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Old 02-11-2014, 09:43 AM
 
1,158 posts, read 1,049,639 times
Reputation: 846

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Quote:
Originally Posted by timberline742 View Post
This is what networking is for.
Amen.

Networking is a fantastic way to judge people's soft skills, especially in a non pressure environment.

People get really stressed out when they have to go on interviews, even if the company's style is laid back. Probably not the best way to judge candidates as it will favor people who are good BS'ers.
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Old 02-11-2014, 09:45 AM
 
2,285 posts, read 3,110,238 times
Reputation: 3664
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm Retired Now View Post
Lots of good ideas but what is missing is how employers can evaluate SOFT SKILLS. In my experience as a manager, most employee troubles, including me when I was fired, had nothing to do with ones technical skills but instead, poor SOFT SKILLS.

To many hiring managers hire lousy employees because they assume that if the potential staff member works hard, has a great education and knows his stuff technically, he will be a good hire. Considering a good number of new employees fail in their jobs due to soft skills there has to be a better way to evaluate that in advance of making a hiring mistake.

The science behind Human Resources attempts to do just that but many technically orientated hiring managers and applicants, fight these new approaches.
There is ZERO science behind HR assessments.

In my direct experience actually hiring people, the team/peer interview has been a great addition to the process. I very rarely have one of those "surprise!" moments after hiring someone.
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Old 02-11-2014, 09:55 AM
 
1,480 posts, read 2,303,718 times
Reputation: 1611
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadWarrior12 View Post
There is ZERO science behind HR assessments.
FALSE! The study of employment and Human Resources is a complex and valuable science but it is being hurt by employers hiring cheap young homecoming queens instead of professionals who understand the science.
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Old 02-11-2014, 10:01 AM
 
2,285 posts, read 3,110,238 times
Reputation: 3664
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm Retired Now View Post
FALSE! The study of employment and Human Resources is a complex and valuable science but it is being hurt by employers hiring cheap young homecoming queens instead of professionals who understand the science.
I wholeheartedly disagree. The "study of employment and Human Resources" is not a science. It is a theory and a practice. HUGE difference.

It's hurt by it's own bloated ignorance and self-importance.
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Old 02-11-2014, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Florida
4,103 posts, read 4,274,812 times
Reputation: 10055
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm Retired Now View Post
FALSE! The study of employment and Human Resources is a complex and valuable science but it is being hurt by employers hiring cheap young homecoming queens instead of professionals who understand the science.
Im sorry but the whole concept of creating a massive salaried internal department in order to study small costs due to bad hiring seems like a terrible waste of money.
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Old 02-11-2014, 10:37 AM
 
Location: USA
7,478 posts, read 5,789,309 times
Reputation: 12322
It's not that hard, really:

1) Post an honest job description: No nonsense, missing information, BS about "working for a great company" and then not listing the company name, "forgetting" to mention the salary, or trying to trick people into temp work when they expected a full-time job.

2) Only require what you actually need: If you need a mechanical engineer with experience in a precision production environment, fine. Does it really have to be "3 to 5 years experience manufacturing left-handed widgets in a 6-sigma environment?" If not, don't make that a requirement. Sure, it can be optional or "preferred," but I wouldn't place so many obstacles in the way of job candidate that none of them are "qualified."

3) Don't rule people out for stupid reasons: If the job provides relocation expenses, don't rule out people over 30 miles (or whatever) away. If the job has been hard to fill in the past, don't rule out anyone based on silly things like geographical location. Don't rule out the unemployed. Don't rule out older candidates unless there's something in the job requirements that would probably exclude them ("Must be able to carry 150 lb crates up stairs repeatedly throughout the work day.")

4) Keep the interviews to the point: Don't have 3+ interviews for a basic job. Don't play stupid HR mind-games. Don't waste the candidates time asking them "if they could be a tree, what type of tree would they be?" or "If you're trapped in a sinking ship with nothing but 20 rolls of duct tape, a flame-thrower, and a VHS copy of the original Star Wars movie, how would you escape?" Unless any of that nonsense is part of the job requirements, it has no purpose in a job interview. Your goal is to find the best candidate for the job, not a new drinking buddy, or somebody who's only skill is passing HR mumbo-jumbo tests.

5) Treat the candidates as you would like to be treated: Don't post fake jobs. Don't post jobs with absurd requirements. Don't waste a candidates' time with pointless interviews when the job is going to the boss's nephew. Don't ignore candidates after interviewing them. Don't play silly games with candidates and then act as if it is "their fault." they didn't get the job. Treat job candidates with the same respect you'd treat a person in daily interactions - no lies, BS, excuses, or leading them on.

6) Actually hire somebody: Simple idea - but don't go through all this nonsense and then say, "Eh... that's nice and you'd be great for this job, but we've decided to not hire you since there's a chance we might be able to get a PhD with 15 years experience to do the same work for $10 an hour." Excuses abound, but if you claim to be hiring, than actually do so.
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:41 AM
 
3,492 posts, read 4,955,637 times
Reputation: 5383
Quote:
Originally Posted by ragnarkar View Post
I would have a timed multiple choice test asking about basic information that's needed to do the job and information on the company. A passing score earns you the ability to submit your resume and cover letter. This alone should greatly narrow the pool of applicants to the most qualified and serious. Even if you choose to "game" the test by getting help from your friends, it's fine since this alone shows your commitment rather than blindly submitting your resume everywhere and I just happened to receive it.
QFT.

This process will very quickly weed out those that are completely unqualified, without being the awful trash that is keyword scanning systems. Keyword scanning is such trash. Intelligent applicants just create a "keyword" section in their resume and post the job description in there. If a company threatens not to consider candidates that do that, they don't deserve any applicants.

Timed test. However, make sure the answers to the test are RIGHT. I don't care to count any more how many college courses, including master's courses, I had to bring the test back to the professor and prove why the intended answer was incorrect.

A timed test should remove 90% of the applicants, while removing 0% of the qualified. Key word searches unfairly discriminate against those with unique backgrounds, or different job titles, or anyone who doesn't happen to use the same words as the HR drone.

After a quick review and removal of horrific spelling/grammar, I would invite those left over to take a 20 to 30 minute quiz, as opposed to the 3 to 5 minute quiz guarding the initial application. Those scoring in the top 30% or so would be invited in for interviews.

200 applicants after 5 minute quiz = 20 to 40. After grammar removal, 10 to 30. After 20 to 30 minute quiz, 3 to 9 applicants to interview.



One of the most recent decisions I had the misfortune of witnessing:
The department manager invited a few supervisors into the interview process, and interviewed every qualified candidate. The supervisors didn't like the most qualified candidate because he was more qualified than they were by a large margin. As a result, the selected candidate had ZERO experience working in the industry, and 0 experience as a supervisor. The rejected candidate had several years experience in the industry, and years of experience at a managerial level (higher than supervisor). Unfortunately, I was tasked with working with whomever was hired. The selected candidate was late to his first shift, then went in the back to eat a meal on the clock.

They got what they deserved. I transferred to a better department, so I didn't have to suffer for their failure.
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:47 AM
 
3,492 posts, read 4,955,637 times
Reputation: 5383
Looking through this thread, I am saddened that the "job seekers" on here are dramatically more intelligent about how to prepare a job posting than people doing this in the real world. If I were hiring for a new position in HR that involved posting openings for our positions within the company, I would have to seriously consider some of the people to respond in this thread.
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Old 05-09-2014, 10:53 AM
 
3,721 posts, read 3,919,485 times
Reputation: 3366
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rambler123 View Post
It's not that hard, really:

1) Post an honest job description: No nonsense, missing information, BS about "working for a great company" and then not listing the company name, "forgetting" to mention the salary, or trying to trick people into temp work when they expected a full-time job.

2) Only require what you actually need: If you need a mechanical engineer with experience in a precision production environment, fine. Does it really have to be "3 to 5 years experience manufacturing left-handed widgets in a 6-sigma environment?" If not, don't make that a requirement. Sure, it can be optional or "preferred," but I wouldn't place so many obstacles in the way of job candidate that none of them are "qualified."

3) Don't rule people out for stupid reasons: If the job provides relocation expenses, don't rule out people over 30 miles (or whatever) away. If the job has been hard to fill in the past, don't rule out anyone based on silly things like geographical location. Don't rule out the unemployed. Don't rule out older candidates unless there's something in the job requirements that would probably exclude them ("Must be able to carry 150 lb crates up stairs repeatedly throughout the work day.")

4) Keep the interviews to the point: Don't have 3+ interviews for a basic job. Don't play stupid HR mind-games. Don't waste the candidates time asking them "if they could be a tree, what type of tree would they be?" or "If you're trapped in a sinking ship with nothing but 20 rolls of duct tape, a flame-thrower, and a VHS copy of the original Star Wars movie, how would you escape?" Unless any of that nonsense is part of the job requirements, it has no purpose in a job interview. Your goal is to find the best candidate for the job, not a new drinking buddy, or somebody who's only skill is passing HR mumbo-jumbo tests.

5) Treat the candidates as you would like to be treated: Don't post fake jobs. Don't post jobs with absurd requirements. Don't waste a candidates' time with pointless interviews when the job is going to the boss's nephew. Don't ignore candidates after interviewing them. Don't play silly games with candidates and then act as if it is "their fault." they didn't get the job. Treat job candidates with the same respect you'd treat a person in daily interactions - no lies, BS, excuses, or leading them on.

6) Actually hire somebody: Simple idea - but don't go through all this nonsense and then say, "Eh... that's nice and you'd be great for this job, but we've decided to not hire you since there's a chance we might be able to get a PhD with 15 years experience to do the same work for $10 an hour." Excuses abound, but if you claim to be hiring, than actually do so.

Good post Rambler!
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Old 05-09-2014, 11:12 AM
 
1,475 posts, read 2,246,731 times
Reputation: 658
Quote:
Originally Posted by I'm Retired Now View Post

You are now a Project Manager of a government contractor.

You can expect that you will get hundreds of resumes for every opening through online sources like Monster.com.

How are you going to screen the hundreds of resumes that come in? Print them all out and spend 5 minutes reading all 300 of them? Or use a computer aided KEY WORD search? Will you do phone screens? How will you interview and test the applicants who come to your office? Determine who is best? Check their backgrounds? And finalize the hire?

How important will personality be in the selection process? Or will technical skills be the main criteria? Will you make small talk with the applicants to see if they fit with the personality of the team? Will you test them, and if so, how? How will you really know if someone who has the technical skills can really do the job under real world pressure? How will you know if the professional refrences are telling the truth?

Critics of the current process: Here is your chance to come up with a better plan.
The process is what needs change but yet you LOAD the question so that people must fit within your described process which is the same process in use today. If you want answers you have to leave the process open to change!
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