Durbin Park Town Center? (Jacksonville: 2014, apartments, condos)

[thelma123]

I know they are comparing the up and coming Durbin Park shopping center to St John's town center but from the plans and videos I have seen so far, DP doesn't look nearly as walkable as SJTC. To me it looks like SJTC is set up as a nice long street you can stroll down from shop to shop. From the DP video have seen it looks like every other shopping center with the huge parking lots and scattered stores around it. Am I missing something? Anyone else have any new info on it? Any new shops or restaurants sign on?

[Thundarr457]

There is no comparison between the 2 and never will be. DP phase 1 is anchored by Walmart and Home Depot. Bass Pro will be in phase 2. How can you compare that with Nordstroms, Dillards, LV, Tiffany and every other nice store you can think of. We love SJTC and shop there often. DP will be a plus for retail starved southern St Johns County but will never be anything like SJTC. There is only room for 1 super regional center and SJTC is it.

[projectmaximus]

Originally Posted by thelma123

I know they are comparing the up and coming Durbin Park shopping center to St John's town center but from the plans and videos I have seen so far, DP doesn't look nearly as walkable as SJTC. To me it looks like SJTC is set up as a nice long street you can stroll down from shop to shop. From the DP video have seen it looks like every other shopping center with the huge parking lots and scattered stores around it. Am I missing something? Anyone else have any new info on it? Any new shops or restaurants sign on?

That is only true for a portion of the SJTC. As a whole it is not terribly walkable...the original design was far more traditionally walkable than its current state. It's not too bad though, but just setting expectations. The area is exploding, currently about a dozen new developments are under construction in the immediate vicinity, but only a few of them are being built in a walkable way as well.

Originally Posted by Thundarr457

There is no comparison between the 2 and never will be. DP phase 1 is anchored by Walmart and Home Depot. Bass Pro will be in phase 2. How can you compare that with Nordstroms, Dillards, LV, Tiffany and every other nice store you can think of. We love SJTC and shop there often. DP will be a plus for retail starved southern St Johns County but will never be anything like SJTC. There is only room for 1 super regional center and SJTC is it.

Keep in mind that nearly all shopping malls are cyclical so it's dangerous to say never. Regency Mall was THE MALL back in the day, when Arlington was THE SUBURB. Now it's the polar opposite. Avenues rose to prominence later, and although it has done a decent job of surviving it is a far cry from its hey day as the SJTC has crushed it since 2007. But there's nothing preventing those stores from relocating, particularly the small high-end ones that are very quick to jump ship in most markets.

Alright, just playing devils advocate. I personally do not see the SJTC area dipping anytime soon, although traffic will be even more hellacious in the next few months.

[Florida2014]

My only hope for Durbin Park is to make it DRIVEABLE! SJTC is an absolute nightmare to get from point A to point B and even the roads surrounding it seem to be filled with idiots driving way too fast trying to beat the lights. Honestly, that keeps me from even thinking of going there during the evenings many nights. Make Durbin Park a place where you can get around easily and traffic flows vs. SJTC which is a myriad of one-way streets, stop lights, speed bumps and too many cars with no even parking spaces. Whoever designed the SJTC should be slapped repeatedly.

[BartramBuck]

Originally Posted by Thundarr457

There is no comparison between the 2 and never will be. DP phase 1 is anchored by Walmart and Home Depot. Bass Pro will be in phase 2. How can you compare that with Nordstroms, Dillards, LV, Tiffany and every other nice store you can think of. We love SJTC and shop there often. DP will be a plus for retail starved southern St Johns County but will never be anything like SJTC. There is only room for 1 super regional center and SJTC is it.

The developers of DP disagree with you

Also Target and old navy were among the original SJTC retailers. Not exactly highend. They built the "powercenter" first and then the upscale portion

[Thundarr457]

Originally Posted by projectmaximus

Keep in mind that nearly all shopping malls are cyclical so it's dangerous to say never. Regency Mall was THE MALL back in the day, when Arlington was THE SUBURB. Now it's the polar opposite. Avenues rose to prominence later, and although it has done a decent job of surviving it is a far cry from its hey day as the SJTC has crushed it since 2007. But there's nothing preventing those stores from relocating, particularly the small high-end ones that are very quick to jump ship in most markets.

Alright, just playing devils advocate. I personally do not see the SJTC area dipping anytime soon, although traffic will be even more hellacious in the next few months.

I think the central location with easy access to JTB and I-295 will keep it the #1 mall for decades. I can get there in 10 minutes vs 30+ to Regency. There is no place left to put another mega mall so Durbin Park will have to suffice for many years. I don't see it as much more than a regional convenience than a destination mall. The Avenues is great to walk around on a hot summer day. Not sure what they will do if Sears goes. The owner Simon Properties, is a first rate developer, so I think it will stick around and be viable for many years.

[Florida2014]

Originally Posted by BartramBuck

The developers of DP disagree with you

Also Target and old navy were among the original SJTC retailers. Not exactly highend. They built the "powercenter" first and then the upscale portion

I realize the developers are trying to garner some "buzz" about this development but I have to question them releasing Wal-Mart so early in the process as being an anchor store. Maybe it was so that all of the initial opposition to it would have years to wear off? Hard to say but if I'm opening up a huge development like this and want to compete with SJTC, I don't think name dropping Wal-Mart and Bass Pro Shops is going to generate the buzz needed to even be on the same planet as them. It's an entirely different shopping base. Then again, maybe they aren't trying to compete. There is a huge element in/around Jax that is very let's say, ahem, "rural" and they very well might be trying to tap into that base vs. anything higher end.

But to your point, the women in my neighborhood nearly all favor Target vs. Wal-Mart. I don't see a huge difference but apparently there is. Wal-Mart carries a very negative stigma, Target does not.

[Thundarr457]

Originally Posted by Florida2014

I realize the developers are trying to garner some "buzz" about this development but I have to question them releasing Wal-Mart so early in the process as being an anchor store. Maybe it was so that all of the initial opposition to it would have years to wear off? Hard to say but if I'm opening up a huge development like this and want to compete with SJTC, I don't think name dropping Wal-Mart and Bass Pro Shops is going to generate the buzz needed to even be on the same planet as them. It's an entirely different shopping base. Then again, maybe they aren't trying to compete. There is a huge element in/around Jax that is very let's say, ahem, "rural" and they very well might be trying to tap into that base vs. anything higher end.

But to your point, the women in my neighborhood nearly all favor Target vs. Wal-Mart. I don't see a huge difference but apparently there is. Wal-Mart carries a very negative stigma, Target does not.

Maybe Walmart offered more to be the anchor. The presence of Walmart might deter other businesses from opening as well. IMHO it was a mistake to have a Walmart even if there was short term gain. A shopping center with Home Depot, Walmart and Bass Pro is not going to send people flocking there.

[Florida2014]

Originally Posted by Thundarr457

A shopping center with Home Depot, Walmart and Bass Pro is not going to send people flocking there.

I disagree. Have you been inside of any of these stores lately? They are *always* packed. While they may not be a desirable place to shop for some people (I have no interest in BPS or WM personally) there is a reason those places are so successful and profitable.....volume! You can't argue the numbers. And have you seen the thousands of homes/townhomes/condos/apartments popping up just in the Bartram area alone lately? Those aren't exactly high-end homes. These stores did their homework, they will do just fine there.

[Thundarr457]

Originally Posted by Florida2014

I disagree. Have you been inside of any of these stores lately? They are *always* packed. While they may not be a desirable place to shop for some people (I have no interest in BPS or WM personally) there is a reason those places are so successful and profitable.....volume! You can't argue the numbers. And have you seen the thousands of homes/townhomes/condos/apartments popping up just in the Bartram area alone lately? Those aren't exactly high-end homes. These stores did their homework, they will do just fine there.

I meant they are nothing special. They are successful and I shop at both. Its not like oh wow Walmart is opening nearby, I can't wait or OMG Home Depot is opening up their 7th Jacksonville area location. I got more excited about IKEA opening up because they are VERY different from whats available locally. DP will be great for the people living nearby but as anything to compete with SJTC no way.