U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Judaism
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-24-2013, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
939 posts, read 1,263,038 times
Reputation: 760

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by theflipflop View Post
You've come so far, one more "conversion" would probably be quick enough and quite meaningful to you
With all due respect, you don't know what you're talking about. If anything, Orthodox rabbis feel that people who were converted under non-Orthodox movements need to go through more hoops to convert than other people do because they feel the non-Orthodox converts need to unlearn the apikorsus (heresies) they've been taught. And during this conversion "upgrade", they would be reverting to the status of complete non-Jew: no more cooking or saying brachot (blessings) for other Jews, even secular and non-Orthodox ones to avoid lifnei iver (stumbling block before the blind) and brachot levatala (blessings said in vain). They would have to stop putting on tefillin and tallit and saying many brachot they used to say. If they were previously shomer shabbat, they might be asked to knowingly break Shabbat at least once every Shabbat. You would need to live separately from your wife because you would now view your Conservative Jewish wedding as invalid because it involved a non-Jew, you would need to get married again after you convert. The list goes on. The bottom line is: Going from an observant right-wing Conservative Jew to a modern Orthodox Jew is easy if your mother is Jewish, but excruciatingly and humiliatingly hard if your mother isn't. BTs have it easy
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-24-2013, 12:39 PM
 
3,964 posts, read 3,348,129 times
Reputation: 1246
Quote:
Originally Posted by usuario View Post
With all due respect, you don't know what you're talking about. If anything, Orthodox rabbis feel that people who were converted under non-Orthodox movements need to go through more hoops to convert than other people do because they feel the non-Orthodox converts need to unlearn the apikorsus (heresies) they've been taught. And during this conversion "upgrade", they would be reverting to the status of complete non-Jew: no more cooking or saying brachot (blessings) for other Jews, even secular and non-Orthodox ones to avoid lifnei iver (stumbling block before the blind) and brachot levatala (blessings said in vain). They would have to stop putting on tefillin and tallit and saying many brachot they used to say. If they were previously shomer shabbat, they might be asked to knowingly break Shabbat at least once every Shabbat. You would need to live separately from your wife because you would now view your Conservative Jewish wedding as invalid because it involved a non-Jew, you would need to get married again after you convert. The list goes on. The bottom line is: Going from an observant right-wing Conservative Jew to a modern Orthodox Jew is easy if your mother is Jewish, but excruciatingly and humiliatingly hard if your mother isn't. BTs have it easy
Yes, that is all likely correct (except most Beis Din's will not force the couple to separate until the last week or two before their "updated" wedding). But from the folks in my community that I have seen go through this type of conversion, they have exactly zero problem with it. And if they do, the Beis Din will not likely accept them into a conversion program in the first place. You either want a full halachic conversion with all your heart and all your soul, and will submit to the advice of the Beis Din, or you don't. No Beis Din is begging people to convert. If somebody is truly sincere, they'll ask what it takes to convert, and if that seems acceptable, they'll ask to be a part of the conversion program. If uncomfortable with the Beis Din's "requirements," the good news is that a majority of Jews will still consider you Jewish, and as long as you don't demand that all Jews accept this - it all tends to work out just fine in the end.

From what I have seen, JB and one or two others here who converted Conservative have hashkafos (Jewish outlooks) possibly more in line with Orthodox Judaism than Conservative Judaism. To live a life as a Conservative Jew begins to create frustration (as JB pointed out), when your heart is telling you the mitzvos are important, and that one cannot pick and choose which ones to follow. And this can be especially exacerbated when something like 90-95% of Conservative Jews are ignoring or "changing" the vast majority of mitzvos found in the Torah. And if I'm wrong on all this above, I'm open to hearing where, so that I can adjust my understanding of the subject accordingly.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2013, 03:08 PM
 
Location: small Southern town balabusta
1,138 posts, read 1,434,904 times
Reputation: 761
Quote:
Originally Posted by theflipflop View Post
Or if not, I'm sure you're perfect just the way you are.
This made me smile. You keep calling yourself "cranky", yet I see kindness everywhere with you.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-04-2013, 08:56 PM
 
Location: Eretz Yisrael
21,376 posts, read 24,142,259 times
Reputation: 8872
Virtual Hebrew Keyboard

Virtual Hebrew Keyboard (
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Judaism
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top