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Old 11-03-2009, 11:30 AM
 
6,039 posts, read 9,454,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huh? View Post
. We don't live in ancient Israel, and we are not under that covenant.
We don't live in biblical times, period, and thus it is foolishly unreasonable to live one's life by those standards.
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Old 11-03-2009, 11:41 AM
 
57 posts, read 121,954 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercury Cougar View Post
We don't live in biblical times, period, and thus it is foolishly unreasonable to live one's life by those standards.
So it's foolish to suggest that we follow Biblical commands to love one another and not murder and steal?
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Old 11-03-2009, 11:44 AM
 
Location: egypt
1,215 posts, read 2,038,348 times
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Originally Posted by huh? View Post
Does shariah law not command someone that converts from islam to be killed? I know for a fact that you have stated before that someone converting out of islam is to be given a chance to repent...and if they don't they are to be killed.

As for finding comparable Bible verses, knock yourself out. Give me a verse that would compare. Don't look up an OT verse that was given to Israel regarding a war or them takin possession of the promised land. We don't live in ancient Israel, and we are not under that covenant.
it dosn't mattar with me if you under covenant or not , it was the laws if your God sometimes ago

anyway , my main point is that there is nothing in quran justify honour killing , yet the Op says that it's the teaching of quran
i just show you the fallacy of these condemnation

again , if this is the teaching of the quran , then give me these verses . if you can't find it , so it will be better to keep silent or to be aware and care about what you write ( i refer to the OP )
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Old 11-03-2009, 11:47 AM
 
6,039 posts, read 9,454,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huh? View Post
So it's foolish to suggest that we follow Biblical commands to love one another and not murder and steal?
You yourself pretty much said to ignore the OT.

But of course, you again miss the point, and so I'm not going to explain it to you.
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Old 11-03-2009, 11:57 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercury Cougar View Post
You yourself pretty much said to ignore the OT.

But of course, you again miss the point, and so I'm not going to explain it to you.
I never said to ignore the OT....I merely said that anything commanded to the Israelites in that time regarding war does not apply to modern-day Christians. We are not under the covenant and have not been given a promised land.
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Old 11-03-2009, 12:58 PM
 
Location: New York City
5,556 posts, read 6,904,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huh? View Post
As for finding comparable Bible verses, knock yourself out. Give me a verse that would compare. Don't look up an OT verse that was given to Israel regarding a war or them takin possession of the promised land. We don't live in ancient Israel, and we are not under that covenant.
Here's a few from Deuteronomy 13:6-11:

Quote:
“If your brother, the son of your mother, your son or your daughter, the wife of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, secretly entices you, saying, ‘Let us go and serve other gods,’ which you have not known, neither you nor your fathers, of the gods of the people which are all around you, near to you or far off from you, from one end of the earth to the other end of the earth, you shall not consent to him or listen to him, nor shall your eye pity him, nor shall you spare him or conceal him; but you shall surely kill him; your hand shall be first against him to put him to death, and afterward the hand of all the people. And you shall stone him with stones until he dies, because he sought to entice you away from the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage. So all Israel shall hear and fear, and not again do such wickedness as this among you.
I am wiling to bet there are millions upon millions of Christians who are completely unaware these verses are in their bibles. Yes, it is in the OT, but this from Moses....er....a god who "never changes" and I'm not sure I've ever read where he changed his mind on these commands. What I am aware of are that humans made laws to curb or stop these types of tribal customs, but have not read where god ever stepped in and recanted such commands.
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Old 11-03-2009, 01:04 PM
 
57 posts, read 121,954 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InsaneInDaMembrane View Post
Here's a few from Deuteronomy 13:6-11:



I am wiling to bet there are millions upon millions of Christians who are completely unaware these verses are in their bibles. Yes, it is in the OT, but this from Moses....er....a god who "never changes" and I'm not sure I've ever read where he changed his mind on these commands. What I am aware of are that humans made laws to curb or stop these types of tribal customs, but have not read where god ever stepped in and recanted such commands.

I don't live in ancient Israel. This was given to the Hebrews at that time, under those conditions, for a specific reason. The commands to kill infidels in the koran are not the same.
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Old 11-03-2009, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Southern Willamette Valley, Oregon
6,837 posts, read 7,893,740 times
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Originally Posted by Mercury Cougar View Post
Bosnian Genocide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sean Paddock: Dead at age 4

Andrea Yates - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Attempted exorcism ends in man’s death - Life- msnbc.com

Woman Submit! Christians & Domestic Violence

Statistics About Domestic Abuse - Christian Survivors Forums

Nigerian Children Deemed Witches Tortured - CBS News

Boy Dies During Exorcism, Minister Charged With Abuse | Progressive U (http://www.progressiveu.org/145045-boy-dies-during-exorcism-minister-charged-with-abuse - broken link)


Exorcism mania breeds child abuse - Democratic Underground

Domestic Abuse in Christian Homes -Televangelist Juanita Bynum Becomes a Victim of Domestic Abuse - Associated Content - associatedcontent.com

I could go on and on, but I assume that since you managed to get to these forums that you are capable of Googling the facts for yourself -- if you dare.
Cougar, thank you for the links. That's what these forums are for. I will look them over.
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Old 11-03-2009, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Southern Willamette Valley, Oregon
6,837 posts, read 7,893,740 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elwill View Post
it dosn't mattar with me if you under covenant or not , it was the laws if your God sometimes ago

anyway , my main point is that there is nothing in quran justify honour killing , yet the Op says that it's the teaching of quran
i just show you the fallacy of these condemnation

again , if this is the teaching of the quran , then give me these verses . if you can't find it , so it will be better to keep silent or to be aware and care about what you write ( i refer to the OP )
Where in my OP did I state that these actions were the result of anything in the Koran? I simply stated that most muslims I have spoken with inform me that their holy book teaches love and good will. Many a dedicated worshipper of Islam believe that the terrorists, and people who do acts such as this father did, have twisted the teachings of Islam to fit their agenda. At least, I would hope that is all it is.

As Mercury Cougar pointed out, extremists exist in every religion. Islam, though, seems to have a much higher level of frequency in regards to these acts. I have never read the Koran. What I know is what I witness in our world on a daily basis. You are telling me to remain silent, yet my goal is just to get some input regarding these issues.
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Old 11-03-2009, 02:11 PM
 
Location: New York City
5,556 posts, read 6,904,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huh? View Post
I don't live in ancient Israel. This was given to the Hebrews at that time, under those conditions, for a specific reason. The commands to kill infidels in the koran are not the same.
How so? The only difference is, overall people in Judaism and Christianity have few people who take such nonsense seriously today. In Islam, they have a sizable group who take a VERY serious approach to whatever interpretations they fart out of the Koran. If anything, Christians are NOT obeying their bibles on matter such as this. Not that I am trying to give them any bright ideas.
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