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When you go for interviews are you telling them you were fired? You have to be truthful about this because they will find out when they check employment history. You can however, address it in a way that makes it sound like your not really sure why you were terminated, make it sound like the employer was just cleaning house, but then you found out you were replaced by a managers nephew. Lie, lie, lie! But make sure it can't be checked out and do it confidently. It works for me, all the time!
I never tell them that I was fired. I just tell them it was for personal reasons because while I was working there, my mom and father passed away within a year of each other. This did affect my work so...that's what I usually say.
But I turn it into a positive and say that in turn I became a much stronger person.
one person's personal experience does not negate larger scale statistics. if every jobseeker out there had fantastic skills, great judgment, a stellar education, the best interview skills ever, willingness to work ANY job with ANY hours, willingness (and means) to relocate - 2/3 of them would still not have jobs. because those jobs don't exist.
we agree that SOME people have themselves to blame for not having work. but your initial post implied that everyone who loses their job and/or can't find work is in that boat. that's ridiculous.
one person's personal experience does not negate larger scale statistics. if every jobseeker out there had fantastic skills, great judgment, a stellar education, the best interview skills ever, willingness to work ANY job with ANY hours, willingness (and means) to relocate - 2/3 of them would still not have jobs. because those jobs don't exist.
we agree that SOME people have themselves to blame for not having work. but your initial post implied that everyone who loses their job and/or can't find work is in that boat. that's ridiculous.
Thanks for the twisting.
I didn't "imply", I meant to say that most people who lose their jobs or can't find job have some issues in them. Unless the company went bankrupt, why you were let go but not your coworkers? Like I said, it's hard to look into ourselves and find faults; it's whole lot easier to blame someone else.
Sounds harsh but it is what it is. Unless we are willing to change ourselves, we aren't going to progress. Before we can change ourselves, we need to understand what to change.
There are reasons why people are let go, and there are reasons why people can't find job. I say this because I have been on the hiring side long enough to see how the hiring and firing decisions are made.
For each one of us, if we aren't willing to look into ourselves and find out what we can change, who else can we blame for our failures?
here is your original post. people can decide for themselves if i am "twisting" anything.
one person's personal experience does not negate larger scale statistics. if every jobseeker out there had fantastic skills, great judgment, a stellar education, the best interview skills ever, willingness to work ANY job with ANY hours, willingness (and means) to relocate - 2/3 of them would still not have jobs. because those jobs don't exist.
we agree that SOME people have themselves to blame for not having work. but your initial post implied that everyone who loses their job and/or can't find work is in that boat. that's ridiculous.
When you don't have fantastic skills, great judgment, a stellar education, the best interview skills ever, willingness to work ANY job with ANY hours, willingness (and means) to relocate, whose fault is that?
Frankly speaking, a lot of companies are willing to tolerate certain traits. I got burned too many times to tolerate.
i have said in almost every post in this exchange that there are definitely people out there who have no one to blame but themselves for not being able to find a job. the only thing we disagree on here is whether it is most job seekers (or, as your first post implied, all). i also said that even if it's not your fault that you're having employment trouble, all you have control over is yourself.
but it is just a matter of math that even if every candidate was perfect, there would not be enough jobs for them. there are a LOT of good, qualified, motivated, hard-working people out there who are struggling and telling them that it's just because they are subpar candidates is not constructive or true.
also, i have to wonder if you need to look within yourself to ask why you're attracting such a parade of crappy applicants in a job market where employers have all the bargaining power. are you offering terrible compensation? are your job postings unclear? are you screening out good candidates and bringing in bad ones? does your company have a bad reputation? it goes both ways, you know.
did that seem unfair to you? do you feel defensive now? well now you have had a tiny taste of what it's like to experience the kind of derision that is heaped daily on the unemployed.
That's part of the issue. Most people think it only goes one way (favoring the employer). Just like people who preach about free market economics, what they don't tell you is that they only want things to benefit them and nobody else. How so? Just look at all the employers who are claiming they can't find people to work. They want people already trained and ready to go instead of doing the leg work themselves (must have 5 years of experience in _____). They believe they are entitled to skilled workers and they want the government (or taxpayers) to foot the bill. Just like an employer can be picky about who to hire when the cards are in their favor, a WORKER has a choice of what employer to work for. If you want skilled people for the lowest wage you can offer, remember the invisible hand.
Too many employers are all for free markets when it benefits them (being able to pay lower wages during a Depression, for example) but turn into socialists the moment it doesn't benefit them (such as employees being free to quit and go work for a more attractive company at any time).
Sorry, but if you're a true free marketeer, you have to resign yourself to the negative aspects of free markets as well as the positives. Sometimes the free market tilts in favor of employers; at other times it tilts in favor of employees. Employers who find they cannot find applicants to fill certain roles have several choices. They can raise the starting salary and/or provide relocation expenses. They can invest in job-training programs; they can even set up little "boot camps" the way law enforcement and the military do (i.e., police academies and the CIA farm). They can fill the position internally by promoting someone (even if it means training them) and then seek a candidate for the lower, more easily filled position.
What they cannot do is demand that the government (or other outside entities pay to train their employees). Then go on ABC and say the problem with america is that everybody is lazy and doesn't want to work. It is not the responsibility of the government (or anyone else) to train workers for private businesses.
You take that role, and you may (keyword:MAY) be rewarded. Keep an entitlement attitude and the invisible hand of the market will put you in the situation you are in.......no workers.
i have said in almost every post in this exchange that there are definitely people out there who have no one to blame but themselves for not being able to find a job. the only thing we disagree on here is whether it is most job seekers (or, as your first post implied, all). i also said that even if it's not your fault that you're having employment trouble, all you have control over is yourself.
but it is just a matter of math that even if every candidate was perfect, there would not be enough jobs for them. there are a LOT of good, qualified, motivated, hard-working people out there who are struggling and telling them that it's just because they are subpar candidates is not constructive or true.
also, i have to wonder if you need to look within yourself to ask why you're attracting such a parade of crappy applicants. are you offering terrible compensation? are your job postings unclear? it goes both ways, you know.
When I didn't get the dream job I wanted, I knew it was me who didn't perform well.
I guess I come from the notion of tough love. I want to help you but you need to want to be helped. If you aren't willing to look into yourself, then what can we do?
By the way, I have been doing a lot of soul searching as why I am not getting good candidates - we use both recruiters and posting.
well it's a nice pipe dream to think that employment is handed out solely based on merit. that's called the just world fallacy - goodness is rewarded, badness is punished, and bad things never happen to people who are good. oh and hiring managers never make the wrong decision.
but again, you can't argue with the math so i guess that's why you're ignoring it. 30 perfect, perfectly equal candidates + 10 available jobs = 20 unemployed people. that doesn't make those 20 unemployed people any less perfect. obviously no one's actually a perfect candidate but i am just using an extreme example to try and make this clear to you.
i understand where you are coming from. i am employed but job searching long distance, and i've been getting tons of interviews and no jobs. even though i've gotten some great feedback on my interviews and been told i was a close second more than once, i am still working on my interview skills because that is where i am failing. but i also realize that there are factors (the scarcity of work in general, and the prejudice against non-local candidates, my lack of a degree which i plan to correct but can't right now) working against me that i can't control. so while i'm working to improve myself, i'm not beating myself up over my failure to get a job either.
saying "look within yourself to see what you can improve, you only have control over yourself in this equation" is fine. but denying that there are other factors at play and telling people that the only reason they're not finding work is because they're lazy and stupid and unskilled and unprofessional is just ignoring reality.
well it's a nice pipe dream to think that employment is handed out solely based on merit. that's called the just world fallacy - goodness is rewarded, badness is punished, and bad things never happen to people who are good. oh and hiring managers never make the wrong decision.
but again, you can't argue with the math so i guess that's why you're ignoring it. 30 perfect, perfectly equal candidates + 10 available jobs = 20 unemployed people. that doesn't make those 20 unemployed people any less perfect. obviously no one's actually a perfect candidate but i am just using an extreme example to try and make this clear to you.
i understand where you are coming from. i am employed but job searching long distance, and i've been getting tons of interviews and no jobs. even though i've gotten some great feedback on my interviews and been told i was a close second more than once, i am still working on my interview skills because that is where i am failing. but i also realize that there are factors (the scarcity of work in general, and the prejudice against non-local candidates, my lack of a degree which i plan to correct but can't right now) working against me that i can't control. so while i'm working to improve myself, i'm not beating myself up over my failure to get a job either.
saying "look within yourself to see what you can improve, you only have control over yourself in this equation" is fine. but denying that there are other factors at play and telling people that the only reason they're not finding work is because they're lazy and stupid and unskilled and unprofessional is just ignoring reality.
You are right. A lot of other factors come into play, race, gender, looks, etc. I personally have interviewed hundreds of people and looked through thousands of resumes. I have never seen a candidate with merits not being hired on!
Your math is based on the assumption that there are 30 perfect candidates. In reality, there aren't. For every position I filled and helped to fill, there are only maybe 1 or 2 "perfect" candidates. The rest of candidates are just ... not a good fit, put it politely. I have never had the pleasure to decide even among 3 candidates. :-(
For your personal note, you should be able to get one offer out of 3-4 interviews. If not, I would guess there is something that you need to work on.
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