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Old 08-29-2013, 08:54 PM
 
Location: Eretz Yisrael
21,357 posts, read 24,094,847 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
My friend went to her great-niece's Bat-Mitzva and came home annoyed. She said the girl sang John Lennon's Imagine, which includes the phrase, "Imagine no religion..."

I would find that a curious choice for such an event as well.
It sounds like a problem with the parents of the great-niece of allowing that song. It sounds there is a strong disconnect from being a Jew and being Jewish. If I had to venture a guess, she had really no education in the relation in the meaning of being Jewish to the level in life when one has reached the age of Bat-Mitvah. I see this more often then not in the US in relation to other countries outside of the US.
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Old 08-30-2013, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
56,037 posts, read 54,537,410 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
It sounds like a problem with the parents of the great-niece of allowing that song. It sounds there is a strong disconnect from being a Jew and being Jewish. If I had to venture a guess, she had really no education in the relation in the meaning of being Jewish to the level in life when one has reached the age of Bat-Mitvah. I see this more often then not in the US in relation to other countries outside of the US.
I am not Jewish and I don't know my friend's family so I can't say. However, Christians often see similar situations with people who, say, arrange to have their baby baptized and stand in front of the congregation promising to raise the child in the faith and the congregation promising to support the parents and the child in his or her religious education, and then we never see them again. Or parents have their kids take the classes required to go through certain rites but they don't continue any participation in the religious community once the ceremony (and the sometimes following over-the-top party) is over.
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Old 08-30-2013, 04:10 PM
 
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I was bar mitzvahed in a reform shul, and it was clear to me back then that my bar mitzvah was the end of my Jewish education and that I'd never have to bother with any of that Hebrew stuff and prayers ever again. They almost succeeded in destroying my Jewish soul, as after my bar mitzvah I became an atheist and swore all organized religion was for fools. It would be two decades later before I found out what the Torah is and what it means to be a Jew. I was nearly 30 before I ever heard the name Hashem.
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:24 AM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,609 posts, read 4,113,133 times
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That's an amazing story, Flipflop.

In other posts, you have said that Reform Judaism leads Jews away from the teachings of the Torah, and after a few generations they are OTD.

In one of my posts, I asked if some of the children raised in a Reform household naturally want a more structured religion and are attracted to Orthodox Judaism. Your post answers my question.

I think the moral of your story is that we should not indoctrinate our children too much. We should give them some basic guidance in life so they will fit into our society effectively and we should teach them about their cultural heritage, but we should let them determine their own religious beliefs.
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Old 09-02-2013, 02:50 PM
 
864 posts, read 733,525 times
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Quote:
I think the moral of your story is that we should not indoctrinate our children too much.
The moral of TFF's story is that his parents indoctrinated him too little, and that he had to bumble around until he found where he belonged.
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:21 PM
 
3,952 posts, read 3,340,232 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iwishiwerethin View Post
The moral of TFF's story is that his parents indoctrinated him too little, and that he had to bumble around until he found where he belonged.
This.

But hey, we're all the sum of our experiences.

My oldest son has begun davening from the amud at shul this year. I can't think of anything that makes me prouder.
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:29 PM
 
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One of my good friends from my reform shul growing up - just today- tried to convince me that Jews should pray to Krishna, because the Jews are decended from Hindu's in India, and we were never enslaved in Egypt. Two of my other good friends from that same shul now belong to the Unitarian Church. Well over half the people I knew from that time married non Jews. Not one single person I knew from that shul is shomer Shabbos today.
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Old 09-03-2013, 05:30 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,609 posts, read 4,113,133 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theflipflop View Post
My oldest son has begun davening from the amud at shul this year. I can't think of anything that makes me prouder.
That's great, Flipflop, and I hope there will be even better times ahead for you and your family.

I hope you get to see your children being good parents. That will really make you happy.
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Old 09-06-2013, 12:22 PM
 
Location: Randolph, NJ
265 posts, read 488,625 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801 View Post
My friend went to her great-niece's Bat-Mitzva and came home annoyed. She said the girl sang John Lennon's Imagine, which includes the phrase, "Imagine no religion..."

I would find that a curious choice for such an event as well.
Or the kid sand the song thinking "Imagine all the people living in peace" sounded good without paying attention to the other words in the song.
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Old 09-13-2013, 09:34 AM
 
Location: North Texas
23,991 posts, read 32,810,396 times
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My bat mitzvah was nothing like the extravagant, OTT parties you see nowadays...or even some of the OTT ones you saw in my day (late 80s). Mine was quite modest in comparison to some of my peers. We didn't rent out a ballroom or anything; we arranged a party at my grandparents' house since they had a pool in the backyard. We had pizza (no pepperoni, obviously!), played in the pool, played games in the backyard...it was a lot of fun. My parents didn't see the point of spending tons of money on a party like that (it was the same for my brother's bar mitzvah). I got gifts of money but a large portion of it was donated to charity and the rest was put into savings for college. It didn't signify the end of our Jewish education either!

I don't like how extravagant some bar/bat mitzvahs have become. I think it detracts from the significance of the event and it's wasteful. That money would be much better spent if it was donated to charity. And it's true that for a lot of these kids, they don't see the inside of a synagogue again (except maybe for the high holy days) until they get married or have children of their own...and if they marry out, maybe not even then.
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