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Old 08-28-2017, 10:07 AM
 
29,385 posts, read 9,570,247 times
Reputation: 3436

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rosends View Post
Right. Some call for explanation, others do not, just an assertion of authority.

And that freedom is often driven by what is relevant, feasible or appropriate at any given moment, which does not make the impractical or useless explanation desirable or more valid, nor does it make the simple statement less correct. Therefore, certain types of parental teaching (about religion and other topics) qualify as indoctrination.
Perhaps in order to stay on point and keep it simple...

I am for a higher standard of facts, reason and truth -- best we can universally determine -- over indoctrination.

 
Old 08-28-2017, 10:12 AM
 
29,385 posts, read 9,570,247 times
Reputation: 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosends View Post
who said "hours" and who said "all"? I have washed lettuce. It doesn't take hours and the goal is to remove visible bugs.
Agreed, and those who do wash lettuce do so because of all the good sound reasons we can all generally agree is "good common sense." To "remove visible bugs" or not so visible, dirt, contaminants, pesticides, and all else better educated people have come to understand are good reasons to wash their fruits and vegetables. Universally true whether everyone else bothers to wash their lettuce or not, whether they know why they should or not...
 
Old 08-28-2017, 10:15 AM
 
29,385 posts, read 9,570,247 times
Reputation: 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by rosends View Post
Right. Some call for explanation, others do not, just an assertion of authority.

And that freedom is often driven by what is relevant, feasible or appropriate at any given moment, which does not make the impractical or useless explanation desirable or more valid, nor does it make the simple statement less correct. Therefore, certain types of parental teaching (about religion and other topics) qualify as indoctrination.
Are you now perhaps conflating "assertion of authority" with preponderance of evidence? Authority with knowledge? Assertion with proofs?
 
Old 08-28-2017, 10:20 AM
 
29,385 posts, read 9,570,247 times
Reputation: 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by theflipflop View Post
Arguing with (secular) "facts, reason and logic" is a yetzer hara for a Jew. Do what G-d tells you, and the rest will magically work out for the best.
I used to serve as an Executive Coach for people working in full-time careers while attempting to earn their MBA (at Pepperdine University). I remember this notion that some people I was coaching would suggest to me was better than all the other ways to be successful. Better than strategies I encouraged that were based on facts, reason and logic. Better to take the time to study, for example, than to simply count on G*d to provide.

The "G*d will provide" approach is not that of a Jew necessarily or exclusively. Not by a long shot. This I can tell you from much personal experience...
 
Old 08-28-2017, 11:43 AM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,709 posts, read 30,635,084 times
Reputation: 9985
Quote:
Originally Posted by theflipflop View Post
Arguing with (secular) "facts, reason and logic" is a yetzer hara for a Jew. Do what G-d tells you, and the rest will magically work out for the best.
Forget secular, why they're bothering with this chaim yankel who's been typing this chazzerai is beyond me.
 
Old 08-28-2017, 12:02 PM
 
29,385 posts, read 9,570,247 times
Reputation: 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
Forget secular, why they're bothering with this chaim yankel who's been typing this chazzerai is beyond me.
Insults, in no matter what language, secret code or pig Latin, demonstrates much that is very likely well beyond you. Es ser sinvergüenza.
 
Old 08-28-2017, 12:16 PM
 
29,385 posts, read 9,570,247 times
Reputation: 3436
Quote:
Originally Posted by theflipflop View Post
Arguing with (secular) "facts, reason and logic" is a yetzer hara for a Jew. Do what G-d tells you, and the rest will magically work out for the best.
Nor is this sort of "yetzer hara" belief exclusively Jewish...

We had very good friends that would not let their children read "Harry Potter" for the same sort of reason. The belief that doing so was "evil" in the eyes of G-d, so I guess because we let our children read "Harry Potter" and even see the movie, we were doing evil too.

Perhaps all worthy of some serious reconsideration like I am inclined to suggest. Again in the effort to separate the truth from the nonsense...
 
Old 08-28-2017, 01:41 PM
 
Location: NJ
2,673 posts, read 1,250,537 times
Reputation: 1275
While the word chazzerai derives fro chazir, calling something chazzerai has nothing to do with pigs.
 
Old 08-28-2017, 05:43 PM
 
21,960 posts, read 19,083,870 times
Reputation: 18072
when giving a pidyon nefesh to a Torah scholar, is it better to give to someone local (in same town or state), or to someone in Eretz Israel?
 
Old 08-28-2017, 05:56 PM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,709 posts, read 30,635,084 times
Reputation: 9985
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tzaphkiel View Post
when giving a pidyon nefesh to a Torah scholar, is it better to give to someone local (in same town or state), or to someone in Eretz Israel?
You may want to look up what a pidyon nefesh is as the persons (Tzaddik) location that it references doesn't make a difference. Are you attempting to connect your query to the Bet Hamikdash?

Last edited by Pruzhany; 08-28-2017 at 06:04 PM..
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