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Old 06-09-2009, 10:53 AM
 
4,439 posts, read 8,206,015 times
Reputation: 1468

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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
The videos speak for themselves.
and they don't


Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
Glad you agree.
and I don't.. note the Roll Eyes (Sarcastic) Smiley. He's my fav!

Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
Give me an example of a peaceful islamic government.
Ohhh no no no Kdbrich.. you stated.. and I quote..

Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
That, and the fact that everywhere in the world where you have a muslim government they don't play nicely with their neighbors.
Its not up to me to provide the evidence to discredit your claim as you've provide zero evidence as to your discovery on this issue. I'm simply asking for your facts by each muslim government.

Wait.. don't tell me you just made an over reaching statment and you have nothing..

tell me it isn't so.. I had such high hopes..

Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
Freddie is one example of a guy who claims to be Christian but is almost universally denounced by Christians. Funny...but you really can't say the same for the violent muslims.
So I'm guessing you've also researched to find out the following of the videos you equate to being muslim:

1. History of the video
2. Context
3. Any denouncement by other muslims

No? So what you are telling me is you've watched the videos.. done zero research on your own.. taken them at face value..

Bravo

I stand by my example. Based on the Fred Phelps video you (I'd call you an evangelical) hate military people and picket their funerals. Based on that evidence alone.. you disgust me.

See how easy that was. I didn't have to do any research.. I could just form my own opinion without any regards to context or history or even knowing you.

Wow this is fun!

Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
I don't hate you. I'm still waiting for the truth though
I know you are waiting for the truth.. thats why I keep telling you to stop watching Glenn Beck.

The American Muslim (TAM)

Muslims Condemn Terrorist Attacks

American Muslims Denouncing Terrorism - Beliefnet.com

Germany: Muslim Groups Denounce Terrorism - Radio Free Europe / Radio Liberty 2009

http://lohud.com/article/20090522/NE...0347/-1/SPORTS

But I'll take your word for it kd.. all muslims enjoy terrorism.. just like all Christians are like Fred Phelps..
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Old 06-09-2009, 11:30 AM
 
16 posts, read 8,421 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
and they don't




and I don't.. note the Roll Eyes (Sarcastic) Smiley. He's my fav!



Ohhh no no no Kdbrich.. you stated.. and I quote..



Its not up to me to provide the evidence to discredit your claim as you've provide zero evidence as to your discovery on this issue. I'm simply asking for your facts by each muslim government.

Wait.. don't tell me you just made an over reaching statment and you have nothing..

tell me it isn't so.. I had such high hopes..



So I'm guessing you've also researched to find out the following of the videos you equate to being muslim:

1. History of the video
2. Context
3. Any denouncement by other muslims

No? So what you are telling me is you've watched the videos.. done zero research on your own.. taken them at face value..

Bravo

I stand by my example. Based on the Fred Phelps video you (I'd call you an evangelical) hate military people and picket their funerals. Based on that evidence alone.. you disgust me.

See how easy that was. I didn't have to do any research.. I could just form my own opinion without any regards to context or history or even knowing you.

Wow this is fun!



I know you are waiting for the truth.. thats why I keep telling you to stop watching Glenn Beck.

The American Muslim (TAM)

Muslims Condemn Terrorist Attacks

American Muslims Denouncing Terrorism - Beliefnet.com

Germany: Muslim Groups Denounce Terrorism - Radio Free Europe / Radio Liberty 2009

http://lohud.com/article/20090522/NE...0347/-1/SPORTS

But I'll take your word for it kd.. all muslims enjoy terrorism.. just like all Christians are like Fred Phelps..
We know that any muslim who denounces terrorism is practicing Taquiya.

Their own prophet said "I have been made victorious through terror".

Their own prophet said "If anyone changes his islamic religion, kill him".

Their own prophet said "killing kufars is a small matter to us".

Their own prophet authorized and/or participated in rape. I can show you the hadith for that. The Koran (verse 4:24) authorizes sex with captive women ("right hand possessions").

So all these so-called muslims you mention above (who calim to be denouncing terrorism) are actually saying that their prophet and their allah guy were wrong?
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Old 06-09-2009, 11:38 AM
 
4,439 posts, read 8,206,015 times
Reputation: 1468
Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
Their own prophet said "I have been made victorious through terror".
OT God terrorized people. Some might even say actions speak louder than words.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
Their own prophet said "If anyone changes his islamic religion, kill him".
Guess what.. if you change the christian religion.. some believe you die.. forever..

boo

Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
Their own prophet said "killing kufars is a small matter to us".
OT God proved that killing was a small matter..

Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
Their own prophet authorized and/or participated in rape. I can show you the hadith for that. The Koran (verse 4:24) authorizes sex with captive women ("right hand possessions").
See Sodom and Gommorah.. OT.. Lots daughters.. authorization of rape.. Do you really think the OT doesn't say all this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
So all these so-called muslims you mention above (who calim to be denouncing terrorism) are actually saying that their prophet and their allah guy were wrong?
So do you denounce the Christian God too?

No I don't think they are saying "their allah guy is wrong". I'm saying your quote mining is useless as you haven't addressed anything in the thread.

Tell me where I'm wrong. I posted evidence of denouncement. Are you calling them liars?
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Old 06-09-2009, 11:41 AM
 
4,439 posts, read 8,206,015 times
Reputation: 1468
also.. Kdbrich.. haven't forgotten about you. Still waiting on the list of muslim governments and their neighborly policies..

include any historical context if you like too.

baited anticipation with I do wait.
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Old 06-09-2009, 11:52 AM
 
16 posts, read 8,421 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
OT God terrorized people. Some might even say actions speak louder than words.

Guess what.. if you change the christian religion.. some believe you die.. forever..

boo
I am not Christian, so I am not sure what Jesus said. In any case, your point would be a relevant argument if you can quote Jesus commanding the death penalty for somebody who ceases to be Christian.

Otherwise your point is just a canard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post

OT God proved that killing was a small matter..
Verse 4:80 of the Koran command muslims to follow their prophet as if his words were from allah himself. So from that we have to assume that killing infidels would have to be a small matter to muslims who believe in the teachings of their religion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
See Sodom and Gommorah.. OT.. Lots daughters.. authorization of rape.. Do you really think the OT doesn't say all this?

So do you denounce the Christian God too?
I fail to see how rubbish from one religion somehow absolves rubbish and filth in another.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
No I don't think they are saying "their allah guy is wrong". I'm saying your quote mining is useless as you haven't addressed anything in the thread.

Tell me where I'm wrong. I posted evidence of denouncement. Are you calling them liars?
You are wrong because you are merely quoting what ordinary people say. If those ordinary folks say things that contradict the teachings of the religion they profess to follow, what should we believe? Are they really muslims or not?

Last edited by gallego4802; 06-09-2009 at 12:03 PM..
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:06 PM
 
28 posts, read 31,947 times
Reputation: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
We know that any muslim who denounces terrorism is practicing Taquiya.
About 10% of the Muslims believe in this.The others don't.(Atually it's a sin for them)
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:11 PM
 
4,439 posts, read 8,206,015 times
Reputation: 1468
Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
I am not Christian, so I am not sure what Jesus said. In any case, your point would be a relevant argument if you can quote Jesus commanding the death penalty for ceasing to be Christian.

Otherwise your point is just a canard.
Wow for someone who knows so much about religion you don't know much about Christianity. Any good Christian will tell you that Jesus and the OT God are the same sweetie. So I'm not ducking anything am I?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
Verse 4:80 of the Koran command muslims to follow their prophet as if his words were from allah himself. So from that we have to assume that killing infidels would have to be a small matter to muslims who believe in the teachings of their religion.
I bet every muslim thinks exactly the same don't they. Just like every Christian. No denominations are there?

Oh wait.. Iraq has clear divisions of muslims right? Interesting.. so your broad brushstroke from the Koran means squat.

I provided evidence of Mulsims denouncing terrorism. I'm not here to defend what they said. I'm simply stating what they said. If you have issues with what they said.. take it up with them chief. I provided the links.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
I fail to see how rubbish from one religion somehow absolves rubbish and filth in another.
Thats because you came into the middle of the conversation. From day one I've said its utterly retarded to take a video of a minute subsection of a population and use that video as justification for hating the entire population.

If thats difficult for you to understand.. I'm not sure what else I can say.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
You are wrong because you are merely quoting what ordinary people say. If those ordinary folks say things that contradict the teachings of the religion they profess to follow, what should we believe? Are they really muslims or not?
Gosh you are right.. I mean the clerics haven't said anything have they..

Clerics denounce terrorism at Hyderabad meet

Prominent Muslim Cleric Denounces bin Laden

From newsmax no less!

See how this works...

If you subscribe to the theory that you get to post a video and have that video represent an entire faith....

then I get to subscribe to the theory that I get to post any article that states a muslim or a muslim cleric denounces terrorism

Its a two way street..

Anytime you want to have a normal conversation just let me know.. I can continue down this illogical path of reasoning for a long time.
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:12 PM
 
16 posts, read 8,421 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefly View Post

More people have been killed in the name of Christ than for any other reason in the history of humanity.
Will Durant and other historians would vehemently dispute that.

According to them, the largest genocide in human history, a genocide that dwarfs all others, was the slaughter of Hindus in the (attempted) Arab muslim conquest of the Indian subcontinent (80 million Hindus slaughtered according to Will Durant).

Of course, that conquest and slaughter would be entirely consistent with the teachings and orders of their prophet and allah guy. To muslims, Hindus are polytheistic idolators. The Koran orders that idolators be killed.

To this day, the Afghan mountains are known as the "Hindu Kush", which means "Hindu slaughter".
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:23 PM
 
11,145 posts, read 13,910,786 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by gallego4802 View Post
Will Durant and other historians would vehemently dispute that.

According to them, the largest genocide in human history, a genocide that dwarfs all others, was the slaughter of Hindus in the (attempted) Arab muslim conquest of the Indian subcontinent (80 million Hindus slaughtered according to Will Durant).

Of course, that conquest and slaughter would be entirely consistent with the teachings and orders of their prophet and allah guy. To muslims, Hindus are polytheistic idolators. The Koran orders that idolators be killed.

To this day, the Afghan mountains are known as the "Hindu Kush", which means "Hindu slaughter".
You're talking about one genocide. I'm talking about 2,000 years of history.
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Old 06-09-2009, 12:36 PM
 
16 posts, read 8,421 times
Reputation: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
Wow for someone who knows so much about religion you don't know much about Christianity. Any good Christian will tell you that Jesus and the OT God are the same sweetie. So I'm not ducking anything am I?
.
Most of my Christian acquaintances are Arabic speaking Christians. They actually take offense at the suggestion that their god and the Islamic god are the same. To them, the islamic god is satan.

Based on what I can see from the Koran, I would agree.

And read what I said. I am talking about the teachings. I challenged you to quote Jesus commanding the death penalty for apostates. You have not done so....So yes, you really are ducking it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
I bet every muslim thinks exactly the same don't they. Just like every Christian. No denominations are there?

Oh wait.. Iraq has clear divisions of muslims right? Interesting.. so your broad brushstroke from the Koran means squat.
.
You are right about the divisions in Iraq. In my life time, the number one killers of muslims have been.....OTHER MUSLIMS.

It doesn't really matter what muslims say. The issue should be whether what they say are consistent with the teachings of their god and their prophet. When what they say is inconsistent, I find little reason to believe what they say.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
I provided evidence of Mulsims denouncing terrorism. I'm not here to defend what they said. I'm simply stating what they said. If you have issues with what they said.. take it up with them chief. I provided the links.
.
And I have provided evidence from their own religious teachings to prove that by denouncing terrorism they are being inconsistent with the teachings of their religion. Therefore, what you have failed to provide, is any convincing reason why anybody ought to believe what they say.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
Thats because you came into the middle of the conversation. From day one I've said its utterly retarded to take a video of a minute subsection of a population and use that video as justification for hating the entire population.

If thats difficult for you to understand.. I'm not sure what else I can say.
.
What you fail to understand is that the video calls for behavior that is consistent with what the Koran and hadith teach. When a muslim says something that is consistent with what their god and prophet teach, I am more inclined to believe him (or her).

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
Gosh you are right.. I mean the clerics haven't said anything have they..

Clerics denounce terrorism at Hyderabad meet

Prominent Muslim Cleric Denounces bin Laden

From newsmax no less!
.
Wow, I am impressed. We are supposed to believe the islam as prattled by newsmax rather than the islam that is in the Koran and hadith?

Why should I believe any muslim (cleric or otherwise) when what he says contradicts his own god and prophet?


Quote:
Originally Posted by bigthirsty View Post
See how this works...

If you subscribe to the theory that you get to post a video and have that video represent an entire faith....

then I get to subscribe to the theory that I get to post any article that states a muslim or a muslim cleric denounces terrorism

Its a two way street..

Anytime you want to have a normal conversation just let me know.. I can continue down this illogical path of reasoning for a long time.
You have still failed to give any logical reason why anybody should believe anything a muslim cleric says when he is contradicting the teachings of his god and the example set by his prophet.

I have merely said that the content of the video is consistent with the scriptural teachings of the faith. I have also said (proved actually) that muslims who denounce terrorism are contradicting the teachings of their god and their prophet.
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