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Old 10-14-2018, 05:06 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,581 posts, read 17,567,761 times
Reputation: 27667

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburban_Guy View Post
Agree with rummage.

And I don't get these employers and hiring managers that want a potential candidate to expect to drop everything at moments notice and interview NOW. That to me is always a red flag.

Reputable employers will always have some consideration for potential applicants. Anytime someone reached out to me for an interview, they always asked me what day would work within the coming few weeks. They were willing to work with me to find a convenient time. Any employer that isn't willing to do that, it's not about the applicant, it's about them and meeting their interview quotas.
One place wanted me to come in on Tuesday. I simply can't make it in that quick when it's relatively far away on a one business day turnaround. I found it pretty inconsiderate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by move4ward View Post
Call in sick, when it's short notice. My manager rarely took sick days. Out of the blue, he seemed depressed and kept calling in sick every week for a day or two. He was gone within 2 months for a new job.

It's been a bit of a joke for the past 20 years at every one of my previous employers. When a employee calls in sick frequently over 2-3 weeks, everybody assumes he is looking for the work. Their new job announcement is no surprise at all.
Our fourth calling on a rolling one year business is an oral warning. I need to keep these for when I need them.
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Old 10-14-2018, 05:16 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,581 posts, read 17,567,761 times
Reputation: 27667
Quote:
Originally Posted by rummage View Post
OK, let's slow this down.

Don't go any further with a job unless there is a written job description and they can tell you the salary range and entire compensation benefits and any other questions you have. No reason they can't answer these questions on the phone and/or through e-mail. I've done both. Any real place to work with a real job is going to be able to do these things. I got contacts by HR departments for several companies recently through e-mail and I was able to answered the salary range, bonus and other information even before I scheduled a phone interview with HR. Because to me, there is no point in going forward if you don't have these things. I also had a complete job description e-mail to me at first contact from HR.

Seriously, anyone who tells you to go on an interview without that information is just being stupid, because it puts you in the worst possible negotiation situation. Because from their prospective the more time they waste of yours preparing for the job and answering their questions without giving you important information is done on purpose to weaken your position. They know from experience the more they make you travel, like 150 miles, etc., that when they finally throw you a bone they know you are much more likely to take it.

Now they are people who are going to post telling you the opposite of this and how it worked out great for them, because they simply don't have any idea how they were taken advantage of. They bought the sales pitch by HR and the hiring manager who claimed, "I don't know the salary, we won't know that until the team meets" is a huge pile of baloney. The second they talk about creating a new position they talk about what it is going to cost and if they have budget for it and what is the market rate. By them not telling you the numbers is on purpose so you shouldn't fall for it.

If they answer all your questions through phone and e-mail, and I mean every single one of them, and you like the job description and you have really checked out the company and they look good, then you can consider the situation more seriously. But to just jump in the car because someone in HR is interesting in filling up their calendar to look busy for their boss, don't do this.
Thanks - good information.

Relatively few places are willing to share any information on salary or benefits. That's one of the biggest gripes I have, and it wastes everyone's time.
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Old 10-14-2018, 12:04 PM
 
Location: Worcester MA
1,812 posts, read 314,671 times
Reputation: 1849
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Relatively few places are willing to share any information on salary or benefits. That's one of the biggest gripes I have, and it wastes everyone's time.
This is so true. Baffling why companies do this. They should just state the salary range and if it's way below a job seeker's expectation, then they'll pass on applying and no one's time is wasted.

I just had this exact thing happen in my current job hunting process. Went through the interview process, was going on a couple weeks and then HR wanted to schedule a second interview with some more people.

At that point, I had to know the salary range or I really did not want to bother going forward. Good thing I insisted because I was in for a shock at the low amount. I pretty much said, thanks bye! after that. If I had known from the beginning, I wouldn't have bothered.
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Old 10-14-2018, 09:58 PM
 
2,614 posts, read 2,243,382 times
Reputation: 4894
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Thanks - good information.

Relatively few places are willing to share any information on salary or benefits. That's one of the biggest gripes I have, and it wastes everyone's time.
You don't have much to lose right now, so let the companies know this, in a tactile way of course and let them know your time is valuable and you need this information before you will go forward.

I think what you will find out is the companies who are really serious about hiring will play ball an stop with all the games.

In the end, I bet you land a much better job with a much better company.

good luck
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Old 10-15-2018, 12:23 AM
 
1,550 posts, read 402,290 times
Reputation: 2896
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Thanks - good information.

Relatively few places are willing to share any information on salary or benefits. That's one of the biggest gripes I have, and it wastes everyone's time.
Sure thing.

It is the way to cut through it all quickly. In fact, I have had HR departments contact me and very quickly ask what I'm expecting in compensation. Even before I brought it up. It just depends on the company you are dealing with. If they are trying to get you very cheap because let's face it, exact same job in another company just pays more, they will not tell you that "bad news" until the very end after they have soften you up.
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Old 10-15-2018, 12:35 AM
 
1,550 posts, read 402,290 times
Reputation: 2896
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taffee72 View Post
This is so true. Baffling why companies do this. They should just state the salary range and if it's way below a job seeker's expectation, then they'll pass on applying and no one's time is wasted.

I just had this exact thing happen in my current job hunting process. Went through the interview process, was going on a couple weeks and then HR wanted to schedule a second interview with some more people.

At that point, I had to know the salary range or I really did not want to bother going forward. Good thing I insisted because I was in for a shock at the low amount. I pretty much said, thanks bye! after that. If I had known from the beginning, I wouldn't have bothered.
The better companies do. It is the less than great ones that hide the salaries and compensation options available, because they know that psychology it breaks you down to accept a lower offer and not even ask for more. In other words, it isn't in their best interests to present you immediately with a low salary for the position you are applying for.

Most people are not prepared for this, and only learn by experience by having their time wasted and being stung along that they finally dig their heels in and not allow this to happen again.

Anyone who acts like you are being disingenuous by asking about base salary, total compensation, relocation packages, stock options, stock grants, health care costs, etc., is doing this because they want to conceal these things. Because if they told you upfront, the salary pays less than half of what you are expecting they know they aren't going to be able to justify their time there and get a chance to sell you on the company.

We all learn, or you hear from someone you trust how it goes so you know what to avoid. I know some people will say if you are out of work and with bills to pay, you should be going on any interview regardless and don't ask about salary. The thing is, that time can be better spent finding the right job with the right company and improving your skills in the process. Also, it is disheartening to put your best foot forward for weeks or a couple of months only to find out what you've been chasing is totally bogus.
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Old 10-15-2018, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Tennessee
23,581 posts, read 17,567,761 times
Reputation: 27667
Well, I had a second interview with some outfit in Nashville today. I gave the HR guy a salary range I'd need Friday. The conversation went well. I asked for a salary range at the end of the interview today. The HM didn't respond, and the HR guy said he'd have "an offline conversation" with me regarding it.

I guess it's another fly-by-night shop.
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Old 10-15-2018, 04:31 PM
 
2,067 posts, read 599,290 times
Reputation: 2931
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Well, I had a second interview with some outfit in Nashville today. I gave the HR guy a salary range I'd need Friday. The conversation went well. I asked for a salary range at the end of the interview today. The HM didn't respond, and the HR guy said he'd have "an offline conversation" with me regarding it.

I guess it's another fly-by-night shop.
If it's the 2nd interview and no salary then I'd say yeah they are full of it.
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Old 10-15-2018, 05:04 PM
 
2,614 posts, read 2,243,382 times
Reputation: 4894
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serious Conversation View Post
Well, I had a second interview with some outfit in Nashville today. I gave the HR guy a salary range I'd need Friday. The conversation went well. I asked for a salary range at the end of the interview today. The HM didn't respond, and the HR guy said he'd have "an offline conversation" with me regarding it.

I guess it's another fly-by-night shop.
IMO, they are shopping for good enough and cheap.

I wouldn't hesitate at all to ask for the higher salaries in Nashville. It is changing fast, booming, hiring lots of people from out of state and you know those candidates aren't moving and coming to work in Nashville for cheap.
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Old 10-19-2018, 04:53 AM
 
662 posts, read 223,450 times
Reputation: 1162
I applied for a position during the summer. I still work and TRAVEL in my current position. The hiring manager contacted me twice to set an appt. ( email contact). I replied back my availability explaining my travel schedule. Not once did he try to work with my schedule. That job listing is now relisted. 🙄 No, I did not re-apply. I no longer care.
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