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Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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One thing I never fully understood...from what I've read a lot of anti-semitism in Europe was because Christians were angry with the Jews for killing Jesus (I'm sure that's just one of many reasons however). I thought Christ's sacrifice on the cross was the greatest thing to ever happen? I know the actual killing itself is nothing to celebrate, but it just seems really weird to hate them for carrying out God's plan ultimately resulting in the salvation of humanity.
from what I've read a lot of anti-semitism in Europe was because ....
Any time you discuss human behavior and ask "why" or say "because", you are on shaky ground. No one realy understands human behavior.
If there is something important to you, like the wonderful taste of vegamite (yum), it irritates you when a person tries it and gags. Maybe Christians saw Jews as people who were not just ignorant of Jesus, but who actively rejected Jesus, and that irritated them. Who knows?
However, my father, born in Ohio, was not at all religious and was somewhat anti-Semitic, but I never knew why.
Since you have nothing else to do in Western Australia, try reading the book "Jews, God, and History" by Max Dimont. I read it three times.
One thing I never fully understood...from what I've read a lot of anti-semitism in Europe was because Christians were angry with the Jews for killing Jesus (I'm sure that's just one of many reasons however). I thought Christ's sacrifice on the cross was the greatest thing to ever happen? I know the actual killing itself is nothing to celebrate, but it just seems really weird to hate them for carrying out God's plan ultimately resulting in the salvation of humanity.
RESPONSE:
Matt 27:25 "And all the people answering said, His blood be on us and on our children." (DR)
It was actually the Romans who executed Jesus for insurrection, but since they were the dominate power and it wasn't wise to criticize them, Matthew put the blame for Jesus' death solidly on the Jews (including all future Jewish generations).
Thus Christianity was responsible for anti-semitism, a view it expounded up until recent times.
The "salvation of humanity" was an explanation later given as the ultimate reason for Chirst's death, but it was an execution for a crime. His followers had to come up with a story to avoid this simple fact.
One thing I never fully understood...from what I've read a lot of anti-semitism in Europe was because Christians were angry with the Jews for killing Jesus (I'm sure that's just one of many reasons however). I thought Christ's sacrifice on the cross was the greatest thing to ever happen? I know the actual killing itself is nothing to celebrate, but it just seems really weird to hate them for carrying out God's plan ultimately resulting in the salvation of humanity.
People do stupid stuff. I wonder if them being Jewish was secondary. Recently there was some footage of a kid at an OWS rally saying some pretty antisemitic statements. He perceived the Jewish people to be rich, and in control of wealth. I wonder if some of the antisemitism in Europe had the same roots to it, but the "you killed our lord" accusations just gave an excuse for action.
Because the things they were actually doing were unmentionable. They were unmentionable, because the Church and the Nobility were profiting by allowing (and, in a way forcing) the Jews to do them (various ways of exploiting the Peasantry). Sometimes, the Church and the Nobility did these things on their own, with no Jewish involvement. But somebody needed to be blamed, in order to prevent peasant uprisings. So, the Church cooked up this irrational excuse, for why Jews were 'bad'. Keeping the Jews as an outlawed class allowed the Church and Nobility to exploit them endlessly. It allowed these powers to force the Jews to do the powers' own dirty work. "Do what we say, or we'll allow them to get you!"
Allowing "Them" to get the Jews was a very real threat. That's what Pogroms were all about. When the Jews got too powerful, or too rich, or a nobleman needed to get out of debt....suddenly there was a POGROM! But for Pogroms to be successful, particularly considering the natural kindness of the European Peasantry, the Jews had to be demonized. Here, the thing about "Killing Christ" was particularly useful: the perfect rallying cry, for people who might be apt to forgive any real transgressions against themselves by the Jews.
When we are told something all our lives, we tend to believe it. When a religious system successfully transforms us into Narcissists, we tend to believe ridiculous things, if those beliefs are critical to our Narcissistic Self-Image. And, of course, when we are genetically 'wired' for conformity, we tend to believe what we are told everyone else believes...we tell ourselves that we believe whatever it makes us normal to believe.
And, of course, if it is in our own self-interest to believe something, then we will believe it. Imagine you're a European Peasant. You're subjugated by an alien aristocracy. You and your family are little more than Human Cattle. You are not free to speak resentment of the privileged classes. Your life is hard and pointless. You need someone to blame for all of this...some focus for your frustrations. And here's the Church, offering you the perfect object for your scorn and hatred: the Jews.
You're not allowed to read the Bible. It's in Latin. And you may not be allowed to read at all. Besides: you're told to leave the thinking to those in authority. So, you really lack the knowledge to figure out the fact that Jesus himself was a Jew. And, of course, you have no idea that the Early Christians were Jews. Maybe, you don't know (or dare not to think) that Moses and Abraham and Mary were Jews, too.
And again, you are told that trying to figure things out on your own makes you a bad person. A bad person goes to Hell, to writhe in torment forever, often after being tortured to death here on Earth. So, you dare not use your reasoning abilities to conclude that only a handful of Jews present that day in Jerusalem called for Jesus' execution. Only a few Jews, out of the hundreds of thousands alive on that day, called for Jesus' death. And you dare not remind yourself or others, that it was ROMANS who actually did the killing and tormenting of Jesus.
Of course, you don't get wonder why the Jews are guilty in perpetuity, for something only a few of them asked for, while the Romans, somehow, seem to have been absolved of their involvement (and even seem to have become the bearers of Christ's Word, despite having brutally murdered him). You really have no choice but to believe what you're told. So, you bow your blond head and get back to pulling that plow, helping to increase the wealth of the Raven-haired Aristocrats who own you.
Last edited by GrandviewGloria; 11-30-2011 at 10:05 AM..
One thing I never fully understood...from what I've read a lot of anti-semitism in Europe was because Christians were angry with the Jews for killing Jesus (I'm sure that's just one of many reasons however). I thought Christ's sacrifice on the cross was the greatest thing to ever happen? I know the actual killing itself is nothing to celebrate, but it just seems really weird to hate them for carrying out God's plan ultimately resulting in the salvation of humanity.
Because the irrationality of people who persecuted and killed Jesus...is same irrationality that persecuted and killed many Jewish people.
The herd mentality in people astounds me. Just saying...
Because the irrationality of people who persecuted and killed Jesus...is same irrationality that persecuted and killed many Jewish people.
The herd mentality in people astounds me. Just saying...
People will find an excuse to do evil. It's what we do. Whether it's persecuting Jews in Europe or looting in America after a basketball championship, or communists killing...we just need a reason.
To ignore (or to never even investigate) the character of an individual, and form an immediate hatred of that person is, in itself, highly irrational behavior. So, there really is no way to analyze bigotry of any kind in a rational context.
Bigots will always find ways to justify their bigotry-- ad nauseum ...whether it's based upon race, nationality, gender, sexual orientation, body size, religion, economic status, etc. Most bigots are equal opportunity haters--the hatred of those who are different than they are seems to be hard-wired into their character. Often, little more than a few like-minded individuals, is enough to turn hatred into inhumanity.
Because the irrationality of people who persecuted and killed Jesus...is same irrationality that persecuted and killed many Jewish people.
The herd mentality in people astounds me. Just saying...
RESPONSE:
The execution of Jesus by the Romans was a rational act. Jesus allowed it to be said that he was the messiah. One of the things that the messiah was to do was to drive out the Romans and return the rule to Israel with himself as king.
That was insurrection against Rome. The Roman soldiers also had to put up with the Zealots who would occassionsly murder soldiers. So Rome wasn't in the mood to tolerate any self-proclaimed kings.
"From then on Pilate tried to release him, but the Jews cried out, ‘If you release this man, you are no friend of the emperor. Everyone who claims to be a king sets himself against the emperor.’' (John's gospel)
Jesus was crucified along with two other insurrectionists (or rebels). Crucifiction was reserved for this class of criminal and for rebellious slaves. Barabus, too, apparently was an insurrectionist and perhaps murderer of Roman soldiers.
But it was more pallitable for Jesus' followers to claim that he was sacrificied for our sins rather than admit he was put to death as a common criminal.
Last edited by ancient warrior; 11-30-2011 at 12:33 PM..
Reason: typo
Jews and other religions of the world were rejected in Europe as was mostly Christian before the protestant Revolution and after this Revolution and if you were not Christian then you were a threat to the nation being lost to God so the King of the nations of Europe would conform to anything that was Christian , .... So other religions were outsider and if they were there were not allow to Worship or they would not allowed any Enterprise in the nation ..... Mostly Jews would be the money lenders and land Lords for renters that is all the Christians of Europe would let them do ....... This went on until after the fall of the Holy Roman Empire and as today other religion of the World are now growing into the Nation of Europe as the Christians dominion has falters as Jesus refines His Church of today..... See it is a pride malice were the prejudice against foreign ideas and different people having authority in the wealth of the nation as the money brokers have over the people who persecuted different people ...... See the spirit of the false prophet and the devil are alway busy causing strife in the world .......
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