyone criticizing their beliefs. In many Muslim nations Christian missionaries are not even allowed to enter their country.

[Simple Living]

Originally Posted by chielgirl

I didn't say it was the majority, but one is too many.
These people need to leave the military, they have mental defects.

Are they as bad as hateful and bitter defects?