U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Work and Employment > Job Search
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-06-2012, 05:22 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,677 posts, read 17,119,897 times
Reputation: 7282

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by 313Weather View Post
Employers, when searching for an employee to fill a position, STOP saying a particular skill set is a "HUGE plus" or "Preferred." Stating something's a plus or preferred implies that it's not necessary and you can teach it to them, but very nice to have.

Yet, you have the nerve to get upset when you can't find someone with that particular skill set amongst applicants, or folks apply without that particular skill set because YOU don't know how to fill positions.

If, without question or exception, you want someone with a particular skill set, state clearly in the ad that it's REQUIRED, not a "HUGE plus" or "Preferred.". You'll save yourself time/money and you'll save the applicant time/money.
That is ridiculous to object to. Most often, when we post such criteria, we get it, and all others are eliminated. At most 10% of the time during this admin, we do not get it, and usually we deal with the best of the rest. Now before 2009, our hit percentage on the preferred was much lower.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-06-2012, 05:53 PM
 
Location: USA
7,478 posts, read 5,814,244 times
Reputation: 12324
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
That is ridiculous to object to. Most often, when we post such criteria, we get it, and all others are eliminated. At most 10% of the time during this admin, we do not get it, and usually we deal with the best of the rest. Now before 2009, our hit percentage on the preferred was much lower.
Actually, that seems to confirm what the OP is saying.

If I'm reading what you wrote correctly, you usually get people with all the criteria you ask for, with a miss rate about 10% these days and higher in previous years. As you said, "all others are eliminated," which seems to say that your "preferred" requirements may as well be "required."

I think all the OP is getting at is that companies should be honest - if they aren't going to hire somebody without a given skillset, don't list that skillset as "preferred" just because it brings in the resumes or provides some nonsensical illusion of "lots of available jobs."
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2012, 06:34 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,677 posts, read 17,119,897 times
Reputation: 7282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rambler123 View Post
Actually, that seems to confirm what the OP is saying.

If I'm reading what you wrote correctly, you usually get people with all the criteria you ask for, with a miss rate about 10% these days and higher in previous years. As you said, "all others are eliminated," which seems to say that your "preferred" requirements may as well be "required."

I think all the OP is getting at is that companies should be honest - if they aren't going to hire somebody without a given skillset, don't list that skillset as "preferred" just because it brings in the resumes or provides some nonsensical illusion of "lots of available jobs."
It is mostly true during this administration, less so in prior years, but even today, one can be applying to one of the 10% where no one fits the bill. What is tiresome are the idiots who apply who perhaps have 2 of 7 preferred skillsets. No chance in hel*, and they waste our time.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2012, 06:43 PM
 
Location: USA
7,478 posts, read 5,814,244 times
Reputation: 12324
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
It is mostly true during this administration, less so in prior years, but even today, one can be applying to one of the 10% where no one fits the bill. What is tiresome are the idiots who apply who perhaps have 2 of 7 preferred skillsets. No chance in hel*, and they waste our time.
If there's no chance of them being hired because they have so few of the "preferred" skillsets, why not make the "preferred" skills required? That would save everyone time and seems to be more accurate since most folks are probably saying, "Hey, I have a few of those preferred skills - I have an edge!" vs. "Oh, I don't have enough of them, so I shouldn't bother applying." Preferred still implies "would be nice, but is not required."

Or, add something like "Most be familiar with most of the following" ahead of the preferred skills, so it's clear that if they only have 2 of 7, they shouldn't bother, but if they have 6 of 7, they should apply - assuming that 6 of 7 would be okay. If they need 7 out of 7, than those skills are not preferred, but are actually required, IMHO.

I understand the notion of preferred vs. required, but if a company seriously won't consider somebody who's missing half the preferred skills, they should admit this upfront - it saves everyone time.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2012, 06:54 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,677 posts, read 17,119,897 times
Reputation: 7282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rambler123 View Post
If there's no chance of them being hired because they have so few of the "preferred" skillsets, why not make the "preferred" skills required?
I thought you were an engineer. 1 in 10 is 10%, when did 10% and 0% become the same?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2012, 06:56 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,677 posts, read 17,119,897 times
Reputation: 7282
[quote=Rambler123;25514861since most folks are probably saying, "Hey, I have a few of those preferred skills - I have an edge!" vs. "Oh, I don't have enough of them, so I shouldn't bother applying." Preferred still implies "would be nice, but is not required."

Or, add something like "Most be familiar with most of the following" ahead of the preferred skills, so it's clear that if they only have 2 of 7, they shouldn't bother, but if they have 6 of 7, they should apply - assuming that 6 of 7 would be okay. If they need 7 out of 7, than those skills are not preferred, but are actually required, IMHO.[/quote]

Anyone applying anywhere missing more than 1 (unless list exceeds 10) is too stupid to take seriously. Not in 2012. In 2006, you might get a job where you lacked 2 or 3. Past 1 in 10 now, foget about it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2012, 07:04 PM
 
Location: USA
7,478 posts, read 5,814,244 times
Reputation: 12324
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
I thought you were an engineer. 1 in 10 is 10%, when did 10% and 0% become the same?
And the justification for your meaningless personal attack was what again? Grow up!

If you bothered to read my post, what I was addressing was that fact that you were ranting about how "stupid people" respond to ads where they only have about 2 out of 7 of the Preferred skills. You also begrudge them for the amount of your time they waste - well, if you posted what you wanted in the first place, neither your time nor theirs would be wasted.

If you're going to present a list of skills as preferred - as if saying, "Hey, you get extra consideration if you have these skills" - don't whine when people respond without having nearly all of them. That is EXACTLY the type of thing the OP was talking about!

If the candidate needs to have most of the preferred skills to be considered, say so! It's not that hard to actually post what you what in a job ad vs. whining about candidates who can't read your mind. Geez... Nothing like providing a textbook case of the problem in question and being too blind to see it... oh, because other people are "stupid" I guess! Right...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2012, 07:09 PM
 
Location: NJ
18,677 posts, read 17,119,897 times
Reputation: 7282
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rambler123 View Post
was that fact that you were ranting about how "stupid people" respond to ads where they only have about 2 out of 7 of the Preferred skills.

Well, "Preferred" doesn't mean "Required," now does it?
...
2 in 7 never cuts it. I could understand them trying with 4 or 5, but not 29%. The odds are someone will at least have 5, just 71%. So why would one with 2 think they stood a chance? Tell a customer 2 in 7 others are happy with your products.see how it sells.. Get 5 good reviews of 7, and while not wonderful, you are not an abomination.

And again 0% is not 1 in 10. That is 10%. It it were zero, I agree.do not apply. if we use required, and you do not have it, your shot is 0. If we say preferred, you might get considered.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2012, 07:13 PM
 
Location: USA
7,478 posts, read 5,814,244 times
Reputation: 12324
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtn View Post
2 in 7 never cuts it. I could understand them trying with 4 or 5, but not 29%.

And again 0% is not 1 in 10. That is 10%.
Yes... we all agree that 1 in 10 is 10%... but without any way of knowing which 10% of the jobs will have nobody coming close to meeting the "preferred" requirements, it seems rather silly to accuse the applicants of being "stupid" for applying. Similarly, candidates have no way of knowing the skill level of other applicants, so blasting them for applying when they only have some of the supposedly "preferred" skills is simply not logical. After all, they are out of work - if they feel they have a chance at the job, they will apply to it, and "preferred" does not mean "required."

If you don't like "stupid people" responding to your ad because it wastes your precious time, try posting what you want in the ad, you know something like "Must have 5 of the following skills to be considered" and then list your preferred skills. It is much easier to post what you want in a job ad vs. slapping something together and then grumbling about "stupid people" who can't read your mind.

Last edited by Rambler123; 08-06-2012 at 07:27 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-06-2012, 07:20 PM
 
Location: California
4,402 posts, read 11,648,587 times
Reputation: 3129
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe from dayton View Post
We use the terms required and preferred because that is what we mean. Some things are "required" while other things are "preferred." They are not synonymous terms.
Agreed. Sometimes there are things that we prefer and things that we require. Often it is an odd combination of the 2. For example, a person with all of the required and most of the preferred is better than someone with none of either. However, someone with all of the preferred but a little light on the required may still get an interview.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Work and Employment > Job Search
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top