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Old 11-27-2011, 03:21 PM
 
1,830 posts, read 3,111,988 times
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Not buying it. You said KC is 'a very blue collar city', implying in general, not more blue collar than DC, which is probably the least blue collar in the US since most of it is in Baltimore. Is curious that your choice of words is that KC is very blue collar rather than more realistically saying DC is least. KC is about avg or leans below avg blue collar, DC barely registers.

KC does have hunting/fishing stores on outskirts of metro but you specifically said KC metro is that culture for 'the most part' yet of all things available in the metro, that culture probably represents less than 5% of urban/surburban KC. For the most part? More than DC yes, but not for the most part.

KC is hardly mostly 'college sports' culture either. Maybe that's just who you hung around with. There was a KC Star article about 10 years ago that showed KC attendance in arts related events was about 3.5X higher than all pro/semi-pro/college sports combined in the area. The arts are even stronger now and the sports teams suck even more. It might be valid to say that KC is more into college sports than pro sports, especially since KC is in upper half of upper educated metros who went to a school with a team, but to say KC is 'for the most part college sports' is yet more of your consistent exaggeration. Some I run into don't even know if it's football or baseball season.

Your 'opinions' appear to be formulated by whom you surrounded yourself with or what you anecdotally saw on the streets, not actual information. Yet you imply your opinions are fact. You could at least say 'IMO' if you don't know for sure.

Last edited by xenokc; 11-27-2011 at 04:19 PM..
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Old 11-27-2011, 06:03 PM
 
400 posts, read 843,694 times
Reputation: 390
No one is personally attacking kcmo. Just challenging his ideas, engaging in debate, and having a discussion. No one even told him to leave. He took his ball and went home, and said in leaving that this forum would die without him (because he's just THAT important).

That last comment. Where are the Bass Pro Shops? I had to look it up. There is one in Olathe and one in Independence. And that constitutes what KC is obsessed with? Two stores on the fringes of the metro?

And about college sports, I know I've seen you talking up Omaha on this site, saying how much you love Omaha. Omaha is one of the most college sports-obsessed major cities in the country. Creighton basketball, UNO hockey, Nebraska football, and the College World Series. And yet, I don't see you dogging Omaha for being college sports-obsessed like you do to Kansas City.

But, I already know that you don't like college sports in KC because you hate KU, and MU is 120 miles away. Sucks to be an MU fan in KC, I guess.

And there's urban blight and crime in KCMO? Wow, reading you I never would have guessed. I thought the big issues from kcmo's perspective were:

1) Kansas poaching our jobs.

2) Kansas not cooperating on transit.

3) Suburban sprawl, which for some reason is less of an issue when it's on the Missouri side.

4) People who wear KU clothing at Royals games.

5) Small-minded hicks in KC who can't think big.

6) Civic leaders in KCK who don't know what they are doing (Should have built the Speedway downtown!).

Why doesn't the Missouri side have any Fortune 500 companies? The Minneapolis metro area has 19 Fortune 500 companies, but the Missouri side of the KC metro has zero. I know you will figure out a way to blame this on Kansas.
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Old 11-27-2011, 06:08 PM
 
Location: Middle America
35,821 posts, read 39,387,870 times
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KCMO, you have an interesting view of what constitutes "blue collar." Having grown up rurally in an an area dominated by the agricultural and ag-industrial complex, I have to say that my definition of blue collar ("culturally" or otherwise) doesn't necessarily square with yours, and it's not something that I see overwhelmingly in the KC metro. I also see KC as far more arts-heavy than college athletics-heavy. I see the college sports rivalry freaks, but they're mostly confined to the bunch of 20-somethings I work with who are fresh out of school themselves than it is a pervasive city-wide mentality, for me. I also am involved in a lot of community arts and music ensembles, so guess what the majority of the people I spend time around are into? It's hard for me to consider a city with as rich an arts and music tradition to be predominantly redneck and/or blue collar.

Just an example of how two people can look at a city and see vastly different things, based on their individual perspectives.
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Old 11-27-2011, 08:16 PM
 
Location: Washington, DC area
10,705 posts, read 18,509,283 times
Reputation: 5415
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Earth View Post
No one is personally attacking kcmo. Just challenging his ideas, engaging in debate, and having a discussion. No one even told him to leave. He took his ball and went home, and said in leaving that this forum would die without him (because he's just THAT important).

That last comment. Where are the Bass Pro Shops? I had to look it up. There is one in Olathe and one in Independence. And that constitutes what KC is obsessed with? Two stores on the fringes of the metro?

And about college sports, I know I've seen you talking up Omaha on this site, saying how much you love Omaha. Omaha is one of the most college sports-obsessed major cities in the country. Creighton basketball, UNO hockey, Nebraska football, and the College World Series. And yet, I don't see you dogging Omaha for being college sports-obsessed like you do to Kansas City.

But, I already know that you don't like college sports in KC because you hate KU, and MU is 120 miles away. Sucks to be an MU fan in KC, I guess.

And there's urban blight and crime in KCMO? Wow, reading you I never would have guessed. I thought the big issues from kcmo's perspective were:

1) Kansas poaching our jobs.

2) Kansas not cooperating on transit.

3) Suburban sprawl, which for some reason is less of an issue when it's on the Missouri side.

4) People who wear KU clothing at Royals games.

5) Small-minded hicks in KC who can't think big.

6) Civic leaders in KCK who don't know what they are doing (Should have built the Speedway downtown!).

Why doesn't the Missouri side have any Fortune 500 companies? The Minneapolis metro area has 19 Fortune 500 companies, but the Missouri side of the KC metro has zero. I know you will figure out a way to blame this on Kansas.
I think having two bass pro shops and a cabella’s is pretty significant for the size of KC. You may not think so!

Omaha is not a major league city, so I don’t expect Omaha to act like a major league city. Omaha is actually a pretty dense city all the way to the suburbs. It’s not near as chopped up and fragmented as KC and has a pretty decent urban core for the size of the city. I like that about Omaha. For the size of the city, I actually do like Omaha.

MU, KU, don’t care. I’m from MO so yea, I’m don’t care for KU sports, but don’t get into MU sports. I would however love to see KC develop a competitive NCAA team and college. It would be great of UMKC changed back to University of KC and grew into something much larger, both academically and in sports.

There is blight and crime all over metro KC, more than there should be, much of which can be attributed to sprawl and corporate welfare.

I will ignore your little top six list, because it’s nothing but trolling, which is about all you do on this forum. Please let me know when I ever said that the speedway should be in downtown KCK? But that’s a prime example of ignoring what is a legit issue (KCK using incentives to develop the hinterlands while ignoring nearly the entire built up part of the city) and you replying with some arrogant condescending comment trying to replay to something that I never said.

Why doesn’t KCMO have any fortune 500 companies? Why don’t you tell me since you seem to have all the answers? You won’t like my answer because it is based on the lack of corporate civic pride there which I’m sure you will not acknowledge as an issue. KC companies are just not that interested in being in the city, especially when a whole lot of money is available for the taking to be in the burbs. Pretty simple really.

Please tell me what you contribute to the KC forum. Besides trolling posts like this, you pretty much don’t post anything.
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Old 11-27-2011, 08:28 PM
 
Location: Washington, DC area
10,705 posts, read 18,509,283 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TabulaRasa View Post
KCMO, you have an interesting view of what constitutes "blue collar." Having grown up rurally in an an area dominated by the agricultural and ag-industrial complex, I have to say that my definition of blue collar ("culturally" or otherwise) doesn't necessarily square with yours, and it's not something that I see overwhelmingly in the KC metro. I also see KC as far more arts-heavy than college athletics-heavy. I see the college sports rivalry freaks, but they're mostly confined to the bunch of 20-somethings I work with who are fresh out of school themselves than it is a pervasive city-wide mentality, for me. I also am involved in a lot of community arts and music ensembles, so guess what the majority of the people I spend time around are into? It's hard for me to consider a city with as rich an arts and music tradition to be predominantly redneck and/or blue collar.

Just an example of how two people can look at a city and see vastly different things, based on their individual perspectives.


And I respect your opinion and view point. In my field of work (engineering), it seemed like people were into college sports at work no matter the age and maybe my time living in eastern Jackson county has put me around more than a normal amount of blue collar people, but from what I have seen, Clay County and Wyandotte County are even more blue collar than Eastern Jackson County. That’s a pretty big part of the metro.

I personally think KC as a whole is more blue collar than most cities of its size and larger, but in the case of this thread, I think it’s a valid comparison to DC. Also, places like Baltimore and Cleveland are blue collar in an industrial way, but not so much blue collar in a country/agricultural/cultural way which KC can be in pretty large chunks of the metro. It’s hard to explain I guess, but again, I never said that KC is a blue collar town when it comes to the workforce.

I do agree that KC has a very strong arts community and most people in the urban core of KCMO and pockets of the suburbs are very much NOT blue collar, but you still have 3/4 of the metro out there.

But again, I respect your viewpoint as well.
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Old 11-27-2011, 08:40 PM
 
Location: Washington, DC area
10,705 posts, read 18,509,283 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr1967 View Post
Reading through the replies. Well, I am mid 40s and I think that the most concern for dating here (I moved here from the West Coast) is for 20 and 30 somethings. That is where I hear the most complaints. Sadly, I moved to the Missouri (Mis-er-y) side and it's redneck city. Had I known it was like this prior to moving here I would have set my stakes on the KS side. So, if rednecks are your type, the MO side is the place to be for middle aged single men. I spend most of my time away from home on the KS side and the men seem a bit pretentious. It's like cowboys wearing tuxedos. So, I'm still not real impressed. I think I will just remain single here and enjoy my brief stay until I move back to the West Coast where more of my type exist. Good luck :-)
I didn't even see this post. Maybe some of you can reply to this very harsh post??? While I don't think her description of the metro is as blanket statement as she is implying, I do think what she may be seeing is this "blue collar" culture in KC, which can be pretty visible in much of the MO side and KCK while hidden in Johnson County behind the nice cars and big houses. I think when you travel you may notice this to some degree, but I wouldn't say it in such a harsh way, I would only say that KC is more blue collar than some other city.

So why not rip into this poster???
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Old 11-27-2011, 11:27 PM
 
400 posts, read 843,694 times
Reputation: 390
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
But thatís a prime example of ignoring what is a legit issue (KCK using incentives to develop the hinterlands while ignoring nearly the entire built up part of the city) and you replying with some arrogant condescending comment trying to replay to something that I never said.
Sorry if I don't feel like repeating myself, but I've discussed numerous times why the Village West development, or any development like it, would not have been built in downtown KCK, only to have someone like you persist with fantasies about "what could have been", as if your notion of what could have been was even a proposal. You don't seem to get it.

The KCK mayor at the time that Village West was being formulated was a downtown KCK resident named Carol Marinovich. Let me just say, that I trust that Carol Marinovich cares more about and knows more about downtown KCK than you do.

And she was a prime mover behind getting Village West built. If there were proposals and investors willing to build such things in downtown KCK, I'm sure that she and others who care about downtown KCK would have jumped at the chance to do something for downtown. But what investors were interested in was building near the corner of I-70 and I-435, because that area was largely undeveloped at that time and they liked the location. They did not like the location in downtown KCK.

So rather than hold out for "idealistic" unrealistic fantasies about building some aquarium at Kaw Point for which no one is interested and no one is putting forth any money to do it, they took the opportunity to build something for which investors were willing to invest in and build: something nice for KCK, something that serves as a regional destination, something that creates jobs, something that grows the tax base, even if it was in the western part of the city.

Let me hear you talk again about how your notions of what KCK is like are based on watching COPS episodes from the safe confines of your Washington D.C.-area living room. Yeah, I remember that. You came here one day talking about how KCK was so "hick" because of some crap that you saw about KCK on an episode of COPS. So please.

When I hear you talking about how KCK isn't using some opportunity to redevelop the urban core areas of the city, to me it's offensive. Because first of all, there hasn't been any such opportunity. The Village West development wasn't an either/or. It was take it or leave it. There was no interest in putting any of it at Indian Springs or downtown. Stop acting like there was. There was an interest in building where it ended up being built. They are getting the tax revenue and within a decade or so the bonds will be paid off, and KCK will be in very nice financial shape out of it.

Another thing is, I'm not as familiar with the current developments since I don't live in KC anymore, but I do catch things here and there about developments going on in the urban parts of KCK. I know it is not just rotting away. It's probably better than it was in the mid-90s.

Quote:
Why doesnít KCMO have any fortune 500 companies? Why donít you tell me since you seem to have all the answers? You wonít like my answer because it is based on the lack of corporate civic pride there which Iím sure you will not acknowledge as an issue. KC companies are just not that interested in being in the city, especially when a whole lot of money is available for the taking to be in the burbs. Pretty simple really.
Really? That's what I thought you would say. Something about Kansas stole their jobs. There are three Fortune 500 companies in the KC metro area in 2011: Sprint Nextel, YRC, and Seaboard. Which ones were stolen from Missouri? No really. I want to know. These have all been Kansas-based companies for as long as I can remember. Sprint started in Abilene, Kansas. My question was why are there no Fortune 500's on the Missouri side. Your answer: It's Kansas' fault.

Quote:
Please tell me what you contribute to the KC forum. Besides trolling posts like this, you pretty much donít post anything.
I post comments like the lengthy one above. I used to do more of that, but I do get tired of repeating myself. I lived in KC for two years in the mid-2000s, but grew up seeing KC as the "big city" to which I looked since it was the closest major city. I have relatives in KC now (Missouri side actually!). I only post in the KC forum because I am familiar with Kansas City. I read the forums of places of which I am familiar, and post comments if I have something to contribute.

So I guess this means you're back, huh? You really stormed off there last week.
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Old 11-28-2011, 07:46 AM
 
Location: Tower Grove East, St. Louis, MO
12,064 posts, read 27,222,457 times
Reputation: 3739
Quote:
Originally Posted by xenokc View Post
Your 'opinions' appear to be formulated by whom you surrounded yourself with or what you anecdotally saw on the streets, not actual information.

Yes, but you claiming that probably only 5% of the metro hunts and fishes (which is obviously straight nonsense) is totally not anecdotal, right? Puhleaze!
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Old 11-28-2011, 09:59 AM
 
1,830 posts, read 3,111,988 times
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Touche', but likely closer to 5% than 50% as he claimed. I did say suburban/urban KC not of all metro KC and also said 'probably/likely', which is not a statement of fact. I was actually being careful about that when making the statement. KC 'metro' though does include huge rural areas and obviously a huge portion of KC metro outside suburbanized hoods probably do hunt or fish.
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Old 11-28-2011, 10:19 AM
 
Location: Old Hyde Park, Kansas City,MO
1,145 posts, read 2,000,435 times
Reputation: 562
I'm orginally from Wisconsin, Hunting and Fishing is not huge at all compared to places like Wisconsin and Minnesota, it seems like every other man, women and child hunts and fishes up there.

Male Strippers and other things centered toward "girls only" do really good in November because all the men are up North deer hunting.
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