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Old 11-13-2018, 06:55 PM
 
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Please bear with me since I have zero knowledge of Hebrew (or Judaism.)

I have heard that the Hebrew used in the ancient Jewish books uses an honorific plural, e.g. using Elohim to describe a singular God. Is there any translation of the Torah or other books where the translators substituted it with literal plurals (such as Gods or gods)? The effect would be quite different, e.g. in the first sentences of the Genesis.

Would it be grammatically incorrect? Or so far removed from normal usage as to be improbable?
It would clearly disagree with the accepted theological interpretations.

Judaism is the fount of all monotheistic religions like Christianity and Islam, that are popular today. There might be ones before (like Akhen-Aten's religion or the nearly-defunct Zoroastrianism) but none that reshaped our world so much. So it could reveal something new if there was an alternative interpretation of what the ancients were really thinking using phrases such as El-elohim. But only if the language allows it.
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Old 11-17-2018, 10:19 PM
 
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I have a very basic level of Hebrew, but I can follow along with Hebrew and English next to each other. I think it is true that the word "Elohim" COULD be interpreted as a plural in certain circumstances, because it ends in the letters Yud-Mem " im " (pronounced "eem").

However, in Genesis like you are probably most interested in, the plural interpretation really doesn't work. You can prove this because the accompanying verbs are always in singular form. And then it says man was made in HIS image, not THEIR image. It is very clear.

I understand it can seem confusing with the "im" at the end, but just like in English you have special cases. Is "James" plural because it ends in "s"? No. I think the most likely explanation for the "im" is to express God as an infinite being, rather than a normal plural.

Learning Hebrew definitely adds a different dimension to the Bible, and you could understand why religious people study it. It's a strangely flexible language. I don't know any other way to put it.

For example, God's name "Y-H-V-H" is some conjugation of "to be" (related to "I am that I am") , however it is interesting to note that the 3 Hebrew letters used are special letters that can be both consonants and place-holders for vowel sounds. Hence, nobody know really for sure how to pronounce it. That's why some modern people say "Yehovah" and other say "Yehueh". You could guess other pronunciations too.
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Old 11-18-2018, 04:26 AM
 
Location: US
27,954 posts, read 15,039,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slapshotbob99 View Post
I have a very basic level of Hebrew, but I can follow along with Hebrew and English next to each other. I think it is true that the word "Elohim" COULD be interpreted as a plural in certain circumstances, because it ends in the letters Yud-Mem " im " (pronounced "eem").

However, in Genesis like you are probably most interested in, the plural interpretation really doesn't work. You can prove this because the accompanying verbs are always in singular form. And then it says man was made in HIS image, not THEIR image. It is very clear.

I understand it can seem confusing with the "im" at the end, but just like in English you have special cases. Is "James" plural because it ends in "s"? No. I think the most likely explanation for the "im" is to express God as an infinite being, rather than a normal plural.

Learning Hebrew definitely adds a different dimension to the Bible, and you could understand why religious people study it. It's a strangely flexible language. I don't know any other way to put it.

For example, God's name "Y-H-V-H" is some conjugation of "to be" (related to "I am that I am") , however it is interesting to note that the 3 Hebrew letters used are special letters that can be both consonants and place-holders for vowel sounds. Hence, nobody know really for sure how to pronounce it. That's why some modern people say "Yehovah" and other say "Yehueh". You could guess other pronunciations too.
Elohim is a grammatically singular or plural noun for "god" or "gods" in both modern and ancient Hebrew language. When used with singular verbs and adjectives elohim is usually singular, "god" or especially, the God. When used with plural verbs and adjectives elohim is usually plural, "gods" or "powers".



The word Elohim means "one[s] of power and authority," or simply "powers." - The Nature of God (Elohim)
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Old 12-02-2018, 11:02 AM
 
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El-o-Hym = ολω-Hym = All-Human = Infinitely human = 100% human = 0% animal = no ego = never sleep
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Old 02-04-2019, 07:45 AM
 
584 posts, read 504,065 times
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A Reassessment of Biblical Elohim by Joel S. Brown argues, convincingly I think, that 'elohim is an example of what he calls the "concretized abstract plural" -- a case where a thing (or things) is best understood os a complex of qualities or characteristics. It is, in this case, similar to פנִים (panim - face).
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Old 02-04-2019, 01:33 PM
 
Location: US
27,954 posts, read 15,039,743 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayhawker Soule View Post
A Reassessment of Biblical Elohim by Joel S. Brown argues, convincingly I think, that 'elohim is an example of what he calls the "concretized abstract plural" -- a case where a thing (or things) is best understood os a complex of qualities or characteristics. It is, in this case, similar to פנִים (panim - face).
Hope you’re not going to allude to the trinity thing...
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Old 02-04-2019, 03:37 PM
 
584 posts, read 504,065 times
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Originally Posted by Richard1965 View Post
Hope you’re not going to allude to the trinity thing...
That is a truly inane inference. Neither the definition nor the book in general has anything even remotely to do with Christianity.
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