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Old 02-02-2014, 07:25 PM
 
914 posts, read 776,392 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beenhereandthere View Post
Just wondering from your prospective, why you think that it's better to hire people who are currently working (and stealing, in a way, someone else's employee) or out of work for less than 3 months, as opposed to 6 months or more?
Well, from an HR perspective (I am a small business owner who does not buy into the crap hiring managers and HR people buy into) but for them...I imagine it tells them..."well if this guy was passed over for the last six months by however many people he's gone to, there must be something wrong with him."

Now the guy who is already working...that SHOULD (and doesn't) tell the hiring manager/HR person...that this prospect has no loyalty.

Now, in good economic times, with low unemployment rates...long-term unemployed MIGHT say something about the prospect...but in this economy, when there's one job for every three applicants...it should...and I say SHOULD...not have as much emphasis placed on it.

But quite frankly, HR people have a different way of thinkin'...if you could call what they do "thinkin'."
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Old 02-02-2014, 07:27 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
5,722 posts, read 3,202,766 times
Reputation: 7177
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosie_hair View Post
There are plenty of things a person could do to keep his skills sharpened and also support himself.

I got my bachelors in physics. Got accepted by fermilab to help with research. Then the economy tanked and research money pulled. Not only did I no longer have the job, but they also let go a bunch of phd physicists. My degree was now unemployable. I did the next best thing. I took a different path to my goal of working a career in a technical field. I applied and started working at a hardware store to support myself. And during this time, I pursued a job in law enforcement. Got accepted by my state police department. I worked a number of years as a state trooper. During this time, I took night classes to get a masters in engineering. At one point, I had enough money saved up so I quit the state police completely and studied full time. When I got my masters, another stumbling block presented itself. My state cut its construction budget from $3B to $1B. This had a domino effect to companies in both the public ad private sector. I wasn't going to sit around and wait to get lucky. I used what money I had and started a business. And that business kept my afloat for some 2 years before I finally arrived at an honest to god engineering job.

Anyway, here I am working for an engineering firm driving a company car with gas allowance to drive back and forth to a nice comfy office.

For those who can't find work in the field you want, DO NOT GIVE UP. If you can't take a direct path there, find an alternate route. Do whatever it takes to get there.
Great story, rosie! I don't even know you, but I'm proud of you and happy for you! All the best in your nice comfy office! Do they have good coffee, too?
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Old 02-02-2014, 07:55 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
5,722 posts, read 3,202,766 times
Reputation: 7177
Quote:
Originally Posted by panderson1988 View Post
The problem with the mentality of not hiring long term unemployed is because the perception they are awful workers and lost their skills isn't applicable anymore as there is too many unemployed people, and not enough of ideal candidates for companies. Due to the recession the long term unemployment skyrocketed, and now you have more and more managers whining how they can't find qualified candidates.

Well the best of the best are still working, so now you need to lower your expectations and use some common sense like how their skills are, and most important of all are willing to take time to learn and attempt to succeed. The people who are naturally gifted are usually the least loyal as they can jump around anywhere they want, and you can't do anything about it.
"The best of the best are still working"? While you qualified that statement later in the same paragraph, I still felt I had to respond, because it seems there are others on this thread who believe this.

It's not nearly as simplistic as that. There are plenty of reasons why a person may still have a job while someone else with the same qualifications and qualities does not.

Some industries that suffered severe economic blows laid off lots of highly-educated, qualified, dependable employees. The auto industry is an example. And the reason why many (if not most) of the employees who managed to evade being laid off? Seniority. Does that mean they're the best of the best, or just lucky? Or maybe just born at the right time?

There are people who, for whatever reason, move to another city, state or country, but who cannot find work in their new homes. Are the people who don't have to move and are therefore not put in a position where they must look for a new job, the best of the best?

There are people who take chances in life, starting up their own businesses or accepting a job offer that seems like a great opportunity, or returning to school to better themselves. Unfortunately their plans sometimes don't work out, perhaps through no fault of their own. Does that mean they're not employable? Conversely, does the employee who always follows the tried-and-true path and is unwilling to step out of their comfort zone, but who manages to remain employed because of their risk-averse nature, make them the best of the best?

Don't think so.
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Old 02-02-2014, 08:46 PM
 
1,305 posts, read 1,318,903 times
Reputation: 1364
Here's some food for thought.

Anyone who's been to job interviews can tell you that one of the questions that always seem to pop up is why do you want to work for our company?

For my current job, my main interview was with my current boss. The question never turned up. In fact, he never asked any cookie-cutter question that we always hear at these interviews. Instead, he went straight to the real important stuff. He asked me very technical questions. Then he gave me all the time I needed to tell him all about my design project. Having been interviewed by both professionals and bureaucrats, I can tell you that questions from real live professionals give you a lot more chances to tell/show them your abilities than the BS questions from the bureaucrats.
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Old 02-02-2014, 09:51 PM
 
Location: MN
1,305 posts, read 1,409,078 times
Reputation: 1578
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosie_hair View Post
Here's some food for thought.

Anyone who's been to job interviews can tell you that one of the questions that always seem to pop up is why do you want to work for our company?

For my current job, my main interview was with my current boss. The question never turned up. In fact, he never asked any cookie-cutter question that we always hear at these interviews. Instead, he went straight to the real important stuff. He asked me very technical questions. Then he gave me all the time I needed to tell him all about my design project. Having been interviewed by both professionals and bureaucrats, I can tell you that questions from real live professionals give you a lot more chances to tell/show them your abilities than the BS questions from the bureaucrats.
Nowadays an interview with your would-be supervisor is a rarity. The last major interview I had were with team members and "a" manager, but it was never made clear to me if he would ever be a direct manager. The guys on the team scrutinized me even more than the manager, who cared less about the BS and got down to business.

I think we live in a day and age where people are so afraid of accepting someone different into their team/or workplace, they look for any reason to turn a person down. It amazes me to see how GROWN ADULTS have lost the skill to leave their baggage at the door and be professionals. Seriously-- back in my parents' day, they didn't have this BS. You dropped your $h!t at the door and got over yourself. You were expected to figure out how to get along with people you didn't particularly like for the goals of the business. No, not every single day was pleasant-- I can remember hearing stories my dad would tell my mom-- but at the end of the day, there was a job to do and that's what mattered. How is it this fact of life has been lost?
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Old 02-02-2014, 10:19 PM
 
1,618 posts, read 3,371,215 times
Reputation: 1752
Quote:
Originally Posted by beenhereandthere View Post
Just wondering from your prospective, why you think that it's better to hire people who are currently working (and stealing, in a way, someone else's employee) or out of work for less than 3 months, as opposed to 6 months or more?
And, sometimes there are extremely good reasons for long term unemployment. A relative had to leave a lucrative six-figure income to take care of his elderly Mother. He used it as a sabbatical to recharge. It did tend to be a bit sad as his Mother was 98 and passed after a year. The year was marvelous for his Mother and he would never begrudge the time off. He used his experiences of the year to score a more important profession and with improved salary.

So, there are a myriad reasons for long term unemployment. Look beyond the resume and you might find a hidden gem!
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Old 02-02-2014, 10:22 PM
 
Location: MN
1,305 posts, read 1,409,078 times
Reputation: 1578
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Trails View Post
And, sometimes there are extremely good reasons for long term unemployment. A relative had to leave a lucrative six-figure income to take care of his elderly Mother. He used it as a sabbatical to recharge. It did tend to be a bit sad as his Mother was 98 and passed after a year. The year was marvelous for his Mother and he would never begrudge the time off. He used his experiences of the year to score a more important profession and with improved salary.

So, there are a myriad reasons for long term unemployment. Look beyond the resume and you might find a hidden gem!
Really, who would begrudge a person for taking time off to care for a relative? That would be awfully cruel.
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Old 02-02-2014, 10:23 PM
 
821 posts, read 921,059 times
Reputation: 1283
Quote:
Originally Posted by MSchemist80 View Post
I'm going to do my job well, maximize my usefulness, as long as those "great fit" employees you hired don't constantly bother me with useless gossip and chatter about sports and stuff nor impede me with their incompetence.

What did you do during your time off?
The answer to this question is always and only none of your bleeping business.
'

"Oh yeah? What are your strengths?"

I am a highly motivated, self-actualizing employee, always looking to add value, who believes in the concept of never-ending improvement. I believe if one is not getting better, s/he is getting worse. One should always be updating skills and keeping up with this rapidly changing and competitive job market. I will be an asset to your company. I am a man of integrity. I will make myself indispensable.

"Sounds great. What are your weaknesses?"

God, where do I start? I have so many. Let's see...

I hate meetings. Ask anyone who's worked with me. I am always the most fidgety person in meetings. I think most are an absolute waste of time and usually accomplish nothing. I also find myself wanting to kick at least one person's a-- after them for taking up my a quarter to half my work day all because s/he wanted to hear him or herself speak.

I have a hard time controlling my temper and feelings. I wear my heart on my sleeve and I let customers/clients/patients know how I feel, whether it's good or bad. I'm a shoot-from-the-hip kinda guy. You know, that type, pull no punches.

I sometimes thoroughly zone out at work and think about the gym and my total caloric and protein amount for the day and take frequent breaks for my around-the-clock meat head eating schedule and sometimes bail out of work, even if something is left undone, to head for the gym.

When I'm bored at work, I'll call a friend or snoop around online, usually on social media sites like Facebook, Photobucket, Instagram, and Twitter. I think this is actually useful in this day and age. What if you perhaps one day make me Social Media Strategist? Know what I mean?

I don't like shaving. So you'll usually see me clean shaven at the start of the week, but with an unkempt beard by the end. This is kind of the same with clothing. During the first few months of the job, you'll see me in my spiffiest outfits, but then as time goes on, you'll see me stroll in with wrinkled, pet dog-hair laden, and over-worn threads.

Same thing for time. At first you'll see me in here usually half an hour early. But then as time goes on, and I realize I am not getting brownie points for being an early-to-rise worker bee, I'll start leisurely strolling in later and later, gradually going from early, to just on time, to frequently 5 to 30 minutes late. Same goes for lunch breaks. At first you'll see me scarfing down my lunch at the computer and forgoing breaks, but then as time goes on, I will probably start extending the breaks from 60 to 90 minutes or more. I might even do this outside of the building, taking leisurely strolls throughout town.

I also lie. In fact, I've lied to you about my previous incomes at jobs, references, and time of stay at jobs, as well as omitting bad fits on my resume.

"Oh, alright. With where you live, do you think you'll be able to make it on time?"

No, I applied here knowing I will be unlikely to to get here on time most days.


Last edited by Cerebrator; 02-02-2014 at 10:34 PM..
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Old 02-02-2014, 10:33 PM
 
821 posts, read 921,059 times
Reputation: 1283
Quote:
The best of the best are still working?

Christ this is probably the funniest statement I've ever come across on City Data. I literally lol'd from this one!
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Old 02-03-2014, 12:14 AM
 
24,503 posts, read 35,438,987 times
Reputation: 12833
Quote:
Originally Posted by newdixiegirl View Post
"The best of the best are still working"? While you qualified that statement later in the same paragraph, I still felt I had to respond, because it seems there are others on this thread who believe this.

It's not nearly as simplistic as that. There are plenty of reasons why a person may still have a job while someone else with the same qualifications and qualities does not.

Some industries that suffered severe economic blows laid off lots of highly-educated, qualified, dependable employees. The auto industry is an example. And the reason why many (if not most) of the employees who managed to evade being laid off? Seniority. Does that mean they're the best of the best, or just lucky? Or maybe just born at the right time?

There are people who, for whatever reason, move to another city, state or country, but who cannot find work in their new homes. Are the people who don't have to move and are therefore not put in a position where they must look for a new job, the best of the best?

There are people who take chances in life, starting up their own businesses or accepting a job offer that seems like a great opportunity, or returning to school to better themselves. Unfortunately their plans sometimes don't work out, perhaps through no fault of their own. Does that mean they're not employable? Conversely, does the employee who always follows the tried-and-true path and is unwilling to step out of their comfort zone, but who manages to remain employed because of their risk-averse nature, make them the best of the best?

Don't think so.
When I read his post, I didn't think he meant that everyone who is still working is the best of the best. However, the best of the best can easily gain employment. The industry knows them and they are always receiving unsolicited offers.
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