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Old 12-22-2013, 04:44 AM
 
Location: Maine
193 posts, read 225,830 times
Reputation: 479

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThisIsMe123 View Post
Argh. It shouldn't even be legal for a past employer to complain to your potential employer about performance issues or anything else that isn't proven or at least documented.
That is exactly what is bothering me. Being terminated for performance is very broad. That could mean I was a total screw up who just could never get the job done in the first place. Or, it could mean that my performance was based on whether or not I could deal with this one person that kept sticking it to me. Or, it could have just been an excuse to release a person so as to free up a position on paper as a cost savings method. Without having been given specifics from either management of HR, the exact performance issue, assuming one existed, is rather difficult to ascertain. One thing I do know is that had I been a total screw up, I seriously doubt I would have been there nearly seven years.
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Old 12-22-2013, 05:36 AM
 
1,480 posts, read 2,305,444 times
Reputation: 1611
Most companies outsource the employment verification process. They will ask if you were eligible for rehire. If the answer is no, then you won't be hired in most cases unless their is a shortage of applicants.

I hired an attorney who wrote the company who fired me and threatened legal action if they said I was not eligible for rehire. Now they say that company policy does not allow us to give an answer to that question for any applicant. A completely neutral employment verification. Though a number of places who want to hire me INSIST they talk to my last supervisor, and when that does not happen I am eliminated from consideration.
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Old 12-22-2013, 05:44 AM
 
Location: Somewhere Out West
2,260 posts, read 2,141,319 times
Reputation: 1902
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtrader View Post
The prospective employer is not allowed by law, to bad mouth you in any way as to why you were terminated.
This is false. First off I think you meant a former employer. That being said a former employer can state the reasons you were terminated, as long as they were factual. If you sucked at your job, they can state that, but they better be able to back it up.

It amazes me how little people know about employment law and how people continually spout "it is illegal to say X".
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Old 12-22-2013, 07:52 AM
 
Location: SC
389 posts, read 568,692 times
Reputation: 611
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtnbiker65 View Post
That is exactly what is bothering me. Being terminated for performance is very broad. That could mean I was a total screw up who just could never get the job done in the first place. Or, it could mean that my performance was based on whether or not I could deal with this one person that kept sticking it to me. Or, it could have just been an excuse to release a person so as to free up a position on paper as a cost savings method. Without having been given specifics from either management of HR, the exact performance issue, assuming one existed, is rather difficult to ascertain. One thing I do know is that had I been a total screw up, I seriously doubt I would have been there nearly seven years.
Exactly, this is so poignant. And honestly, even in the pro-employer/anti-employee culture we have going on in this country, I believe due to the bolded part above and the fact nothing negative about you had been documented, that if your past company makes problems for you getting hired elsewhere, you have a decent basis for a lawsuit. Hope it doesn't go that far...hopefully they're smarter than that. I'd have a friend or family member call them up ASAP and pretend to be a potential employer looking for a recommendation. You need to know exactly what they're going to say about you...

Good luck!
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Maine
193 posts, read 225,830 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThisIsMe123 View Post
Exactly, this is so poignant. And honestly, even in the pro-employer/anti-employee culture we have going on in this country, I believe due to the bolded part above and the fact nothing negative about you had been documented, that if your past company makes problems for you getting hired elsewhere, you have a decent basis for a lawsuit. Hope it doesn't go that far...hopefully they're smarter than that. I'd have a friend or family member call them up ASAP and pretend to be a potential employer looking for a recommendation. You need to know exactly what they're going to say about you...

Good luck!
Thank you. You're right. I have looked at going the wrongful termination route. One of my neighbors is a lawyer who gave me some freebie advice. Her thoughts were rather crude in that she gave my previous employer the one finger salute and told me to take their severance package and run. In the end, I'd be using up about $20K in savings and about a year and a half of my life to fight for my job back.

A friend also paid for me to see a labor lawyer that his company uses all the time. She said I had a very strong case for a wrongful termination suit. Her point was that if I did win, would I really want my job back? Would I really want to work for an organization that didn't have the courage to tell me what the real problem was, assuming there really was one?

I also spoke to a friend of mine who is a retired real estate lawyer. Again, he reiterated what the previous two lawyers said.

In the end, I could have fought the termination and likley could have won my job back after a year an a half to two years of fighting. Or, I could just take their severance package and moved on. Regardless of the choice made, I'd still be unemployed until I either found something else or I won my lawsuit. In accepting the severance package, the money I would be using to fight the termination is now money I could be using to live off of. In addition, what I got for a severance equals the amount I would have been paying to fight the termination. As far as I'm concerned, it was a null game. In the end, I feel the job demands grew to a point where I was no longer a good fit for the organization and that "management" needed to replace me with someone who was more of a better fit.

That still begs the answer to my original
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:21 AM
 
Location: Maine
193 posts, read 225,830 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThisIsMe123 View Post
Exactly, this is so poignant. And honestly, even in the pro-employer/anti-employee culture we have going on in this country, I believe due to the bolded part above and the fact nothing negative about you had been documented, that if your past company makes problems for you getting hired elsewhere, you have a decent basis for a lawsuit. Hope it doesn't go that far...hopefully they're smarter than that. I'd have a friend or family member call them up ASAP and pretend to be a potential employer looking for a recommendation. You need to know exactly what they're going to say about you...

Good luck!
Thank you. You're right. I have looked at going the wrongful termination route. One of my neighbors is a lawyer who gave me some freebie advice. Her thoughts were rather crude in that she gave my previous employer the one finger salute and told me to take their severance package and run. In the end, I'd be using up about $20K in savings and about a year and a half of my life to fight for my job back.

A friend also paid for me to see a labor lawyer that his company uses all the time. She said I had a very strong case for a wrongful termination suit. Her point was that if I did win, would I really want my job back? Would I really want to work for an organization that didn't have the courage to tell me what the real problem was, assuming there really was one?

I also spoke to a friend of mine who is a retired real estate lawyer. Again, he reiterated what the previous two lawyers said.

In the end, I could have fought the termination and likley could have won my job back after a year an a half to two years of fighting. Or, I could just take their severance package and moved on. Regardless of the choice made, I'd still be unemployed until I either found something else or I won my lawsuit. In accepting the severance package, the money I would be using to fight the termination is now money I could be using to live off of. In addition, what I got for a severance equals the amount I would have been paying to fight the termination. As far as I'm concerned, it was a null game. In the end, I feel the job demands grew to a point where I was no longer a good fit for the organization and that "management" needed to replace me with someone who was more of a better fit.

That still begs the answer to my original question. On this particular job app for a job I really, really want, I am being asked point blank if I have ever been terminated from a job. Where the app itself is a legal document, I want to say yes and let the chips fall where they may. My lawyer friend is advising me to say no. I was just wondering what other members here on the forum may be thinking.
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:34 AM
 
473 posts, read 645,581 times
Reputation: 402
If you work in a state that does not require for cause termination, you did not have a contract, and you did not get fired for being in a protected class or engaging in protected activities, I don't see how you will when a wrongful discharge lawsuit. Now if one of those factors varies, maybe you have something to go with. My policy is still honesty is the best policy.
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Old 12-22-2013, 10:52 AM
 
Location: SC
389 posts, read 568,692 times
Reputation: 611
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtnbiker65 View Post
Thank you. You're right. I have looked at going the wrongful termination route. One of my neighbors is a lawyer who gave me some freebie advice. Her thoughts were rather crude in that she gave my previous employer the one finger salute and told me to take their severance package and run. In the end, I'd be using up about $20K in savings and about a year and a half of my life to fight for my job back.

A friend also paid for me to see a labor lawyer that his company uses all the time. She said I had a very strong case for a wrongful termination suit. Her point was that if I did win, would I really want my job back? Would I really want to work for an organization that didn't have the courage to tell me what the real problem was, assuming there really was one?

I also spoke to a friend of mine who is a retired real estate lawyer. Again, he reiterated what the previous two lawyers said.

In the end, I could have fought the termination and likley could have won my job back after a year an a half to two years of fighting. Or, I could just take their severance package and moved on. Regardless of the choice made, I'd still be unemployed until I either found something else or I won my lawsuit. In accepting the severance package, the money I would be using to fight the termination is now money I could be using to live off of. In addition, what I got for a severance equals the amount I would have been paying to fight the termination. As far as I'm concerned, it was a null game. In the end, I feel the job demands grew to a point where I was no longer a good fit for the organization and that "management" needed to replace me with someone who was more of a better fit.

That still begs the answer to my original
I didn't mean sue for wrongful termination. I meant for you to sue for unjustifiably badmouthing you to other employers/harassment (or whatever it would be regarded as in the suit). You wouldn't win a wrongful termination suit in this case, but could easily win the other considering there is zero documentation of poor work performance or other problems with you as an employee. Severance is nice, but will run out. Them bad-mouthing you will follow you your whole career.
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Old 12-22-2013, 11:54 AM
 
Location: Maine
193 posts, read 225,830 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by 85rx-7gsl-se View Post
If you work in a state that does not require for cause termination, you did not have a contract, and you did not get fired for being in a protected class or engaging in protected activities, I don't see how you will when a wrongful discharge lawsuit. Now if one of those factors varies, maybe you have something to go with. My policy is still honesty is the best policy.
The wrongful termination comes into play because the company had a progressive disciplinary policy and they failed to follow that policy. They went from a non-disciplinary counseling session to termination eight months later. There was no verbal or written warnings, no PIP, nothing. In short, the company failed to follow its own policy.

The wrongful termination is neither here nor there. I'm not interested in pursuing the case. I just want a job. What I don't want is for this termination to hinder my future career prospects my entire life.
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Old 12-22-2013, 12:43 PM
 
15,370 posts, read 17,630,878 times
Reputation: 13496
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtnbiker65 View Post
The wrongful termination comes into play because the company had a progressive disciplinary policy and they failed to follow that policy. They went from a non-disciplinary counseling session to termination eight months later. There was no verbal or written warnings, no PIP, nothing. In short, the company failed to follow its own policy.

The wrongful termination is neither here nor there. I'm not interested in pursuing the case. I just want a job. What I don't want is for this termination to hinder my future career prospects my entire life.
You were fired for political reasons. Mainly involving the conflict with the other employee that was skillfully throwing you under the bus behind your back. Don't say this in an interview because they will assume you are a problem employee.
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