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Old 11-04-2009, 07:36 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,874 posts, read 31,750,270 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Islam is 1400 years old...... When Christianity was 1400 years old give or take a few years it was violent.....

The Jews were kicked out of spain in about 1400's. They could convert or leave. Later those who stayed and converted met with the Spanish Inquistion to find all the people who converted but still secretly practiced Judaism. Spanish inquistion was 1478 after Jews were kicked out of Spain. Ferdinand and Isabella wanted to unite Spain under the Catholic Church so they got the popes permission to begin the Spanish inquisition to cleanse Spain of all who were not Catholic. The drove out Jews, protestants and non-believers. It lasted from 1478-1834. "An estimated 31,912 heretics were burned at the stake, 17,659 were burned in effigy and 291,450 made reconciliations in the Spanish Inquisition. In Portugal, about 40,000 cases were tried, although only 1,800 were burned, the rest made penance". Jewish virtual library


12th century saw the inquistion to root out heresy in Europe.

pogroms: Taken from the wikipedia
Massive violent attacks against Jews date back at least to the Crusades such as the Pogrom of 1096 in France and Germany (the first to be officially recorded), as well as the massacres of Jews at London and York in 11891190.
In 1348, because of the hysteria surrounding the Black Plague, Jews were massacred in Chillon, Basle, Stuttgart, Ulm, Speyer, Dresden, Strasbourg, and Mainz. By 1351, 60 major and 150 smaller Jewish communities had been destroyed.[11] A large number of the surviving Jews fled to Poland, which was very welcoming to Jews at the time.[12]
In 1543, Martin Luther wrote On the Jews and Their Lies, a treatise in which he advocated harsh persecution of the Jewish people, up to what are now called pogroms. He advocated that their synagogues and schools be set on fire, their prayer books destroyed, rabbis forbidden to preach, homes razed, and property and money confiscated.[13][14]
Jews and Poles were also massacred during the Khmelnytsky Uprising of Ukrainian Cossacks in 16481654,[15] as well as in the following century during the Koliyivshchyna.


This is just a bit of the violence the early church and christians carried out in the name of religion.

http://astro.temple.edu/~hfreiden/Antisemitism/timeline.htm - a time line of Christian violence towards Jews.

Holocaust - 6 1/2 million Jews perished. 1 million of those were children. 11 million total. The antisemitism of Christianity was the reason in my opinion it happened. If you hate a people you can do awful things to them


My point is that Christianity is 2009 years old and has had 600 years to grow up....


Islam is 1400 years old..... same ages as Christianity was when it was in its early violent years........
So what you are saying is that every religion has to go through these violent growing pains....I think you are dead wrong. Many religions did not have a violent past, and dredging up Christianity's dark past in no way excuses what extreme Muslims are doing today. Their actions are indefensible.
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Old 11-05-2009, 05:42 AM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,424,051 times
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Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
So what you are saying is that every religion has to go through these violent growing pains....I think you are dead wrong. Many religions did not have a violent past, and dredging up Christianity's dark past in no way excuses what extreme Muslims are doing today. Their actions are indefensible.

Not at all..... I'm saying that Islam is not the only religion to be violent.
What I hear over and over is how violent Islam is, like its the only religion to be violent.....Its not and its not the first time a religion has killed in the name of religion..... What I see is that Christianity came out of its violent early history.... Isn't it possible Islam can do that too????

Your right the violence is indefensible..... As was all the violence perpetrated against Jews by Christians simply because they didn't like them. The antisemitism or the Christians is like a poison and its is alive and well today. In fact much of the hatred of the middle east against Jews came directly from the antisemitism of Europe and from Hitler. Here is a link: http://www.middle-east-info.org/gate...tism/index.htm

So I would say the violent antisemitism of the Christians is alive and well they just passed it on to the Muslim middle east....

Last edited by Jazzymom; 11-05-2009 at 05:56 AM..
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:07 PM
 
227 posts, read 303,027 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by story View Post
it's obvious that Islam is the most growing religion in the world right now,and its looks like cuz alot of ppl are starting to search and read about Islam ,not like before just judging it by what they see in the news and media
some ppl just have to read about Islam before talking or judging it ,
you absolutly right .... the media and the news (that controled by The exactly by Jews ) show the Islam and Muslim in bad images (like the vipers !!!) .... I am Muslim and my country and people hurt by assissans (terroristes) unforntely belong to Islam !!! they killing the innocents by the name of Islam !!!!.... on contrary the Islam is the peaceful religion in the world ... why because it's a great sin to kill the innocent and many verses in the Quran confirmed that .... and if we compare the Islam with the christainity ...we find out that the christainity is a religion of voilence ....because all the sins were already forgiven by killing Jesus (PUH) as the christians believe !!! but the killing in Islam is the second MAJOR SIN !!!!
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Old 11-05-2009, 01:25 PM
 
Location: NZ Wellington
2,782 posts, read 3,731,102 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by story View Post
it's obvious that Islam is the most growing religion in the world right now,and its looks like cuz alot of ppl are starting to search and read about Islam ,not like before just judging it by what they see in the news and media
some ppl just have to read about Islam before talking or judging it ,
You assume we didn't "read about it" before coming to the conclusion that your religion is no better then other abrahamic religions.

"Islam is already the fastest-growing religion in Europe. Driven by immigration and high birthrates, the number of Muslims on the continent has tripled in the last 30 years. Most demographers forecast a similar or even higher rate of growth in the coming decades".

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Old 11-05-2009, 05:37 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,424,051 times
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Originally Posted by insan777 View Post
you absolutly right .... the media and the news (that controled by The exactly by Jews ) show the Islam and Muslim in bad images (like the vipers !!!) .... I am Muslim and my country and people hurt by assissans (terroristes) unforntely belong to Islam !!! they killing the innocents by the name of Islam !!!!.... on contrary the Islam is the peaceful religion in the world ... why because it's a great sin to kill the innocent and many verses in the Quran confirmed that .... and if we compare the Islam with the christainity ...we find out that the christainity is a religion of voilence ....because all the sins were already forgiven by killing Jesus (PUH) as the christians believe !!! but the killing in Islam is the second MAJOR SIN !!!!


(like the vipers !!!) are you actually equating Jews to vipers??
Do you realize that Jews are people of the book?? In the Quran it says "Those who believe, the Jews, Christians and Sabians, who believe in God and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord. They need not fear, nor shall they grieve" Muhammad became angry when the Jews didnt recongnize him as a prophet and become converted to Islam so they quit praying towards Jerusalem and started praying towards Mecca. Muhammad filled the Quran with all sorts of negative remarks about Jews and make no mistake it was all Muhammad, not God....

(that controlled by The exactly by Jews ) The Jews do not control the media... that is an antisemitic remark. Islam is being shown in a bad light because right now people who are muslim are acting in very violent ways.. It has nothing to do with Jewish people....

You need to get your facts straight about Christianity.... The death of Jesus did not forgive all sins... It made forgiveness possible. You need to profess you sins and ask forgiveness. Becoming a Christian does not allow you to do anything you want. If you commit sin you are still accountable before God.

Islam needs to get its house in order and quit blaming the rest of the world for its issues. Its not the Christians, or Jews causing the issues in Islam. That means Muslims need to examine themselves and how they practice their religion.

The problem with Islam is that there are to many Muslims who think like you do.

In most of their secret talks there is no good, except where one exhorts to an act of charity or goodness or reconciliation between people. To him who does this, seeking the good pleasure of Allah, We shall soon give a reward of the highest value. [Srah al-Nis: 114]
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Old 11-05-2009, 05:48 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,424,051 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by story View Post
it's obvious that Islam is the most growing religion in the world right now,and its looks like cuz alot of ppl are starting to search and read about Islam ,not like before just judging it by what they see in the news and media
some ppl just have to read about Islam before talking or judging it ,
I have studied Islam and it has many wonderful qualities and the Muslims I know are wonderful peaceful people. But their is a violence to Islam that is being perpetuated by poor, uneducated people who do not know their faith. They are followers of Imams who preach hate and intolerance. They preach hate of Jews, Christians and non believers. Muslims who teach their children that to die for Islam as a martyr is an ideal. Mothers who send their children to Jihad as suicide bombers. The Islam that teaches hatred of all non-believers and especially targets Jewish people.

Islam needs to be judged according to its actions, and maybe one day it will get its house in order and stop blaming everyone else for its troubles.
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Old 11-05-2009, 07:53 PM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,056 posts, read 30,517,457 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Islam needs to be judged according to its actions, and maybe one day it will get its house in order and stop blaming everyone else for its troubles.
Well, let's give 'em at least a little credit. I'm not completely sure it's Islam, the religion. More like some of Islam's adherents.
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Old 11-05-2009, 09:54 PM
 
40,039 posts, read 26,720,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Islam needs to be judged according to its actions, and maybe one day it will get its house in order and stop blaming everyone else for its troubles.
How many do you want?

Teaching its believers slavery, terror, death and beheadings (warning: graphic!):
http://barenakedislam.wordpress.com/...headings-r-us/
Their women are dying to escape--
http://barenakedislam.wordpress.com/...raphic-images/
Don't forget the religion of peace:]
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/]
With its violent history of oppression:
http://www.familysecuritymatters.org...pub_detail.asp
Sort of like Satan running Mohammedanism:]
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/34...id=VIDURVHOV06
Which is the bare naked islam:
http://barenakedislam.wordpress.com/
Just one of the top ten reasons why sharia is bad for all societies:
http://www.americanthinker.com/2005/...sharia_is.html

and P.S.: Does everybody who reads this realize that our troops are fighting and dying in Iraq and Afghanistan so that after some sort of "victory" Mohammedan Sharia "law" will be instituted there? America is fighting and dying and depleting our treasury so that godless Sharia law will govern those places after we're gone. No victory that.
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:19 AM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,424,051 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
How many do you want?

Teaching its believers slavery, terror, death and beheadings (warning: graphic!):
Beheadings “R” Us (WARNING: GRAPHIC IMAGES) Bare Naked Islam's Weblog
Their women are dying to escape--
Stories of SELF-IMMOLATION: Why Muslim women try to burn themselves to death (WARNING: GRAPHIC IMAGES) Bare Naked Islam's Weblog
Don't forget the religion of peace:]
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/]
With its violent history of oppression:
Family Security Matters Publications Exclusive: Islam and Muslims: History of Oppression, Violence, and Fanaticism
Sort of like Satan running Mohammedanism:]
3/4 How Satan Deploys Islam - AOL Video
Which is the bare naked islam:
Bare Naked Islam's Weblog
Just one of the top ten reasons why sharia is bad for all societies:
American Thinker: Top ten reasons why sharia is bad for all societies

and P.S.: Does everybody who reads this realize that our troops are fighting and dying in Iraq and Afghanistan so that after some sort of "victory" Mohammedan Sharia "law" will be instituted there? America is fighting and dying and depleting our treasury so that godless Sharia law will govern those places after we're gone. No victory that.

No, we are in afganistan because 3000+ innocents were murdered in the twin towers and Bin Ladin had free reign in Afganistan due to the taliban. It was Goerge Bush the 2nd who took us into Iraq for imaginary weapons of mass destruction. I am knowledgeable about Islam, sharia and the violence that has been done by Islam.

The difference is although there are aspects of Islam I have trouble with, I have not discounted Islam as a religion. I know they worship the same God I do. I know there are many many peaceful Muslims. I refuse to condemn a whole people, and religion because of extremists.
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Old 11-06-2009, 05:32 AM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,424,051 times
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Originally Posted by Fred314X View Post
Well, let's give 'em at least a little credit. I'm not completely sure it's Islam, the religion. More like some of Islam's adherents.
I agree with you, its not the religion, its the people's understanding of their religion and not all the people at that.

I see is the middle eastern governments blaming the west, and the Jews for the troubles so the masses will not see what wretched governments they have. There has been set up an east vs west mentality as many see the west as being against the East. Imams rail against the west and America and the Jews. They see Christians and Jews as being against Islam. The dynamic is very dangerous.

The antisemitism of Hitler is alive and well in the middle east.

In countries where Muslims are educated, and are integrated into society there is not that problem. But in countries where Muslim populations have not been fully integrated and don't have the same possibilities as the rest of the population is where the problem lies.
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