Lee's Summit Grads Not Making the Grade (Overland: low income, 2014)

[xenokc]

Originally Posted by Lsautism

According to a Lee's Summit School Board Member 42% of Lee's Summmit graduates have to take remedial English and Math courses when attending community colleges.

If you are going to post negative results with the intent to 'warn' us, you should provide the source/link. It otherwise doesn't carry much weight.

Some Lee's Summit schools claim above National and MO average for ACT scores...

News

[xenokc]

Originally Posted by kcmo

Well, I still think the schools in the midwest are highly overated after moving to the east coast.

They are good enough and I would send my kids there, but they seem a little better and more advanced out here. Kids are better prepared for college.

You would have to be familiar with every school in the Midwest to make that statement. Here's 2006 ACT scores. MO and KS came in higher than MD and VA.

I imagine these fluctuate year to year. Blue Valley school district has students who get perfect ACT scores seemingly every year.

ACT National and State Scores for 2006: Average ACT Scores by State

According to SAT scores by state, the Midwest came in stronger than any other region.
SAT Scores by State |

[kcmo]

^ I'm not so sure that ACT scores is a real good way to measure this. Maybe it is.

But if you look at that, MS, AL, LA have better schools than CO, MD, MA etc? Not so sure about that.

I'm no expert on this and don't claim to be. But back in MO it was like the kids were taught just to pass specific tests like the MAP test while out there, they seem to teach in a different way. It's less about how they will test and more about what they learn and how they can apply that to college level courses.

If your kids are doing too well out here, they assume the classes are not advanced enough and the child is not challenged and so they push your kids and doing so may actually reduce some scores and tests and grades, but the kids get more out of it.

You also have districts out here that are extremely large and diverse and still rank very high. It seems like in the Midwest if it's not an all white suburban district than it's not a good district. I think it's easy to get good act scores and state scores in districts with the top of the economic demographic and very little social issues, language and cultural barriers.

Look at Montgomery County, MD for example. So many different races and cultures and languages in a district that is both urban and suburban yet has 150,000 students.

That's like the entire MO side of KC all in one district. What they pull off is absolutely amazing. Overland Park and Lee's Summit should be easy compared to that.

Having said that I do think the schools in the suburban KC area are very good. I'm just very impressed with the schools out here, but that is from my very limited perspective.

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by Lsautism

I've been busy fighting for kids. The problems still exist. I will continue to inform the public until the problems are no longer there.

Link to those statistics?

[Mathguy]

Originally Posted by kcmo

^ I'm not so sure that ACT scores is a real good way to measure this. Maybe it is.

But if you look at that, MS, AL, LA have better schools than CO, MD, MA etc? Not so sure about that.

I'm no expert on this and don't claim to be. But back in MO it was like the kids were taught just to pass specific tests like the MAP test while out there, they seem to teach in a different way. It's less about how they will test and more about what they learn and how they can apply that to college level courses.

If your kids are doing too well out here, they assume the classes are not advanced enough and the child is not challenged and so they push your kids and doing so may actually reduce some scores and tests and grades, but the kids get more out of it.

You also have districts out here that are extremely large and diverse and still rank very high. It seems like in the Midwest if it's not an all white suburban district than it's not a good district. I think it's easy to get good act scores and state scores in districts with the top of the economic demographic and very little social issues, language and cultural barriers.

Look at Montgomery County, MD for example. So many different races and cultures and languages in a district that is both urban and suburban yet has 150,000 students.

That's like the entire MO side of KC all in one district. What they pull off is absolutely amazing. Overland Park and Lee's Summit should be easy compared to that.

Having said that I do think the schools in the suburban KC area are very good. I'm just very impressed with the schools out here, but that is from my very limited perspective.

The east coast has more magnet schools and private schools which would generally be better than your typical public school all else being equal. This would be because they've filtered off the crap at the bottom which is why the public school results look so dismal in some of those areas.

While my kids are in the KC burb public schools, they are in accelerated and gifted curiculum so they are getting a little different experience than average. I have no concerns about the education they are getting, my oldest is pretty much on track to go *wherever* he applies for college.

[Mathguy]

Originally Posted by Lsautism

According to a Lee's Summit School Board Member 42% of Lee's Summmit graduates have to take remedial English and Math courses when attending community colleges.

Very weak thesis without providing more information and detail.

If you look at stats like this and leap to conclusions then it speaks volumes for your willingness to run with a topic despite any real data or perhaps just a severe lack of experience or education working with math\stats.

Many students at CC have to take basic math etc. because they never got around to taking it in highschool. It's not remedial.

[aragx6]

I don't love the idea of using SAT scores to judge schools on a state-by-state level, but I'm not sure that currently a better way exists. The state tests are so different that you simply can't compare them.

People can say what they will about the MAP tests but they are significantly more encompassing and difficult than other states' tests -- Illinois is a very good example of this that I am familar with.

[kcmo]

Originally Posted by Mathguy

I have no concerns about the education they are getting, my oldest is pretty much on track to go *wherever* he applies for college.

Yea, I think that's the case with us. I think our kids would do well in just about any district, even a district like KCMO because they would excel in their own circle and take full advantage of what the district offers, even if they are only in about 3% of the students.

The difference I see out here is the ability to deal with more diverse areas. I think it's easy to teach kids from a home like yours or mine. But what about the kids from the broken homes or kids that are practically homeless or the kids where the parents don't know an ounce of English. That's where things seem to break down in the midwest.

One thing that could help fix KC is to have larger districts like they do out here. Everything is by county, not broken up by suburb.

The only problem with that is you would have JoCo out there on a pedestal because its demographics are almost entirely middle to upper middle class suburban.

But what if you broke KC into Three large districts?

Jackson County

Johnson County and Wyandotte County (would have to be that way or KS side would be too segregated)

Clay and Platte County (suburban area, but has inner suburban problems, Northland could take part of NW Jackson County).

[flynavyj]

I don't think bigger is an answer for improving things, but smaller might be. Individual schools on a neighborhood by neighborhood basis with the ability to cater to the needs of the students in the individual neighborhood might do more for the student than being a number in a gigantic district. Just thinking out loud though.

[kcmo]

Originally Posted by flynavyj

I don't think bigger is an answer for improving things, but smaller might be. Individual schools on a neighborhood by neighborhood basis with the ability to cater to the needs of the students in the individual neighborhood might do more for the student than being a number in a gigantic district. Just thinking out loud though.

I think you can be big and still be small though.

Many of the large districts out here seem very well ran with good leadership, but when you drill down, you get the same neighborhood schools you would in a small district.

They are just under a much larger and better organized umbrella that is a well oiled machine with set goals, better consistency throughout the area etc.

It's hard to explain I guess.

One thing is for sure. The KCMO district is stuck in a terrible rut with horrible leadership. It either needs to be dissolved or absorbed, but the current bureaucracy of that district needs to go away.