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Old 01-12-2009, 04:08 PM
 
40,041 posts, read 26,720,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
you asked me about specefic behaviours as cegerates
you didn't mentioned any terrorist acts in your question
Given the prominence of terrorism by Muslims . . . it is odd that you would focus on such minor peccadillos to answer her question. This is part of the approved techniques of deception of infidels that is required by Allah until Islam is everywhere the only belief and Allah the only version of God.
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Old 01-12-2009, 04:26 PM
 
Location: Not where I want to be
1,113 posts, read 2,256,451 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuSuSushi View Post
Oh, so that makes it all okay then, because he's yanno...not hurting anyone. All right, how about the following:

Army of God - A leaderless group that produced a documentary on the Army Of God entitled Soldiers In The Army Of God. Using the name AOG, but not connected to them, Clayton Waagner was convicted for sending over 550 anthrax threat letters to clinics in 2001.
Lambs of Christ - The group claims to be nonviolent.
The Covenant, The Sword, and The Arm of the Lord - A doomsday group that built a compound and sent threatening letters to officials. The compound was peacefully taken in a siege and CSA members were later prosecuted.
Phineas Priesthood - a movement that opposes interracial intercourse.
Aryan Nations - Same people in the Christian Identity, different name.
Aryan Republican Army - also known as The Midwest Bank Robbers (2 men) committed a string of 22 bank robberies across the Midwestern United States in 1994 & 1995.
Oklahoma Constitutional Militia - a four man organization that wrote letters to government officials in the 1980's
Identity Christianity - A movement that started and ended in the 1980's.
KKK - A joke, not affiliated with any church.
National Liberation Front of Tripura - India????? Everyone is trying to liberate something.
Guardians of the Cedars - a former militia in Lebanon....who cares.

I could go on and on. How many Christian terrorist organizations would you like me to name?
These are not Christian Organizations and are not affiliated with any Denomination.....they are not considered organizations because they are not led by a governing body, there are no gatherings, and there is no membership process. These are very small pockets of people around the world that claim to be loosely associated with Christianity, but are not. You gotta do better than this and you can't compare these splinter groups to Islam who has a very violent presence around the world.
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Old 01-12-2009, 08:26 PM
 
Location: mass
2,905 posts, read 6,573,472 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsMtnsOnTheMind View Post
I especially love how the spiritual leader of the group said a prayer and then let them at the other "peaceful" protesters across the street. These are your everyday followers of Islam. Sadly, this is what we base our opinion of Islam on because we don't see anything else.
Because you aren't LOOKING for anything else. Protests and rallies around the world have been on the news practically daily, and not because they were not peaceful.

Not all the people in the FL video were screaming hateful words, and not all the people in the video prayed, did they?

So we could guess that they were not all muslim, or they were all muslim but some did not find the need to pray right then and there and possibly may not be very religious (or else they probably would have been praying with the rest of them), and or that not all muslims behave the way some of those in the video did.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
i completly agree with your last sentence
but may be with a little modification it must be
because we don't want to see anything else
my point exactly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
As long as the majority of Muslims do not object to and assist in catching and preventing these terrorists (a silent majority of support) . . . these "fruits" of Islam will be the basis upon which it shall be judged.
You are making the assumption that the majority of Muslims do not object to terrorists. Can you tell me where you are getting this information?

You also seem to think that the majority of muslims know the plans of terrorists yet do nothing about it. Do you think the terrorists tell Mom & Dad and the whole neighborhood before the commit the terrorist acts? I believe that if the "majority" of muslims knew about 9/11 prior, it would not have occurred.

People seem to think its a giant conspiracy, all the Muslims know who the terrorists are, but shhhh don't tell.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
No disrespect intended, but how much studying into islam have you really done?
Enough to recognize those that have done so from a completely biased perspective. And enough to agree that my kids will be raised Muslim. And enough to decide for my own, free willed, blond haired, blue eyed full-blooded American heart, that the religion was as true and believable as any other out there. My research was done using Islamic resources, not the biased and uninformed media, not the crazy Moderator cut: edit associated with the religion, or anything else.

Being Muslim is just not a big deal.

I would like to know, since you asked, how much you have looked into Islam? And what sources did you use? Where are you getting your information?

I am curious to know how many muslims you know? Please, tell me your experiences with real live, actual Muslims.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
the problem that I have is that we see people dancing in the streets as a result of a terrorist action. We also rarely see any real condemnation from muslims for the terrorist activities done in the name of islam.
You haven't seen anything but what has been put on the news. Have you been to a Muslim country? There has been condemnation, and I have listed it here or on another thread. But it is never enough for people who really don't want to acknowledge it.

and frankly, kdbrich, there are going to be people dancing in the streets over a lot of things that may horrify the rest of us. Did you not see Reginald Denney be yanked out of his tractor trailer and get the $hit kicked out of him by a mob of angry black people? Did we then say that all black people are bad? Hell no, that was obviously a group that did not represent the norm.

It is unbelievable what people get away with saying about Muslims, that they would never be able to say about blacks, hispanics, jews, asians, white people, or any other group.

When is everyone going to learn that we cannot make generalizations about entire groups of people?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
And lastly, anywhere in the country where you see an islamic country, they just don't play nicely and get along with their neighbors. It's just a sad fact that war exists where there are muslims.
Give me a break. This is so ridiculous it's preposterous. How do you explain all the wars that DIDN'T involve Muslims? I guess the Germans, Japanese, Russians and Cubans are all secret Muslims.
Quote:
Originally Posted by beeveenh View Post
This is what my sister told me about Islam. That all of the above mentioned behaviors, as well as living with her Muslim boyfriend are not considered clean, but that she and he are not judged. They can be considered a Muslim and will just be judged by Allah.
Is her statement accurate? Or are there required standards that Muslims must adhere to to be in good standing in the Muslim "congregation"?
Thanks, just trying to understand where she is coming from. I don't consider her an expert on Islam.
First of all, she is not going to be considered Muslim unless she has converted. Until that happens, she is whatever she was before she started to live with the Muslim boyfriend.

Regarding the rest of it, it is all in your choice of words. No, the congregation is not going to "judge" her in the sense that they are going to say she is "going to hell" for this or that. They leave that for God alone. God is the judge of everyone's behavior, not people. However, her living situation would absolutely be frowned upon by religious people. they are not going to tell them not to come to the mosque, but yes, some muslims if they are religious may try to exert pressure on the couple to "do the right thing". I will tell you that my DH, who was quite a non religious Muslim, and I lived together before we got married. His brother refused to come to our apartment. He also did not want us sleeping together in his apartment. This was most definitely a problem for his brother. I am sure he was fervently praying for us. My father in law, on the other hand, didn't have a problem with it and came and stayed with us at our apartment. As in Christianity and every other faith, you have varying levels of "participation" or "following the rules" if you will. Some unknowledgeable people would like everyone to believe that all muslims are strictly religious but this simply is not the case.

But anyway, to answer your question, no the other people are not going to "judge" your sister, but if they are religious, they will be very clear in their belief that her and her boyfriend's behavior is against the religion, and frankly they may look down upon them both. (if this is the type of "judging" you are referring to, then yes, she will be judged)
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
This is part of the approved techniques of deception of infidels that is required by Allah until Islam is everywhere the only belief and Allah the only version of God.
Huh?
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsMtnsOnTheMind View Post
These are not Christian Organizations and are not affiliated with any Denomination.....they are not considered organizations because they are not led by a governing body, there are no gatherings, and there is no membership process. These are very small pockets of people around the world that claim to be loosely associated with Christianity, but are not. You gotta do better than this and you can't compare these splinter groups to Islam who has a very violent presence around the world.
Of course they are not Christian organizations!

But those crazy terrorist Muslims must definitely represent ALL of them! Yes, it is not Al Qaida, it's ISLAM.

I know a federal air marshal, whose area of expertise is Muslim extremist groups. He doesn't believe all Muslims are terrorists, and HE should know. HE is protecting our airplanes, as we speak.

Last edited by june 7th; 01-13-2009 at 08:52 PM..
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Old 01-12-2009, 11:12 PM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Given the prominence of terrorism by Muslims . . . it is odd that you would focus on such minor peccadillos to answer her question. This is part of the approved techniques of deception of infidels that is required by Allah until Islam is everywhere the only belief and Allah the only version of God.
if muslims own universal good media as jews own , it will be very easy to give the prominence of terrorism by jews and christians

anyway mysticphd / his first question in the first place was about specific behaviours , may be i misunderstood him but i didn't intend to deceive anyone

face me with my deception instead of throw your accusations against me in such manner

peace
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Old 01-12-2009, 11:14 PM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsMtnsOnTheMind View Post
Funny how so many of them are doing what is wrong. Speaks volumes about Islam.
how many of them doing the wrong
can you give statistics according to total muslims in the world ?
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Old 01-12-2009, 11:19 PM
 
40,041 posts, read 26,720,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
anyway mysticphd / his first question in the first place was about specific behaviours , may be i misunderstood him but i didn't intend to deceive anyone

face me with my deception instead of throw your accusations against me in such manner

peace
But I don't know you, elwill . . . sufficiently to direct any accusations toward you. I only know of the approval by Allah with regard to infidels and deception . . . so that is all I can say. Whether you are guilty of following Allah's permission or not . . . I cannot tell.
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Old 01-12-2009, 11:38 PM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beeveenh View Post
Yes, I sited specific behaviors. I'm in conversation with my sister about this very topic. What she was telling me sounded like it didn't matter if you attempted to avoid sinning...you can be a Muslim...there is no standard.

Then after reading some of these posts, I thought, "well if there is no standard for these behaviors...then where do Muslims draw the line?" I have heard many times Muslims seperating themselves from terrorist Muslims. But if there is no standard then why distance yourself? Muslim is Muslim, to be judged only by Allah, no?
i'm sure that there are some confusion here
i will give you an example
in islam you must to pray and fast in ramadan and you must pay annual zakat , women should cover her hair
but what if some muslims dosn't pray , fast or paying zakat ?
is that mean that he became apostate ? no he will still muslim but he will be judged by God for his disobeying

islam prohibit me to look at sexual material for example
but my looking at it will not get me out of islam , but i will be muslim subjected to punishment in hearafter if i didn't repent

the relegion of islam is the most relegion in the world have standards for behaviours of it's followers
the behaviours which influence other's right should be judged by sharaih laws
the behaviours which influence self's right will be judged by God in hearafter
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Old 01-12-2009, 11:43 PM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
Reputation: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
But I don't know you, elwill . . . sufficiently to direct any accusations toward you. I only know of the approval by Allah with regard to infidels and deception . . . so that is all I can say. Whether you are guilty of following Allah's permission or not . . . I cannot tell.
tell me what you know regarding to infidels
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Old 01-13-2009, 01:53 AM
 
40,041 posts, read 26,720,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
tell me what you know regarding to infidels
Jihad is war against the infidels and . . . "War is deceit."(Volume 4, Book 52, Number 267, 268, 269).
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Old 01-13-2009, 04:28 AM
 
995 posts, read 1,201,304 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Jihad is war against the infidels and . . . "War is deceit."(Volume 4, Book 52, Number 267, 268, 269).
You people amuse me with your utter ignorance and prejudice of Islam and its prophet Jihad..that word is always misquoted and misunderstood even by some of its followers..itjihad which means the struggles against oneself (lust etc etc) that is the greatest jihad.

The prophet only fought in self-defence and that too only after given permission by God. What is funny about his tribe the Quraish was that those who oppose him, most of them believe that he was a messenger but still opposed him due to the fact that they were not willing to abandon their forefathers gods.


Let me ask you: Based on history up to the present times : Would you agree that more people have been killed in the name of Jesus compared to those in the name of Islam even if you were add in all those killed by muslim extremists?
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