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Old 11-14-2008, 02:54 PM
 
418 posts, read 649,757 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
who told you that islam relegion dosn't have love , love, love ?
the problem is that you focused on the verses with kill , kill ,kill which cover almost 1 % of entire quran , may be less !

if you wanna love , love , love regarding to enemies in the battle field
heck , that is logically and scientifically impossible, our relegion deals with logic and facts not with dreams
1% kill kill kill is 1% too much, as evidenced by the Islamic fanatics who suicide bomb, and create general mayhem in the world. (Take the Danish cartoons of Allah, and the reaction of some Muslims for example.)
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Old 11-14-2008, 09:21 PM
 
Location: Wicker Park, Chicago
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Yeah, that's what I hate about Islam - that many terrorist kill in the name of it to be holy matyrs... biggest BS around!
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Old 11-15-2008, 04:45 AM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnJLethal View Post
1% kill kill kill is 1% too much, as evidenced by the Islamic fanatics who suicide bomb, and create general mayhem in the world. (Take the Danish cartoons of Allah, and the reaction of some Muslims for example.)
no , i will not take reactions of muslims as example
if so , then take jews as examples and take christians as examples either and if you want , you can take bad examples from followers of each relegion in the world

if you have something against the relegion , so you are wellcome to discuss it
if you have problems with reactions of some muslims (may be 0.0000001 of muslims in the world) so i can't help you in that
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Old 11-15-2008, 12:15 PM
 
418 posts, read 649,757 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
no , i will not take reactions of muslims as example
if so , then take jews as examples and take christians as examples either and if you want , you can take bad examples from followers of each relegion in the world

if you have something against the relegion , so you are wellcome to discuss it
if you have problems with reactions of some muslims (may be 0.0000001 of muslims in the world) so i can't help you in that
I have something against religions, yes.

1) They are not scientific
2) Most advocate violence and persecution

As a result, fundamentalist followers are generally less educated about science and reality, and some fanatics seek to harm others based on their violent doctrine.

Many moderate followers abstain from violence and tend to grasp scientific concepts except for core aspects such as the Resurrection, but many of these moderates sympathize with the fundamentalists.

And more dangerously, moderates provide the buffer zone between secular rationalists and fundamentalist adherents. These moderates actually allow the acceptance of these zealots, whereas if there was no buffer zone, society as a whole might perceive the fundamentalist zealots as delusional.

In any other setting, believing in talking donkeys, talking snakes, woman created from a man's rib, or a sky god speaking things into existence would possibly lead to treatment of a mental disorder. Yet, because the heritage of humans from primitive times to explain the world around them is religion, it's still given some merit today.
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Old 11-15-2008, 02:12 PM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnJLethal View Post
I have something against religions, yes.

1) They are not scientific
2) Most advocate violence and persecution
i believe that islam relegion is unique , accurate , scientific and logical relegion

beside i believe either that islam not advocate violence unless against wrongdoers

Quote:
Many moderate followers abstain from violence and tend to grasp scientific concepts except for core aspects such as the Resurrection, but many of these moderates sympathize with the fundamentalists.
part of the relegion depends on the faith which not me niether you can prove or disprove it
so that we should to discuss the reliable parts which we can judge on it by our brains and our logic

Quote:
In any other setting, believing in talking donkeys, talking snakes, woman created from a man's rib, or a sky god speaking things into existence would possibly lead to treatment of a mental disorder. Yet, because the heritage of humans from primitive times to explain the world around them is religion, it's still given some merit today.
you are talking about christianity , not islam ?
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Old 11-15-2008, 04:11 PM
 
418 posts, read 649,757 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
i believe that islam relegion is unique , accurate , scientific and logical relegion

beside i believe either that islam not advocate violence unless against wrongdoers


part of the relegion depends on the faith which not me niether you can prove or disprove it
so that we should to discuss the reliable parts which we can judge on it by our brains and our logic



you are talking about christianity , not islam ?
I can assert that the Flying Spaghetti Monster is god supreme. Now disprove it! See? Two can play at that game. Instead, let's grow up.

Evildoers is relative. In the case of religion, evildoer is one who usually doesn't believe in your religion. There's your violence against "evildoers."

So Muslims don't include Genesis as part of their theology? If so, that's fine. We can begin the hunt for substitute talking donkeys in the Koran.
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Old 11-15-2008, 11:44 PM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnJLethal View Post
I can assert that the Flying Spaghetti Monster is god supreme. Now disprove it! See? Two can play at that game. Instead, let's grow up.
i can try to grow up in the way you want to

Quote:
Evildoers is relative. In the case of religion, evildoer is one who usually doesn't believe in your religion. There's your violence against "evildoers."
evildoers in islam involved everyone regardless of their relegions

Quote:
So Muslims don't include Genesis as part of their theology? If so, that's fine. We can begin the hunt for substitute talking donkeys in the Koran.
well done
let us starting with talking donkeys in the quran , where is it ?
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Old 11-16-2008, 12:34 AM
 
418 posts, read 649,757 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
i can try to grow up in the way you want to


evildoers in islam involved everyone regardless of their relegions


well done
let us starting with talking donkeys in the quran , where is it ?
I'm not pointing out talking donkeys, rather "substitutes" in the form of irrational miracles, or poor science.

You can start with this:

Does the Koran teach a flat earth?
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Old 11-16-2008, 11:28 AM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,661 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnJLethal View Post
I'm not pointing out talking donkeys, rather "substitutes" in the form of irrational miracles, or poor science.

You can start with this:

Does the Koran teach a flat earth?
so do you want my respond for all of them , or you want somthings specifically ?
anyway i will start with the one " like a carpet"
i'm expecting from you to be open minded

first of all , you should to know that The word "Ard" in Arabic means floor or land or ground and means earth either so it depend on the context
"He hath spread the earth as a bed, and hath traced out paths for you therein, and hath sent down rain from Heaven, and by it we bring forth the kinds of various herbs..." (Sura 20:53).

by the way the above translation is corrupted a little for a reason
the correct one is

"He Who has, made for you the earth like a carpet spread out ..........".

do you noticed the variations they did in the context !!!!
He hath spread the earth as a bed not like He Who has, made for you the earth like a carpet

i used to notice these corruptions from anti_islamic sites

the translation of "Ard" here can be understood as a floor or land
another thing , the word "mahdan" this word means flat (made it easy for people to walk )


And also it wouldn't make sense if Allah said 2 different things..
"He made the earth egg-shaped." (Quran 79:30)


so the first verse is referring to ground, prairies, flat desert, etc
and the second verse refers to earth as a planet


Last edited by elwill; 11-16-2008 at 11:43 AM..
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Old 11-16-2008, 06:35 PM
 
418 posts, read 649,757 times
Reputation: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
so do you want my respond for all of them , or you want somthings specifically ?
anyway i will start with the one " like a carpet"
i'm expecting from you to be open minded

first of all , you should to know that The word "Ard" in Arabic means floor or land or ground and means earth either so it depend on the context
"He hath spread the earth as a bed, and hath traced out paths for you therein, and hath sent down rain from Heaven, and by it we bring forth the kinds of various herbs..." (Sura 20:53).

by the way the above translation is corrupted a little for a reason
the correct one is

"He Who has, made for you the earth like a carpet spread out ..........".

do you noticed the variations they did in the context !!!!
He hath spread the earth as a bed not like He Who has, made for you the earth like a carpet

i used to notice these corruptions from anti_islamic sites

the translation of "Ard" here can be understood as a floor or land
another thing , the word "mahdan" this word means flat (made it easy for people to walk )


And also it wouldn't make sense if Allah said 2 different things..
"He made the earth egg-shaped." (Quran 79:30)


so the first verse is referring to ground, prairies, flat desert, etc
and the second verse refers to earth as a planet

This reminds me of typical Christian defenses..."taking it out of context" or the "translation is wrong."

Elwill, we can debate these things all day, but the bottom line is you believe in something unscientific. There is no scientific evidence for Allah, just as there is none for Yahweh or Zeus, Thor, Apollo, werewolves, Keebler Elves, unicorns, Jesus etc.

Until you can prove Allah exists scientifically, it's just a matter of faith which I reject as a reality.
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