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Old 09-09-2009, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3~Shepherds View Post
Jesus has always been alive even in the Old Testament.....................
A Prophet Like Unto Moses - http://www.jewsforjesus.org/publications/issues/11_4/prophet/......................
Yes, Moses did speak of a deliverer to come. Tucked into the midst of the summary of the Law in the eighteenth chapter of Devarim (Deuteronomy), talking about the punishment of false prophets, Moses made a remarkable prophecy:
"The Lord your God will raise up for you a Prophet like unto me from the midst, of your brethren. Him you shall hear."

The text describes how that Prophet would be like Moses, as it recalls the experience of a nation that has been memorialized and burned into our consciousness.
"The LORD your God will raise up for you a Prophet like me from your midst, from your brethren. Him you shall hear, according to all you desired of the LORD your God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, 'Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, nor let me see this great fire anymore, lest I die.' "And the LORD said to me: 'What they have spoken is good.
'I will raise up for them a Prophet like you from among their brethren, and will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them all that I command Him.
'And it shall be [that] whoever will not hear My words, which He speaks in My name, I will require [it] of him." (Deuteronomy 18:18,19)


Native Americans who believe in Jesus...................NACF Native American Christian Issues page (http://www.stanford.edu/group/nacf/issues.html - broken link)

Interesting, this organization only has three churches, 2 listed in California and 1 in Arizona, not a very large number of individuals.

Also.............The Navajos, Peyote and Jesus | Busted Halo
Quanah Parker
“The White Man goes into church and talks about Jesus. The Indian goes into his tepee and talks with Jesus.” WE SHOULD TAKE THIS WISE ADVICE!!!!
By the early 1900s, the peyote religious movement developed into the Native American Church (NAC), which today boasts over 250,000 Native American members, making it the biggest pan-Native American religious organization. There is no formal church hierarchy and meetings are usually held in tepees on a need basis, usually when a member seeks healing for an illness. Today one-fourth of Native Americans participate in NAC ceremonies.
And this particular article is supported by the Catholic Church and there are a lot of disagreements within the article. 250,000 Native American members is a small drop compared to over 8 million Native Americans. I have a tendency to question anything that is supported by the Roman Catholic Church.
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Old 09-09-2009, 01:30 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
3,334 posts, read 5,260,685 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3~Shepherds View Post
Quanah Parker
“The White Man goes into church and talks about Jesus. The Indian goes into his tepee and talks with Jesus.” WE SHOULD TAKE THIS WISE ADVICE!!!!
By the early 1900s, the peyote religious movement developed into the Native American Church (NAC), which today boasts over 250,000 Native American members, making it the biggest pan-Native American religious organization. There is no formal church hierarchy and meetings are usually held in tepees on a need basis, usually when a member seeks healing for an illness. Today one-fourth of Native Americans participate in NAC ceremonies.
What you said is true. And the NAC started with my Comanche people. For those who do not know, Quanah Parker was the last of our "War Chiefs" and became a leader (actually was appointed by the government) during the reservation and post-reservation period (our rez was dissolved in 1903). BTW, I am related to the Parkers, though I am not "A" Parker.

Now, MOST NDN people, including the ones who started the NAC - the Comanche - are not members or participants in the NAC. NDN people come in all stripes: tribal traditionalists, NAC, mainstream Christians, fundamentalists, agnostics and atheists. Many of us who are more traditional, do not follow the NAC because some of us do not feel the melding of Christianity with the peyote thing is for us, so we do not participate. At the same time, we don't look down or criticize those who do participate. I have family members and close friends who are NAC and that is their way. I prefer the more traditional way. We don't argue over that. To suggest that all should follow NAC is not really the right way to look at it.

Lastly, to any non-NDNs who are considering the NAC or imitating their ways, it is illegal for you to use peyote. Only those who a enrolled in a federally recognized nation can legally use peyote. Just something to think about.

Last edited by Fullback32; 09-09-2009 at 02:10 PM..
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Old 09-09-2009, 01:44 PM
Status: "Living rent-free in Mr. Wade’s head" (set 1 day ago)
 
Location: Walt Disney World
16,348 posts, read 8,896,576 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxcar Overkill View Post
Then its your Creators fault for making such foolish rules. He needlessly killed his own son, even if it's only for a few days.

Because when one of my boys does something wrong, I simply make them apologize. I don't require blood for blood. Maybe your God never thought of that.

I know, you've surrendered any rational thought about this subject, and you'll just throw your hands in the air and say we can't question your great God. No reason to use our heads and try to examine what you believe with any logic.
Proverbs 3:7 (New International Version)


7 Do not be wise in your own eyes;
fear the LORD and shun evil.


1 Corinthians 1:18 (New International Version)


Christ the Wisdom and Power of God

18For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
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Old 09-09-2009, 03:52 PM
 
227 posts, read 303,103 times
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after thousands years and after many Prophets God sent to us..... God remembered at last time that there was a sin of Adam , and Jesus his "son" and the incent one, he should payed it !!!!!!!!? for his father Adam and us !!!!! its not fair , and its nearer to lie story ,
the different beteween you and us :
you : God sent Jesus to died for the sin
us : God sent Jesus as he sent many Prophet to pray him alone " GOD alone without partener"
you : believe that God is three " father , son , Holy sprit"
us : believe that God is one , and Jesus his Prophet , and Holy sprit is one of his angels
you : Jesus died in the cross and he is alive and he will come back
us : Jesus did not ( God saved him ) and he is alive and he will come back
You : Jesus is the son of God
us : Jesus is a Prophet as many Prophets sent to us and he was created from female " Marry" as Eve created from male " Adam" and as Adam created without male or female, and created us from male
and female
You : the Bible did not sent to Jesus from God
Us : the Origin Bible sent by God to Jesus directly , the Origin Bible belong to Jesus
you : the jews is the cause that made God forgived you sins, and Jesus will come back to him and then, they will believe in him !!!
us : the jews were the killers of the Prophets and they denied of them not only Jesus
You : believe that Jesus will come back to You and the Jews
Us : believe that Jesus will come back to kill the Al Massih ad-Dajjal (antichrist)

Last edited by insan777; 09-09-2009 at 04:05 PM..
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Old 09-11-2009, 09:27 AM
 
17,497 posts, read 10,657,170 times
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pstum and fullback32, Thanks for your responses and respect. I wasn't saying I agreed with them. I feel you don't need to get high to come to Jesus, so I diffently wasn't promoting this. I actually, had heard of this, but thought it wasn't being practiced anymore.

Some felt Native Americans have never agreed with Christianity and I found this to be false. There is also a Christian group called Warriors for Christ.........................Warriors for Christ - Statement of Faith They seem to support a more non-organized Christianity.
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Old 09-11-2009, 10:18 AM
 
Location: Utah
2,331 posts, read 3,018,810 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3~Shepherds View Post
Some felt Native Americans have never agreed with Christianity and I found this to be false. There is also a Christian group called Warriors for Christ.........................Warriors for Christ - Statement of Faith They seem to support a more non-organized Christianity.
Although there were certainly people in the Americas before they arrived, Mormons believe that a group of Hebrews led by a prophet migrated from Jerusalem to the Americas about 600 BC. A summary of their records for the next 1,000 years until the record keepers were killed in battle is contained in "The Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ."

That book demonstrates that Jesus Christ was known in the Americas, he even visited those "other sheep" not long after his resurrection and taught them pretty much the same things he taught in the Old World.

A friend of mine recently visited with the chief of the Hopi in Arizona. He was told that oral tradition has the ancestors of the Hopi coming from Jerusalem. There is a great deal of other evidence and tradition of a "white god" being prominent in the Americas.
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Old 09-11-2009, 10:37 AM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
10,513 posts, read 10,330,531 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3~Shepherds View Post
pstum and fullback32, Thanks for your responses and respect. I wasn't saying I agreed with them. I feel you don't need to get high to come to Jesus, so I diffently wasn't promoting this. I actually, had heard of this, but thought it wasn't being practiced anymore.

Some felt Native Americans have never agreed with Christianity and I found this to be false. There is also a Christian group called Warriors for Christ.........................Warriors for Christ - Statement of Faith They seem to support a more non-organized Christianity.
3~Shepherds, I can see where some Native Americans see the similarities in their belief and that of Christianity. Although different nations may believe a little differently than others, the basics are the same, we have a belief in a Creator, we may call him by many different names, in Christianity you call him God and just like Christians we believe that he is the Creator of everything but here's where we differ and I cannot speak for all, however I will speak for myself, where I differ from Christianity, I believe that every living thing has a spirit, not just man but every living thing, animal and plant, I believe that the Earth is our mother and that we come from that, just like your sacred book says, I also believe that we should respect all living things, whatever they may be, I also believe that no one's belief is any better than anyone else's and that we are all entitled to believe as we may with respect to all others. You see this is where Christianity is different, because of the writings in its sacred book, it feels that it's belief is better than anybody else's, in my belief we don't feel that way, I feel we are all equal and that none is any better than the other and that all should be treated with respect, that's my belief.
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Old 09-11-2009, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,889 posts, read 21,059,664 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptsum View Post
3~Shepherds, I can see where some Native Americans see the similarities in their belief and that of Christianity. Although different nations may believe a little differently than others, the basics are the same, we have a belief in a Creator, we may call him by many different names, in Christianity you call him God and just like Christians we believe that he is the Creator of everything but here's where we differ and I cannot speak for all, however I will speak for myself, where I differ from Christianity, I believe that every living thing has a spirit, not just man but every living thing, animal and plant, I believe that the Earth is our mother and that we come from that, just like your sacred book says, I also believe that we should respect all living things, whatever they may be, I also believe that no one's belief is any better than anyone else's and that we are all entitled to believe as we may with respect to all others. You see this is where Christianity is different, because of the writings in its sacred book, it feels that it's belief is better than anybody else's, in my belief we don't feel that way, I feel we are all equal and that none is any better than the other and that all should be treated with respect, that's my belief.
The bible doesn't say that the Earth is our mother and we should respect it.

The bible says that the Earth belongs to us, and that it is ours to do with as we will. As is the same with all of the animals and creatures of the Earth, they all belong to man, according to the Bible.

Most Native American tribes didn't believe in ownership of that type.
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Old 09-11-2009, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Pawnee Nation
7,525 posts, read 14,905,412 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
The bible doesn't say that the Earth is our mother and we should respect it.

The bible says that the Earth belongs to us, and that it is ours to do with as we will. As is the same with all of the animals and creatures of the Earth, they all belong to man, according to the Bible.

Most Native American tribes didn't believe in ownership of that type.
I think you hit the nail on the head......in the Jewish tradition (as well as the Muslim) mankind "owns" all else. That which cannot be exploited and consumed should be eliminated so that which CAN be exploited and consumed has more room. Europeans, fully indoctrinated into the pseudo-Christian faith, felt it was "God's will" that the NA's be contained in reserves, that the buffalo be eradicated to make room for cattle.........reminds me of the quote from Michner "If there were two dinosaurs left in the world, some sob from Texas would insist on his right to shoot the male."

True Christians, who have listed to Jesus and studied his words realize that He spoke almost exclusively about how we treat each other. The old Jewish traditions (which really have no place in the Christian community) taught war, slavery, ownership, male dominance, and self indulgence. These traditions are replicated and mandated by the Muslim faith. King David eradicated his enemies. Moses drowned the entire Egyptian Army, Mohammad taught his followers to use the sword against those that disagreed with him. Jesus taught "turn the other cheek." Jesus taught give to the least. Jesus taught succor the weak, the helpless, the infirm, the aged.

Jesus taught take what you need and leave the rest for those in need. And this message is identical to the way my grandmother taught us from her Cherokee traditions.

There are very few Christians in the self appointed/annointed Christian Community today.
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Old 09-11-2009, 12:52 PM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
10,513 posts, read 10,330,531 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
The bible doesn't say that the Earth is our mother and we should respect it.

The bible says that the Earth belongs to us, and that it is ours to do with as we will. As is the same with all of the animals and creatures of the Earth, they all belong to man, according to the Bible.

Most Native American tribes didn't believe in ownership of that type.
Do you own the air? Do you own the waters that falls from the sky? Do you own the light and heat that comes from the Sun?

And when you die,what do you own?

Last edited by ptsum; 09-11-2009 at 01:09 PM..
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