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Old 01-11-2011, 08:05 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,609 posts, read 4,112,066 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juj View Post
Hey pal, you don't think running manned winged missiles into our two largest buildings and a major military building killing thousands is not a Muslim invasion and attack of U.S. soverign soil. They attacked, we defended. PERIOD!! Quit getting your info from your local cleric and maybe you might get some truth.
Amen, brother, Amen.

 
Old 01-11-2011, 09:21 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,874 posts, read 31,750,270 times
Reputation: 12622
Quote:
Originally Posted by juj View Post
Hey pal, you don't think running manned winged missiles into our two largest buildings and a major military building killing thousands is not a Muslim invasion and attack of U.S. soverign soil. They attacked, we defended. PERIOD!! Quit getting your info from your local cleric and maybe you might get some truth.
How on earth can you say that invading Iraq or Afghanistan was defense? The terrorists that attacked on 9/11 were Saudis, but no invasion of Saudi Arabia...Why not?
 
Old 01-11-2011, 10:07 PM
 
122 posts, read 126,775 times
Reputation: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by juj View Post
Hey pal, you don't think running manned winged missiles into our two largest buildings and a major military building killing thousands is not a Muslim invasion and attack of U.S. soverign soil. They attacked, we defended. PERIOD!! Quit getting your info from your local cleric and maybe you might get some truth.

I think u haven't figured out the reality of the war yet. Fear is a tool the government used to get support from the people to invade Iraq even though Iraq wasn't any danger.

Let me show u the lie here
The reasons for the wars are peace, democracy ,and freedom as it seems in your news. These propaganda are used to convince people to get into the war because of course as humans we wanna help other people and we don't wanna be selfish.

Therefore, if the motives seem pure, then the fact that I am killing people may not be upsetting .So it makes it seem like the government is killing people for a really good reason.Check the internet and see how many died since the war started.And, why don't your news show u the innocent people who die in Iraq and they hided that from u?I will tell u why because they still want your support.
 
Old 01-12-2011, 02:44 AM
juj
 
Location: Too far from MSG
1,657 posts, read 2,333,175 times
Reputation: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muslim22 View Post
I think u haven't figured out the reality of the war yet. Fear is a tool the government used to get support from the people to invade Iraq even though Iraq wasn't any danger.

Let me show u the lie here
The reasons for the wars are peace, democracy ,and freedom as it seems in your news. These propaganda are used to convince people to get into the war because of course as humans we wanna help other people and we don't wanna be selfish.

Therefore, if the motives seem pure, then the fact that I am killing people may not be upsetting .So it makes it seem like the government is killing people for a really good reason.Check the internet and see how many died since the war started.And, why don't your news show u the innocent people who die in Iraq and they hided that from u?I will tell u why because they still want your support.
Do you really believe the USA would have attacked Afghanistan if the training and organization of the 9/11 attack did not come from there? There is no oil in Afghanistan. No sane man or country would send folks over to that part of the world unless they had a good reason which was they didn't want another attack. Yes, defense. Preemptive, but still defense. I for one think the American strategy is wrong and costly. Outside of intelligence folks, I would stay out and everytime the Taliban reassembled in numbers, just send them to the next world from the air. There's nothing to occupy.

You'll never get that part of the world to agree with each other. Just like in Iraq, these folks have been killing each other for various reasons for years. You can't bomb Afghanistan into the stone age because they are already there.

People die in war. That's how it works. Muslims started it. The United States will do everything in it's power to defend it's people and it's interests. Our civilians were killed in cold blood without provocation. We have every right to keep that from happening again. And don't look now, but we haven't been attacked from an external source since. So I guess the defense of the U.S. is working.
 
Old 01-12-2011, 05:07 AM
 
122 posts, read 126,775 times
Reputation: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by juj View Post
Do you really believe the USA would have attacked Afghanistan if the training and organization of the 9/11 attack did not come from there? There is no oil in Afghanistan. No sane man or country would send folks over to that part of the world unless they had a good reason which was they didn't want another attack. Yes, defense. Preemptive, but still defense. I for one think the American strategy is wrong and costly. Outside of intelligence folks, I would stay out and everytime the Taliban reassembled in numbers, just send them to the next world from the air. There's nothing to occupy.

You'll never get that part of the world to agree with each other. Just like in Iraq, these folks have been killing each other for various reasons for years. You can't bomb Afghanistan into the stone age because they are already there.

People die in war. That's how it works. Muslims started it. The United States will do everything in it's power to defend it's people and it's interests. Our civilians were killed in cold blood without provocation. We have every right to keep that from happening again. And don't look now, but we haven't been attacked from an external source since. So I guess the defense of the U.S. is working.
OK let's say America is in Afganistan for Bin Laden.Then why are they in Iraq even though Iraq is no danger for America?

America in Iraq for the oil.Do u know how much money they spent in Iraq?A lot and I mean a lot of money.Do u think this money for no reason just definse.This is the first lie.Secondly,about killing innocent people that what I meant when they made it seem pure to kill people because it is for defince,democrisy and freedom. People will accept everything when they are afraid and that is what the government did.

also,Why did America invade Vietnam then?Who is the first country which used (WMD)?U see history repeats itself.
Wars these days are being made in an easy way that people don't even notice it and they would think it is for a good reason.

I don't blame Americans who are looking for peace.But I blame those who still support the government's lies.

How many innocent people have been killed since Iraq war started ?
The question is that they died for what ?
We shouldn't coorect a mistake by making another mistake and that is what America is doing.
 
Old 01-12-2011, 06:30 AM
juj
 
Location: Too far from MSG
1,657 posts, read 2,333,175 times
Reputation: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muslim22 View Post
OK let's say America is in Afganistan for Bin Laden.Then why are they in Iraq even though Iraq is no danger for America?

America in Iraq for the oil.Do u know how much money they spent in Iraq?A lot and I mean a lot of money.Do u think this money for no reason just definse.This is the first lie.Secondly,about killing innocent people that what I meant when they made it seem pure to kill people because it is for defince,democrisy and freedom. People will accept everything when they are afraid and that is what the government did.

also,Why did America invade Vietnam then?Who is the first country which used (WMD)?U see history repeats itself.
Wars these days are being made in an easy way that people don't even notice it and they would think it is for a good reason.

I don't blame Americans who are looking for peace.But I blame those who still support the government's lies.

How many innocent people have been killed since Iraq war started ?
The question is that they died for what ?
We shouldn't coorect a mistake by making another mistake and that is what America is doing.
Just another government lies conspiracy guy, aren't you. The middle east is full of them. Why? Because, the folks that live there have to deal with folks like Qaddafi and Sadam Hussein and the Ayatollah Khomeini. Real charming leaders. You know, the kind you can trust. If I lived there I would probably feel the same way, that EVERY government is horrible and corrupt. And to some degree, that is true. People are people. Where power and money is involved, corruption will happen. But this governent doesn't last long, by design, if it starts to stray far. We proved it just a few months ago. We voted the bums out. We have the right to vote those bad folks out because thousands, if not millions of past Americans died to give us that right. Sacrifice - that's how you get things changed.

Sadam Hussein is to blame for the invasion of Iraq. No one else. Maybe also, his two sons. Hussein leaked out false information that he still had WMD's so that Iran would still think he was powerful. It was just a ruse to keep Iran from attacking. So was America worried that Al Qaeda would reassemble in a country who is a sworn enemy of the United States and had possible WMD's? Yes, I think so. Was it also about oil? You betcha it was. The world needs oil and is the interest of every developed country and whose supply must be protected to keep the world's economy humming. Was it about Sadam Hussein killing thousands of it's own innocent civilians. Yea, it was about that too. Was it about that Sadam had invaded Kuwait without provocation? Of course. Was it about it about vengeance on Sadam Hussein's attempt at George Bush, Sr's life. Yea, it was probably a little about that too. Blame the Sadam Hussein for the Iraq invasion. If Sadam would have treated his people with kindness and lived with neighbors and it's own countrymen in peace, do you really think we would have invaded?

Are the people of Iraq not better off now that Sadam and his cronies are removed from power? We just did the job that the Iraqi folks couldn't or wouldn't do for themselves. Also now the majority Shiites are in control. They have to be a little happy about that.

Last edited by juj; 01-12-2011 at 07:30 AM..
 
Old 01-12-2011, 09:15 AM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,609 posts, read 4,112,066 times
Reputation: 1399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muslim22 View Post
OK let's say America is in Afganistan for Bin Laden.Then why are they in Iraq even though Iraq is no danger for America?

America in Iraq for the oil.Do u know how much money they spent in Iraq?A lot and I mean a lot of money.Do u think this money for no reason just definse.This is the first lie.Secondly,about killing innocent people that what I meant when they made it seem pure to kill people because it is for defince,democrisy and freedom. People will accept everything when they are afraid and that is what the government did.

also,Why did America invade Vietnam then?Who is the first country which used (WMD)?U see history repeats itself.
Wars these days are being made in an easy way that people don't even notice it and they would think it is for a good reason.

I don't blame Americans who are looking for peace.But I blame those who still support the government's lies.

How many innocent people have been killed since Iraq war started ?
The question is that they died for what ?
We shouldn't coorect a mistake by making another mistake and that is what America is doing.
Muslim, if you really want your questions answered, please only ask one question at a time. Addressing all of your questions in a single post would be exhausting.
 
Old 01-12-2011, 09:17 AM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,609 posts, read 4,112,066 times
Reputation: 1399
Quote:
Originally Posted by juj View Post
Just another government lies conspiracy guy, aren't you. The middle east is full of them. Why? Because, the folks that live there have to deal with folks like Qaddafi and Sadam Hussein and the Ayatollah Khomeini. Real charming leaders. You know, the kind you can trust. If I lived there I would probably feel the same way, that EVERY government is horrible and corrupt. And to some degree, that is true. People are people. Where power and money is involved, corruption will happen. But this governent doesn't last long, by design, if it starts to stray far. We proved it just a few months ago. We voted the bums out. We have the right to vote those bad folks out because thousands, if not millions of past Americans died to give us that right. Sacrifice - that's how you get things changed.

Sadam Hussein is to blame for the invasion of Iraq. No one else. Maybe also, his two sons. Hussein leaked out false information that he still had WMD's so that Iran would still think he was powerful. It was just a ruse to keep Iran from attacking. So was America worried that Al Qaeda would reassemble in a country who is a sworn enemy of the United States and had possible WMD's? Yes, I think so. Was it also about oil? You betcha it was. The world needs oil and is the interest of every developed country and whose supply must be protected to keep the world's economy humming. Was it about Sadam Hussein killing thousands of it's own innocent civilians. Yea, it was about that too. Was it about that Sadam had invaded Kuwait without provocation? Of course. Was it about it about vengeance on Sadam Hussein's attempt at George Bush, Sr's life. Yea, it was probably a little about that too. Blame the Sadam Hussein for the Iraq invasion. If Sadam would have treated his people with kindness and lived with neighbors and it's own countrymen in peace, do you really think we would have invaded?

Are the people of Iraq not better off now that Sadam and his cronies are removed from power? We just did the job that the Iraqi folks couldn't or wouldn't do for themselves. Also now the majority Shiites are in control. They have to be a little happy about that.
Juj, the fact that George Bush was re-elected in 2004 shows that many Americans agree with you.

Thanks for expressing your thoughts so well.
 
Old 01-12-2011, 02:32 PM
 
122 posts, read 126,775 times
Reputation: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by juj View Post
Just another government lies conspiracy guy, aren't you. The middle east is full of them. Why? Because, the folks that live there have to deal with folks like Qaddafi and Sadam Hussein and the Ayatollah Khomeini. Real charming leaders. You know, the kind you can trust. If I lived there I would probably feel the same way, that EVERY government is horrible and corrupt. And to some degree, that is true. People are people. Where power and money is involved, corruption will happen. But this governent doesn't last long, by design, if it starts to stray far. We proved it just a few months ago. We voted the bums out. We have the right to vote those bad folks out because thousands, if not millions of past Americans died to give us that right. Sacrifice - that's how you get things changed.

Sadam Hussein is to blame for the invasion of Iraq. No one else. Maybe also, his two sons. Hussein leaked out false information that he still had WMD's so that Iran would still think he was powerful. It was just a ruse to keep Iran from attacking. So was America worried that Al Qaeda would reassemble in a country who is a sworn enemy of the United States and had possible WMD's? Yes, I think so. Was it also about oil? You betcha it was. The world needs oil and is the interest of every developed country and whose supply must be protected to keep the world's economy humming. Was it about Sadam Hussein killing thousands of it's own innocent civilians. Yea, it was about that too. Was it about that Sadam had invaded Kuwait without provocation? Of course. Was it about it about vengeance on Sadam Hussein's attempt at George Bush, Sr's life. Yea, it was probably a little about that too. Blame the Sadam Hussein for the Iraq invasion. If Sadam would have treated his people with kindness and lived with neighbors and it's own countrymen in peace, do you really think we would have invaded?

Are the people of Iraq not better off now that Sadam and his cronies are removed from power? We just did the job that the Iraqi folks couldn't or wouldn't do for themselves. Also now the majority Shiites are in control. They have to be a little happy about that.
First PLEASE don't generlize all Muslim leaders because two of them.Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 and George Bush said that himself.

Iraqis don't want America and the evidence for that are freedom fighters there and they r still struggling there.These people just fight for their freedom .Moreover,Iraqis were better with Sadam because Iraq was one country.As a matter of fact America killed more than what Sadam killed.Another evidence is what was throwing at George Bush.

____________
Cbc News wrote an article about the real number and how many Iraqis died and how the media didn't focus on that.As it is menetioned in the news Website,only one media organaization and human rights cared of how many Iraqis died.As it says in the article,more than 100,000 Iraqis died since the war started and most of them were children and women.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EeXcHs11ZY&feature=related
 
Old 01-12-2011, 04:20 PM
 
40,041 posts, read 26,720,362 times
Reputation: 6048
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muslim22 View Post
Iraqis don't want America and the evidence for that are freedom fighters there and they r still struggling there.These people just fight for their freedom. Moreover,Iraqis were better with Sadam because Iraq was one country.As a matter of fact America killed more than what Sadam killed.Another evidence is what was throwing at George Bush.
Stop lying . . . Iraq has its own government voted in, its own Constitution created by them, the freedom fighters are external terrorists and ousted Iraqis from Saddam's reign . . . not internal freedom fighters, and the bulk of those killed are by the terrorists and ousted Iraqis.
Quote:
____________
Cbc News wrote an article about the real number and how many Iraqis died and how the media didn't focus on that.As it is menetioned in the news Website,only one media organaization and human rights cared of how many Iraqis died.As it says in the article,more than 100,000 Iraqis died since the war started and most of them were children and women.
And almost none of the women and children and a tiny number of the men were killed by Americans. Virtually ALL of them were killed by the terrorist insurgents and ex-Saddam loyalists.
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