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Old 01-11-2014, 05:13 PM
 
Location: Not where I want to be
4,826 posts, read 7,269,892 times
Reputation: 7662

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Quote:
Originally Posted by caradvice View Post
forget fake references... what about bad references or bitter former employers who do everything in their power to destroy you chances of getting a job.

i think most people may lie by omission or exaggerate a little but very few just outright lie

I thought it was illegal for a previous employer to make comments about you --- good or bad? I thought they were only permitted to give your dates of employment and (possibly) your final salary. (is that only in NY or is that a federal thing?)

When they ask for references, I don't take that to mean only work-related references. I would use anyone who knows me and knows my character.
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Old 01-11-2014, 05:22 PM
 
400 posts, read 1,317,566 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amisi View Post
I thought it was illegal for a previous employer to make comments about you --- good or bad? I thought they were only permitted to give your dates of employment and (possibly) your final salary. (is that only in NY or is that a federal thing?)

When they ask for references, I don't take that to mean only work-related references. I would use anyone who knows me and knows my character.
employers and HR know that people wont list a bad reference. i have seen many a HR and Hiring Managers call former/ current employers without my permission or find random acquaintances on linkedin and ask their opinion. its these unofficial job reference checks that everyone should be concerned about.

and to the first point an employer can generally say whatever it wants in most states as long as they believe it to be true. but there are some evil folks in this world who want to keep others down

i remember a few jobs ago i started in a group where another team member and the hiring manager talked about my predecessor day in and day out... she was the scumb of all earth according to them... then the hiring manager told me that my predecessor had been out of work for over a year... i thought to myself how would you know boss as im sure this lady doesnt keep in touch with you or the other team member... come to find out whenever potential employers would call HR to verify employment history they transfered them to my boss at the time who would tear this former employee to shreds....

if anyone is qualified and has been repeatedly rejected from job offers (gone through the whole process not just applied).... then he or she may want to check out what former employers are saying....
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Old 01-11-2014, 06:11 PM
 
473 posts, read 644,717 times
Reputation: 402
Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktothefuture View Post
Why do you ass u me I don't apply for jobs I don't qualify for ? How about you lower your ridiculous standards just a bit and take a chance on a person and who knows MAYBE they will turn out to be a productive employee. After all that was the way things were done since there was an economy.
So you meet the qualifications listed for the job, but want them to lower their stanards anyway? Or you personally feel you are qualified, but don't actually meet the listed qualifications and you feel that is unfair?
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Old 01-11-2014, 06:24 PM
 
4,069 posts, read 5,464,316 times
Reputation: 4920
Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktothefuture View Post
Why do you ass u me I don't apply for jobs I don't qualify for ? How about you lower your ridiculous standards just a bit and take a chance on a person and who knows MAYBE they will turn out to be a productive employee. After all that was the way things were done since there was an economy.
It's not ridiculous. For example, we have reports made up of over 200 lines of code. My standard programming test question is to fill in the last blank of a 3 line code sample. You have unlimited time and 3 chances. If a person can't handle 3 lines of code, they will not be able to handle 200+ lines of code.

The person should not put those lines on their resume. They will admit the lie. One guy said he hadn't done any programming in a long time.

I put the truth on my resume. When the hiring manager questions my experience on the resume, I am able to answer each point without hesitation. I don't have to stall for time or hesitate, because I misrepresent myself. You know what, it works. I accepted a new job for a higher level position, last month.
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Old 01-11-2014, 06:50 PM
 
9,778 posts, read 16,966,691 times
Reputation: 18389
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amisi View Post
I thought it was illegal for a previous employer to make comments about you --- good or bad? I thought they were only permitted to give your dates of employment and (possibly) your final salary. (is that only in NY or is that a federal thing?)

When they ask for references, I don't take that to mean only work-related references. I would use anyone who knows me and knows my character.

It is not a violation of federal law or New York law. As a matter of fact, NY has a specific law that protects employers from law suits as long as disparaging/negative marks are truthful.
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Old 01-11-2014, 08:26 PM
 
Location: Philaburbia
32,366 posts, read 59,796,813 times
Reputation: 54006
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amisi View Post
I thought it was illegal for a previous employer to make comments about you --- good or bad? I thought they were only permitted to give your dates of employment and (possibly) your final salary.
People in HR know that, but does every supervisor know that?
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Old 01-11-2014, 08:35 PM
 
4,069 posts, read 5,464,316 times
Reputation: 4920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amisi View Post
I thought it was illegal for a previous employer to make comments about you --- good or bad? I thought they were only permitted to give your dates of employment and (possibly) your final salary. (is that only in NY or is that a federal thing?)

When they ask for references, I don't take that to mean only work-related references. I would use anyone who knows me and knows my character.
I tried googling for the federal statute, but I couldn't find it. Do you remember when it was passed? It sounds like BS.
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Old 01-11-2014, 08:51 PM
 
Location: Arizona
5,509 posts, read 6,125,854 times
Reputation: 7287
Quote:
Originally Posted by move4ward View Post
I tried googling for the federal statute, but I couldn't find it. Do you remember when it was passed? It sounds like BS.
That was sarcasm, right?
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Old 01-11-2014, 08:51 PM
 
Location: La lune et les étoiles
17,611 posts, read 19,031,172 times
Reputation: 18918
Quote:
Originally Posted by blacktothefuture View Post
Managers - How hard would you look into a resume to see if it was all in order. I'm talking about fake references etc
If people use fake references I expect them to prep their faux references very well. Make certain that dates of employment, job title/duties and salary match.
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Old 01-11-2014, 09:04 PM
 
Location: Arizona
5,509 posts, read 6,125,854 times
Reputation: 7287
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amisi View Post
I thought it was illegal for a previous employer to make comments about you --- good or bad? I thought they were only permitted to give your dates of employment and (possibly) your final salary.
Why would it be illegal anywhere for anybody or any company to say good things about someone???

This has become a very common fallacy. It is not illegal to give a bad reference, so long as what is said is true. And therein lies the rub, since "bad" can be so subjective it's dangerous from a liability standpoint to give a bad reference, and doing so has absolutely no benefit to the company that gives one. As a result, most companies today have the very sensible policy that references, good or bad, cannot be given, and they will only verify dates of employment, position and sometimes salary.

Every employer I've worked at since at least the 1990s has had such a policy, and any manager foolish enough to violate it is risking his job.

There is no law that stipulates this. Companies do it to protect themselves from lawsuits, be they frivolous or warranted.
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