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Old 04-27-2009, 09:22 AM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
See post# 49 by braderjoe.
i don't mean to be annoying for you , i just want to understand your point , it's okey with me if you don't want to be specific
actually my big problem is that i can't see the disputions or the contradictions between what braderjoe said and what you said

i hope if anyone understand your point to describe it for me clearly

thank you for your time sanspeur

Last edited by elwill; 04-27-2009 at 09:33 AM..
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Old 04-27-2009, 09:36 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,874 posts, read 31,750,270 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
i don't mean to be annoying for you , i just want to understand your point , it's okey with me if you don't want to be specific (may be you don't know what you supposed to say ! )

actually my big problem is that i can't see the disputions or the contradictions between what braderjoe said and what you said

i hope if anyone understand your point to describe it for me clearly

thank you for your time sanspeur
Is it that you cannot see it, or you don't want to see it...The post is pretty plain and easy to understand.

{He has let free the two seas meeting to gather. There is a barrier between them. They do not transgress.} (Qur'an 55:19-20)

The above quote according to braderjoe states that the Mediterranean and Atlantic do not mix..This is untrue.

{He is the one who has let free the two bodies of flowing water, one sweet and palatable, and the other salty and bitter. And He has made between them a barrier and a forbidding partition.} (Qur'an 25:53)

This is to do with fresh water draining into the sea....It is also obviously untrue.

Plain enough for you?
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Old 04-27-2009, 10:12 AM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
Is it that you cannot see it, or you don't want to see it...The post is pretty plain and easy to understand.

{He has let free the two seas meeting to gather. There is a barrier between them. They do not transgress.} (Qur'an 55:19-20)

The above quote according to braderjoe states that the Mediterranean and Atlantic do not mix..This is untrue.

{He is the one who has let free the two bodies of flowing water, one sweet and palatable, and the other salty and bitter. And He has made between them a barrier and a forbidding partition.} (Qur'an 25:53)

This is to do with fresh water draining into the sea....It is also obviously untrue.

Plain enough for you?
yes it very obvious now , but did you noticed either that braderjoe said

Modern Science has discovered that in the places where two different
seas meet, there is a barrier between them. This barrier divides the two seas so that each sea has its own temperature, salinity, and density.
(Principles of Oceanography - Davis, pp. 92-93)


so he actualy described this kind of separations to be in temperature , salinity and density , though two seas meet together
so i think that it's you who misunderstood his point


he said either
The Mediterranean sea water as it enters the Atlantic over the Gibraltar sill with its own warm, saline and less dense characteristics, because of the barrier that distinguishes between them. Temperatures are in degrees Celsius (C).
Even in depths (indicated here by darker colors) up to 1,400 meters and at distances ranging from a minus -100 to +2,500 meters, we find that both bodies of water maintain their individual temperatures and salinity.
THE SEAS NOT MINGLING WITH ONE ANOTHER


his saying here either clear the kind of separation or division he's taking about

when he cite the verse , he described it saying
This property of the seas, that is, that they meet and yet do not intermix,
do you know what he means with that " they meet but not intermix" ?
he didn't say that they don't mix , he said intermix , big difference


afterall all you didn't quote any sceintific sites , you are talking about somthing seems to you true when you see it by your naked eyes
but you didn't realize that braderjoe allready said
The human eye cannot see the difference between the two seas that meet, rather the two seas appear to us as one homogeneous sea. Likewise the human eye cannot see the division of water in estuaries into the three kinds: the fresh water, the salt water, the partition (zone of separation).


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Old 04-27-2009, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,874 posts, read 31,750,270 times
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Mix, intermix...No difference.
Have it your way then...If Islam prefers to lie, distort science and make unfounded ridiculous claims as I have exposed, so be it, but your argument is beyond silly.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:11 AM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
Mix, intermix...No difference.
Have it your way then...If Islam prefers to lie, distort science and make unfounded ridiculous claims as I have exposed, so be it, but your argument is beyond silly.

i appreciate your time , sanspeur


thank you
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:13 AM
 
995 posts, read 1,201,304 times
Reputation: 117
Thank you bro elwill....
And this begs the question : How can a man who lived in the desert all his life know about this? And this is only the tip of the iceberg.

Regarding Human Reproduction :
The Quran says :
" God created you in stages " (71:4) "(God) creates you inside the bodies of your mothers, in stages, one after another" (39:6)

The starting point in human reproduction is sexual intercourse. During this act, the male sex organ releases a small quantity of semen into the cervix of the vagina. It has been shown that this semen contains 350,000,000 spermatozoa in one single ejaculation. The spermatozoa is the plural for the word spermatozoon and this is the actual fertilising cell. This is the male fertilising agent which is also called sperm but the spermatozoon is scientifically more accurate as it is the fertilising cell. Modern Biology has shown that only one spermatozoon out of the 350,000,000 spermatozoa is all that is needed for fertilisation to occur with the female egg, the ovule.

Let us see what the Qur'an says:-
God created man from a sperm " (16:4) and in another verse:-
" Was (man) not a sperm which has been poured out?. " (75:37)

The semen, or spermatic liquid, which is ejaculated contains more than just spermatozoa. This liquid is formed by secretions from many glands. They are a) the testicles, b) the seminal vesicles, c) the prostate glands and d) the glands annexed to the urinary tract. All these secretions mix and mingle to form the spermatic liquid.

Qur'an mentioned this 1400 years ago:-
Verily, We created man from a small quantity of mingled liquids " (76:2)

After the ejaculation of the semen into the cervix of the vagina, the sperm travels to the Fallopian tube and fertilisation will occur there with the ovule. Once the ovule has been fertilised, it descends into the womb, or the uterus, via the Fallopian tube and it implants itself there by clinging to the wall of the uterus.

This is referred to in the Qur'an in the following verses:-
" We have created you from...something which cling " (22:5)
" We have created the sperm into something which clings " (23:14)
" Was (man) not a sperm which has been poured out. After that he was something which clings, then (God) fashioned him in due proportion" (75:37-38)

[color=#008000]The Qur'an calls the fertilised egg "something which clings" because it clings to the wall of the uterus as mentioned earlier. The Qur'an calls the fertilised egg "something which clings" because it clings to the wall of the uterus as mentioned earlier.

It is important to note that the implantation of the fertilised egg has to take place inside the womb for pregnancy to occur. If the implantation takes place somewhere else instead of the womb, e.g. in the Fallopian tube, then pregnancy will not take place. The Qur'an tells us the place where the fertilised egg implants itself and the fact that it has to take place there as science tells us now:-

" We cause whom We will to rest in the womb for an appointed term" (22:5)

After the fertilised egg has been implanted in the womb, it begins to evolve into the embryo. The Qur'an describes this evolution by breaking it down into different stages.

The description of the Qur'an is brief but very accurate:-
" We have fashioned the thing which clings into a chewed lump of flesh and We fashioned the chewed lump of flesh into bones then We clothed the bones with intact flesh " (23:14)

As already mentioned, the "something which clings" is the fertilised egg which clings to the wall of the womb.
If you take a piece of meat and chew it once and then take it out of your mouth and look at it, it will look exactly to what the embryo will look like after three weeks of development. This has been shown by a renowned professor of embryology by the name of Keith L.Moore and is shown in his book entitled "The Developing Human" (3rd edition).

I'll stop here for you to read and ponder how on earth this knowledge was in the Quran 1400 years. That part about the 'chewed lump of flesh' - even Dr Moore was astounded. He researched and agreed with the Quran and he incoporated that part into his book. He testified that no human 1400 years ago could have known about this as you would need an electron microscope to look at the foetus at so early a stage.

Let me end with this story:

A man went to visit the prophet Muhammad (PBUH) one day. The prophet said "I have recived news that you have a new baby", the man said "that is correct, messenger of Allah, he was born yesterday". The prophet replied "this baby who was born yesterday, eho does he look like, who does he resemble, does he resemble you or does he resemble his mother?". The man said "messenger of Allah, he will resemble one of the two. He will either resemble me or he will resemble his mother. Isn't that the way?. The prophet said:-
" No, do not say that. If the sperm falls into the womb, Allah (S.W.T) brings forth every characteristic between it and between Adam".(meaning the embryo will inherit characteristics from as far back as Adam (PBUH)

What does modern genetics say about this?. It tells us that the gene which transmits these characteristics is able to deliver to you these characteristics from your oldest forefathers even if it was 10 million years ago. (Isn't that what this illiterate man said 1400 years ago).

Today's firmly established human reproduction concepts are in total agreement with the Qur'an. But if the Qur'anic verses on this subject are compared with the general theories that were held at the time of the Qur'anic revelation, 1400 years ago, they would be like chalk and cheese.


One of the ridiculous myths that were held at the time of the Qur'anic revelation was regarding vaccination. Whenever we travel anywhere these days, we usually take vaccinations against various types of dangerous diseases before we leave. At the time of the prophet (PBUH), they also used to have a system of vaccinations but it SLIGHTLY differed from ours!!!.
The system they used was that whenever you were about to enter a new city, you would stand at the beginning of this city, and make a noise like a donkey. Whenever you were to eat something in that city, you would make a noise like a donkey and this noise-making is what they thought would prevent them of acquiring disease.
See the difference, like chalk and cheese. it was only in the 19th century that science began to have some answers to the mysterious world of human reproduction.

Dear Sanspeur. How can you account for the fact that an illiterate man, 1400 years ago, without any scientific background and living in a backward civilisation, predict scientific phenomena which have only now been discovered with the advent of extremely sophisticated and powerful microscopes and with the acquisition of scientific knowledge?. How can you account for all this unless you submit to the fact that Muhammad (PBUH) was a prophet sent by God, ALLAH, as a mercy to mankind.There is no compulsion on you to accept the truth, as Allah, says in his book, the Qur'an:-
" There is no compulsion in religion " (2:256)

But it is certainly a shame upon human intellect when man is not even interested in finding out the truth. In Islam, we are taught that God has given us a mind and the faculty of reason to look at things objectively and systematically for ourselves. To reflect, then to question, to reach the truth. Religion should not be accepted blindly, as some religions seem to do. In those religions, you are regarded as blasphemous to question your own religion. Islam invites you to do that.

Allah (S.W.T) says :
" We have sent thee (O Muhammad) except as a universal (messenger) to the whole of mankind, as a giver of glad tidings, and as a warner, but still the majority of mankind still do not know...

Dear Sanspeur & Others. Before you form an opinion of Islam, I want to ask you one question. Is your existing knowledge of Islam thorough enough or have you obtained what you know through television, newspapers and non-Muslim third party sources who do not know anything about the real Islam?. You owe it to yourself to question and find out more about Islam from reliable and unbiased sources.

“Indeed, We have warned you of a near punishment on the Day when a man will observe what his hands have put forth and the disbeliever will say: ‘Oh, I wish that I were dust!’” (Quran 78:40)
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:16 AM
 
8,743 posts, read 10,273,174 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kdbrich View Post
Because the other religions are false? We don't outlaw 'em...but they're still false.
HAH!

And I am willing to bet you cry and get upset when others dont want to respect your religion.

They dont want to respect your religion-and for a good reason.
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Old 04-30-2009, 05:24 PM
 
90 posts, read 123,358 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmyRanger View Post
There is bad people in all religions, what I was getting at was that Islamics are afraid of thier people being exposed to Christianity. It's because the tenets of thier religion cannot stand up to close scrutiny when compared to Christianity.

islamic countries have churches.
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Old 05-05-2009, 01:24 PM
 
73 posts, read 117,315 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmyRanger View Post
There is bad people in all religions, what I was getting at was that Islamics are afraid of thier people being exposed to Christianity. It's because the tenets of thier religion cannot stand up to close scrutiny when compared to Christianity.

How is Christianity any better?

Capella’s Guide to Atheism - An Atheist’s Guide to Scripture and more… » Bible atrocities

click for link for list of biblical atrocities.
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Old 05-06-2009, 03:40 AM
 
67 posts, read 93,962 times
Reputation: 20
[quote=FunkyMonk;8189548]Christians are equally afraid of their followers taking interest in other religions. They are equally intolerent of other belief systems.

The only difference is that in those Islamic countries, Muslem fundamentalists control the government and make the rules. In countries with lots of Christians like th US, there is a seperation of Church and State.

So the real difference is not with the religions, but with the forms of government. The religions are actually quite similar.

By the way, what specifically is superior about Christianity over Islam?[/quote

well why not try to find out?, i choose to live and work at all Muslim offices for many years, i respect a mans home so i would remove my shoes, if he came to my home he could but i used to suggest that he kept his shoes on because of Dog hairs lol. i have great amusement looking at religious practice.
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