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Old 09-03-2019, 06:53 PM
 
1,014 posts, read 133,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by normstad View Post
Blood. It's red.

Cut a Jew, it's red.
Cut an Indian, it's red.
Cut a Chinese, it's red.
Cut a Nigerian, it's red.

The only difference is blood type, O, A, B, AB and + or -.

Who gives a flying fig what a "law of Halakha" says? It's no more relevant than the law of Thor.

Halacha is relevant to the Jewish people. I could be mistaken, but I don't think it deals with blood, anyway. Besides telling us not to drink it.
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Old 09-04-2019, 05:37 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rachel NewYork View Post
Halacha is relevant to the Jewish people. I could be mistaken, but I don't think it deals with blood, anyway. Besides telling us not to drink it.
You are right Rachel, the Halacha that we are discussing here does not have to do with blood. It is from the interpretations of the great sages based on the Torah and other sources. For instance, in Deuteronomy G-d says “You will not Intermarry with them; you shall not give your daughter to his son, and you shall not take his daughter for your son. For he will turn away your son from following Me, and they will worship the gods of others ...” There is an oral tradition that helps us interpret this and it is the moral lesson that we glean from this that we apply today.

It is very clear that the same influences are as prevalent today as they were in biblical times. When you have so many intermarried Jewish spouses celebrating non-Jewish holidays and so many Halachically Jewish children being raised in a different religion. Worshipping the gods of others.

Last edited by Maccabee36; 09-04-2019 at 06:14 AM..
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Old 09-04-2019, 08:53 AM
 
1,014 posts, read 133,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maccabee36 View Post
You are right Rachel, the Halacha that we are discussing here does not have to do with blood. It is from the interpretations of the great sages based on the Torah and other sources. For instance, in Deuteronomy G-d says “You will not Intermarry with them; you shall not give your daughter to his son, and you shall not take his daughter for your son. For he will turn away your son from following Me, and they will worship the gods of others ...” There is an oral tradition that helps us interpret this and it is the moral lesson that we glean from this that we apply today.

It is very clear that the same influences are as prevalent today as they were in biblical times. When you have so many intermarried Jewish spouses celebrating non-Jewish holidays and so many Halachically Jewish children being raised in a different religion. Worshipping the gods of others.

We also see many children from such marriages celebrating Jewish holidays. Especially when the non-Jewish parent makes a commitment to his Jewish spouse to see that the children are brought up Jewish. I'm not defending religious intermarriage, especially when religion is important to either spouse. I'm defending the families who do the best they can, and I don't like to see any children marginalized by members of their religious community.
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Old 09-04-2019, 11:28 AM
 
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Hi Rachel,

I am certainly not marginalizing children of intermarriages.

What I am saying is while their are some children of intermarriages that are being raised as Jews, the vast majority of them are not. This is based on multiple studies. One also wonders what will happen as people continue to intermarry over the succeeding generations. I.E. there may be less and less Jews as this progresses.

Last edited by Maccabee36; 09-04-2019 at 12:06 PM..
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Old 09-05-2019, 06:11 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maccabee36 View Post
Hi Rachel,

I am certainly not marginalizing children of intermarriages.

What I am saying is while their are some children of intermarriages that are being raised as Jews, the vast majority of them are not. This is based on multiple studies. One also wonders what will happen as people continue to intermarry over the succeeding generations. I.E. there may be less and less Jews as this progresses.
I would like to add to this point by discussing a key finding of a Brandeis study. This is from Beyond welcoming:

Jews in Jewish+Jewish couples are more likely to identify as Jews to value being Jewish, and to engage in Jewish behaviors than Jews in Jewish+non-Jewish couples. Even after accounting for childhood Jewish experiences of the Jewish partner, however Jewish+non-Jewish couples exhibit lower levels of Jewish engagement.

This study seems to say that there is a relationship between Jewish engagement and who you marry. At least in more of the cases.

What is interesting here is the study also found that while the Jewish community mainly has become welcoming the amount of Jewish engagement has not increased. The recommendation is to go beyond welcoming and actively invite intermarried families to engage in Jewish life. I completely agree with this.

So the question is how do we as individuals and the community actively reach out. One of the findings of the study was that one may want to start by inviting Jews from intermarried families to non-Religious events as a first step because there are many(not all) that are not very religious. Afterwards one may start inviting Jews from these families to more religious events liket Shabbat dinners. Are there any other ideas out there on how we can get them more engaged?
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Old 09-05-2019, 08:48 AM
 
1,014 posts, read 133,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maccabee36 View Post
So the question is how do we as individuals and the community actively reach out. One of the findings of the study was that one may want to start by inviting Jews from intermarried families to non-Religious events as a first step because there are many(not all) that are not very religious. Afterwards one may start inviting Jews from these families to more religious events liket Shabbat dinners. Are there any other ideas out there on how we can get them more engaged?

What about the non-Jewish spouses? Are they also invited to these events, or are they going to be politely asked to stay home?
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Old 09-05-2019, 09:55 AM
 
Location: Austin TX
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Jumping in as the child of a Catholic mother and Jewish father, whose parents did everything they could to give me a Jewish education and upbringing- the Jewish community as a whole, even the Reform community, weren't very accepting and even outright made it known to me, as a child, that I didn't belong. My siblings also had this experience. I, as an adult, still believed in living a Jewish life, and will be completing a formal conversion later this month. One of my three siblings converted to Islam, another doesn't practice anything culturally or religiously at all. I think it's important to simply remember to be kind to people, and especially children, so that even if they happen to be Jewish on the "wrong" side they still grow with a sense of community and feel enough a part of the Jewish experience to want to carry on cultural traditions, beliefs and teachings and share them with their own children and so on and so forth.
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Old 09-05-2019, 09:59 AM
 
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Maybe I’m misinterpreting what’s being discussed here, but don’t a lot of synagogues already encourage interfaith couples to participate in Synagogue events( of course some of the things are restricted to Jews only) ?
The non Jewish spouse is invited, as far as I can see. Of course,most of the synagogues near me( an hour ) are Reform, don’t know if that makes a difference
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Old 09-05-2019, 10:09 AM
 
144 posts, read 24,677 times
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I haven’t been to church in almost 25 years, my husband, even more.
Since we didn’t have children for medical reasons, we never, ever celebrated Christmas or Easter, which we considered Holidays mainly for children.
You can always give a gift to someone , why does it have to be on a certain day ?
We only gave Christmas cards out to very few people. Those were Winter themed ( snow scenes, instead of Santa or manger scenes).
We never owned a Christmas tree or decorations. Even when I was a kid, I never liked decorating the tree because my parents used real trees and I always got scratches or my hand caught in the branches.
When I got in Junior High, we were all older, so my parents never even bothered with the ” obligatory “ tree
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Old 09-05-2019, 10:34 AM
 
1,014 posts, read 133,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pumpkin mouse View Post
Maybe I’m misinterpreting what’s being discussed here, but don’t a lot of synagogues already encourage interfaith couples to participate in Synagogue events( of course some of the things are restricted to Jews only) ?
The non Jewish spouse is invited, as far as I can see. Of course,most of the synagogues near me( an hour ) are Reform, don’t know if that makes a difference

I know of various synagogues that do invite non-Jewish spouses to participate in synagogue events. The OP, however, stated: "one may want to start by inviting Jews from intermarried families to non-Religious events as a first step because there are many(not all) that are not very religious. Afterwards one may start inviting Jews from these families to more religious events liket Shabbat dinners."

It wasn't entirely clear to me whether he meant to include spouses, as well.
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