U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 01-24-2009, 07:24 PM
 
Location: North Georgia
76 posts, read 184,343 times
Reputation: 65

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bideshi
Since a woman is supposed to submit to her husband, how can a man rape his wife?
That is an absolutely disgusting attitude, just totally disgusting. I can't believe anyone would actually go by that and those who do should be ashamed of themselves. It's criminal is what it is.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-24-2009, 09:37 PM
 
1,186 posts, read 2,063,970 times
Reputation: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bideshi View Post
Since a woman is supposed to submit to her husband, how can a man rape his wife?

when a boy friend and his girl friend make love
are not they actually commiting adultery?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-24-2009, 09:52 PM
 
1,186 posts, read 2,063,970 times
Reputation: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by moonshadow View Post
but it just smacks of women being second class citizens to me. .

what class is the wife who does not keep the honor of her husband and does not respect him and insist on doing that
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-24-2009, 10:02 PM
 
1,186 posts, read 2,063,970 times
Reputation: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bideshi View Post
Since a woman is supposed to submit to her husband, how can a man rape his wife?
when she is sick or in pain or in period or during the day of the fasting month
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-24-2009, 10:40 PM
 
Location: mass
2,905 posts, read 6,573,472 times
Reputation: 4979
Quote:
Originally Posted by delusianne View Post
Of course men can beat their wives if they want to, according to the Qur'an. Don't lie.
No, the Quran does not give men the right to "BEAT" their women according to the definition of BEAT in merriam webster.
Quote:
Originally Posted by delusianne View Post
I suppose because he is allowed the religious education, and the wife is not
Can you tell me where you got the idea that the women are not allowed a religious education?
Quote:
Originally Posted by delusianne View Post
- and Islam allows and encourages men to beat their wives.
Where did you get this idea? "Islam allows and encourages" men to beat their wives... Or is this just your opinion? If you call it fact please give references.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
No.
crooked rib NOT a defect of creation.
crooked rib NOT an insult to thinking.
It’s only a matter of design.

A Prophetic tradition mentions:
‘Women are created from the rib, which is naturally crooked, and its crookedness is more at the top; if you try to straighten it by force it will break; if you leave it, it will stay as it is. So accept my advice and treat your wives with kindness.’

Basically, this tradition is every man’s guide to dealing with women in a just manner without imposing his thinking, or attempting to re-mould her in a manner harsh enough to break her spirit and wounding her heart.
Very good way to explain this elwill.
Quote:
Originally Posted by calmdude View Post
-many muslim females in Turkey and India are much more "liberated" than in middle east. My feeling is they (along with muslims in the west) would answer many of these questions quite differently than a typical muslim female in Saudi.
just because WE think they are liberated doesn't mean they are liberated. They don't allow women at universities to cover their head. Do you realize how many women are probably NOT getting an education because they refuse to go to school without their head covered? Or how many father's are not allowing them to go w/out their heads covered. So basically, they are trying to improve women's rights, but are taking away women's rights. The very women that they are trying to educate are probably not getting their education because of rules like this. In Turkey, women are fighting for their RIGHT to wear their headscarf, and yes, in other countries they may be fighting for the RIGHT to take it off. Both situations are wrong. To force a woman to wear it and to not allow a woman to wear it. In both cases the choice has been taken away from the woman. This is not liberation. Someone else is still deciding for them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
why you didn't complete my statement ? i said either "and surely there are many means to do that without hitting them or revilence him"

i can beat my children to descipline them by many ways
for example
1- not give them money
2-not to buy for them their daily candy
3- not to play with them
4- not to take them to the garden in thier holiday

and i don't think that any law in the world can forbidden me to beat my children by this way
but elwill this is not "beat".
You must be a very harsh daddy to take away their daily candylol!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-24-2009, 10:51 PM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
Reputation: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Ice View Post
That is exactly the attitude of the Muslim Cleric that this thread was about. Thankyou for clearing it up for me. Showing me that there are these types of attitudes on both sides of the fence between these two religions. That the Muslims and the Christians are really no different as I suspected all along. They both have their share of fanatics and they also both have their share of genuinely good and intelligent people.
when you raised this topic , i ignored to respond because i felt that it's another hatred post against islam without any intendence from you to assure the information

but , once you asked for the openions of muslims themselfs in this forum , i responded to you that i disagree with him ( in page 4 i think ) , and i condemned him and i described my reasoning and discribed either why the cleric said that

but seems to me that you insist that muslims agree with him , i don't know why
if you give yourself chance to search in muslims sites you will find thier answers and thier reasoning the same as me
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-24-2009, 11:15 PM
 
9,912 posts, read 12,468,996 times
Reputation: 7280
Quote:
Originally Posted by moonsun View Post
what class is the wife who does not keep the honor of her husband and does not respect him and insist on doing that
Never been one for class systems. Must be the Irish in my blood.

In a relationship, to my mind, there's no point being there if you cannot respect each other.

There should be no extra onus placed on the woman, than on that of the man merely by virtue of one's gender.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-25-2009, 12:26 AM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
Reputation: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommytotwo View Post
but elwill this is not "beat".
You must be a very harsh daddy to take away their daily candylol!
i'm still single , i have no children , and i think that it will be hard for me either to see my childern sad , but someone should to be strict if he seek good future for his family

i want to say That the word "idribuhunna" for instance which translated to beat , could very well mean to "leave" them. It is exactly like telling someone to "beat it" or "drop it" in English.

i just wanted to transmit this meaning , the quran reveald in arabic not english , so quran didn't say beat , it said idribuhunna , i'm trying to find common land or common link to understand each other
i'm not native in english , i even not practise it in my practical daily life , but i'm native in arabic (the language of quran ) , and i'm trying to use this advantage to describe quran according to culture of arab


and note that i trying to support my view with more evidences , so that no one will think that i justify or twist or decieve my relegion in biased manner or blindness
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-25-2009, 02:16 AM
 
787 posts, read 1,546,364 times
Reputation: 476
Quote:
just because WE think they are liberated doesn't mean they are liberated.
you've got to be kidding yourself if you think that they aren't more liberated.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-25-2009, 07:39 AM
 
4,172 posts, read 5,990,486 times
Reputation: 1199
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommytotwo View Post
...just because WE think they are liberated doesn't mean they are liberated. They don't allow women at universities to cover their head. Do you realize how many women are probably NOT getting an education because they refuse to go to school without their head covered? Or how many father's are not allowing them to go w/out their heads covered. So basically, they are trying to improve women's rights, but are taking away women's rights. The very women that they are trying to educate are probably not getting their education because of rules like this. In Turkey, women are fighting for their RIGHT to wear their headscarf, and yes, in other countries they may be fighting for the RIGHT to take it off. Both situations are wrong. To force a woman to wear it and to not allow a woman to wear it. In both cases the choice has been taken away from the woman. This is not liberation. Someone else is still deciding for them.
....!
...just like someone tells them - right from birth - that putting on certain garb is the right thing to do or modesty patrols in Turkey who harass women? A large chunk of people there are busy fighting off forcible injection of religion in various institutions and a large chunk is equally opposed. That country, as you know, has been having constant battle between secular and religious people and is still struggling to define itself to the satisfaction of most of its people.. I have had a lot of Turkish friends in grad school, 2 turkish neighbors, visited some places in '07, etc and have had the opportunity to discuss some of these things. I am convinced that many women there are far far more liberated than those in Saudi. Some women I talked to simply consider themselves to be almost European (even though only a small part of Turkey is in Eurpoe) in a lot of ways and hate the conservative imams whose minions' modesty patrols (in countries like Indonesia, Turkey, Saudi - do a google) often put pressure on women for more appropriate behavior (Turkey: Threat to secular state or modernising force? Ruling party awaits the verdict | World news | The Guardian),
('Aqoul: Another Woman Put In Her Place in Saudi Arabia?) Turkey has both conservative and liberal types in substantial numbers, and that includes women of both types.

Edit: the fatwah issed on the female Indian tennis player for "inappropriate" dress is the same kind of "modesty partol". To her credit, this teenager contnues to play and was in the world top 30 last year. Back to my earlier point - the religion definately seems to be very male centric. Maybe, in the middle east it is more so since the google for "modesty patrols" also shows some jews doing exactly the same.

Last edited by calmdude; 01-25-2009 at 08:22 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top