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Old 10-10-2013, 01:48 PM
 
Location: OC/LA
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Rabbi divorce "gang" reveals perils, complexities of divorce in ultra-Orthodox world, insiders say - Crimesider - CBS News
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Old 10-10-2013, 02:13 PM
 
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This story may be more appropriate for the NY forum than the Judaism forum. So two Orthodox Jews were involved in a crime. Are we supposed to take that as an indictment on all Orthodox Jews?
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Old 10-10-2013, 03:08 PM
 
864 posts, read 736,619 times
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If only there were an equal an opposite band of thugs allowing paternal visitation rights, all would be good.
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Old 10-10-2013, 05:56 PM
 
Location: Eretz Yisrael
21,396 posts, read 24,258,238 times
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Even though this is extreme, this is not uncommon the Orthodox community.


Quote:

When the Talmud says that someone must divorce, and if the husband refuses than we
should coerce him. In this instance we may coerce even with sticks. see EH 154:21
http://getamarriage.com/?page_id=26
http://www.getora.com/
http://torahmusings.com/2012/04/protesting-without-coercing/
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Old 10-10-2013, 06:14 PM
 
864 posts, read 736,619 times
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Quote:
Even though this is extreme, this is not uncommon the Orthodox community.
Physical force is NEVER used by a Bais Din, in this day and age. If it were, Epstein wouldn't have been in this business. The harshest punishment a Bais Din resorts to is Cheirum and Seruv. This is the first time I've heard of physical attack being used to coerce a man to GET his wife. To my knowledge, a coerced GET is not even valid, rendering his services moot. Without knowing who his clients were, it's a safe bet to say they were mostly, if not all, modern orthodox.

Last edited by iwishiwerethin; 10-10-2013 at 07:21 PM..
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Old 10-10-2013, 08:49 PM
 
3,982 posts, read 3,363,652 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
It's actually terribly uncommon. Yes, the concept of using violence to secure a get is a biblical concept. That doesn't mean it's common. Kind of like killing the rebellious child. No offense to the OP, but threads like these are meant to impugn, not to inform.
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Old 10-10-2013, 09:29 PM
 
Location: small Southern town balabusta
1,158 posts, read 1,442,155 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theflipflop View Post
It's actually terribly uncommon. Yes, the concept of using violence to secure a get is a biblical concept. That doesn't mean it's common. Kind of like killing the rebellious child. No offense to the OP, but threads like these are meant to impugn, not to inform.
You are correct. My "favorite" is when they find an "Orthodox Rabbi" to talk about Messianic Judaism. Now that's a real treat, too.
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Old 10-11-2013, 04:45 AM
 
Location: Eretz Yisrael
21,396 posts, read 24,258,238 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theflipflop View Post
It's actually terribly uncommon. Yes, the concept of using violence to secure a get is a biblical concept. That doesn't mean it's common. Kind of like killing the rebellious child. No offense to the OP, but threads like these are meant to impugn, not to inform.
You're looking at small communities. You cannot generalize based on your small community to a community that has over 100,000 Orthodox Jews with multiple sects. I'm guessing you've never seen a "Give a Get" demonstration and the angry mob style it gets. I've seen the excessive means used to coerce people to do what they are supposed to do.

I did not say it was common, don't add to my comments. But you and IW need to stop portraying the extremely Orthodox as living an innocent lifestyle compared to the world outside of them. This is simply not true. There are the (some) Shomrim that cross the line in multiple communities that act like vigilantes. There a numerous photos and videos on the net showing this.
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Old 10-11-2013, 04:50 AM
 
32,289 posts, read 33,190,021 times
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In Israel in some extreme cases men have been sent to prison for refusing to give their wife a get.
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Old 10-11-2013, 08:05 AM
 
864 posts, read 736,619 times
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Quote:
I did not say it was common, don't add to my comments. But you and IW need to stop portraying the extremely Orthodox as living an innocent lifestyle compared to the world outside of them. This is simply not true.
Yes, compared to the world around us, we are living an innocent life, but the world around us is not our measuring stick. Compared to our generations before us, we need major improvement.

I love it how the "women's rights" crowd yells "Why don't the Rabbis do enough for agunos?" Guess what, they can't. You married a jerk, you're in trouble. You're fighting with your ex spouse, he might use the Get as leverage.
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