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Old 01-19-2012, 07:55 AM
 
Location: Washington, DC area
10,705 posts, read 18,488,746 times
Reputation: 5405

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Chamber of Commerce sees ways for Missouri to still play games in KC - KansasCity.com (http://www.kansascity.com/2012/01/18/3377920/mus-alden-meets-with-kc-chamber.html - broken link)

I'm not a huge college sports fan, but the KU/MU thing is part of KC's culture and one of the most intense rivalries in all of sports.

What is the deal with KU and KU fans being so mad at MU for leaving the big12? Seems like this is a great opportunity for MU to rise to a new level and get more national exposure and they could do that while keeping the KS/MO rivalry intact.

I just find it funny reading all the comments etc about this topic and seeing how the KU fans are like "don't let the door hit you on your way out".

I guess it's a good thing because KU football seems to me like it's a much lower level program. Bring in a powerhouse from the SEC and fill arrowhead stadium every year rather than waste time with KU and a game that can't be seen outside of the KC area. The game a few years ago when they were both ranked 1 and 2 was not even on tv outside of KC. So that's sort of KU's loss by no longer wanting to play MU.

But the two schools are more equal in basketball (I know KU has the better program there), so why not try to play that game in kc once a year?

MIZZOU plays Illinois in StLouis every year.

Anyway, I just think KU fans and KU itself it being a bit short sighted here.

 
Old 01-19-2012, 08:50 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,758 posts, read 9,485,099 times
Reputation: 2791
You really should learn some history. KU and MU football are much more equal in football than they are in basketball - it's not even close. The series history between the two schools is even (MU has a one game lead). KU has about a 100 game lead on MU in basketball and you think they are even in basketball?

MU has much, much more to gain from playing KU in KC than KU does. MU can play Joe Blow state in basketball in the Sprint Center, fill it up, and keep all the money instead of splitting it. If MU were to play some random school at the Sprint Center, they probably would not fill it. They have trouble filling their own arena at times.

Did you really say, "The game a few years ago when they were both ranked 1 and 2 was not even on tv outside of KC?" Are you serious? That game was on ABC and the ENTIRE NATION was able to see it as it was the national game of the week.

There are two reasons for KU not wanting to play MU. One, KU has nothing to gain from it. Not a single thing. Two, the Big 12 schools have made a pact not to play any of the schools that left in non-con games. Why reward schools that betrayed you with an opportunity to get exposure and make money?

If you are in business with someone and they break a contract with you to make more money somewhere else are you going to continue to do business with that person when they have already proven they are not trustworthy or loyal? No, you would be a fool to do so.

The only factual statement you made in your post was - "MIZZOU plays Illinois in StLouis every year."
 
Old 01-19-2012, 08:53 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,758 posts, read 9,485,099 times
Reputation: 2791
Also, the Big 12 has West Virginia coming in to replace MU and that is a positive gain. WVU has the better football program, better basketball program, more revenue, more TV sets, a bigger national reputation, and better academics. There is not a single thing that MU has over WVU that matters.

So, MU can leave, WVU comes in and the conference is stronger for it.
 
Old 01-19-2012, 09:27 AM
 
Location: Washington, DC area
10,705 posts, read 18,488,746 times
Reputation: 5405
Quote:
Originally Posted by RjRobb2 View Post
You really should learn some history. KU and MU football are much more equal in football than they are in basketball - it's not even close. The series history between the two schools is even (MU has a one game lead). KU has about a 100 game lead on MU in basketball and you think they are even in basketball?

MU has much, much more to gain from playing KU in KC than KU does. MU can play Joe Blow state in basketball in the Sprint Center, fill it up, and keep all the money instead of splitting it. If MU were to play some random school at the Sprint Center, they probably would not fill it. They have trouble filling their own arena at times.

Did you really say, "The game a few years ago when they were both ranked 1 and 2 was not even on tv outside of KC?" Are you serious? That game was on ABC and the ENTIRE NATION was able to see it as it was the national game of the week.

There are two reasons for KU not wanting to play MU. One, KU has nothing to gain from it. Not a single thing. Two, the Big 12 schools have made a pact not to play any of the schools that left in non-con games. Why reward schools that betrayed you with an opportunity to get exposure and make money?

If you are in business with someone and they break a contract with you to make more money somewhere else are you going to continue to do business with that person when they have already proven they are not trustworthy or loyal? No, you would be a fool to do so.

The only factual statement you made in your post was - "MIZZOU plays Illinois in StLouis every year."
I'm talking about now, not over the past 100 games, It sure seems like MU has a much better football program, bigger stadium, more fans etc while KU has the better basketball program, more sellouts, more fans etc, although MU seems to be ranked quite often up there with KU, I fully understand that MU is not the basketball powerhouse that KU is.

That big KU/MU game was not on TV everywhere, it was a national game feed, but it seemed like few picked it up. We get both DC and Baltimore ABC affiliates and both showed a different game and even though the game was a HUGE deal in KC, ESPN barely even covered the highlights of the game. I know, we really wanted to watch it and couldn't and it was difficult to even find post game coverage. I'm not sure why, but that game at arrowhead is never on TV out here.

Now, we get lots of MU and KU games on TV out here, but for some reason, that border war game is never on out here.

I'm not going to try to argue with you on the economics of why KU won't play. I don't know enough about it. You are probably right. But it still seems odd for KU to step away and not play games in KC. Kansas City, MO is KU's "big city" and where they play in big city venues and where they have a great deal of alumni. Just like StLouis is to Mizzou. I just thought they would want to keep that going.

So with MU no longer in the big 12, does that mean KU will basically stop playing games at both Sprint Center and Arrowhead? With those venues being in a state that is not part of the big 12, it seems like MIZZOU leaving the big 12 has sort of ripped out the carpet from under KU taking away their home away from home venues. I can understand that resentment. I would just hope something can be worked out.

Sounds like MU will continue to play games in KC, they just may not be against KU. I think they have a better chance of filling arrowhead and bringing a lot more revenue to KC anyway if they played somebody like Arkansas or LSU. I don't know if MU will be able to compete with those guys or not, but it would be good for KC. Same deal with basketball. Bring some new teams to the city with traveling fans and fill the hotel rooms with people driving from further than Overland Park. This could be a good thing for KC or at least a wash if KC loses the big 12 tourney.
 
Old 01-19-2012, 09:48 AM
 
Location: Tower Grove East, St. Louis, MO
12,064 posts, read 27,204,220 times
Reputation: 3739
Quote:
Originally Posted by RjRobb2 View Post
You really should learn some history. KU and MU football are much more equal in football than they are in basketball - it's not even close. The series history between the two schools is even (MU has a one game lead). KU has about a 100 game lead on MU in basketball and you think they are even in basketball?

MU has much, much more to gain from playing KU in KC than KU does. MU can play Joe Blow state in basketball in the Sprint Center, fill it up, and keep all the money instead of splitting it. If MU were to play some random school at the Sprint Center, they probably would not fill it. They have trouble filling their own arena at times.

Did you really say, "The game a few years ago when they were both ranked 1 and 2 was not even on tv outside of KC?" Are you serious? That game was on ABC and the ENTIRE NATION was able to see it as it was the national game of the week.

There are two reasons for KU not wanting to play MU. One, KU has nothing to gain from it. Not a single thing. Two, the Big 12 schools have made a pact not to play any of the schools that left in non-con games. Why reward schools that betrayed you with an opportunity to get exposure and make money?

If you are in business with someone and they break a contract with you to make more money somewhere else are you going to continue to do business with that person when they have already proven they are not trustworthy or loyal? No, you would be a fool to do so.

The only factual statement you made in your post was - "MIZZOU plays Illinois in StLouis every year."

Actually they don't any more. Illinois was sick of losing their first game every year so they didn't re-up

I think Border War type showdowns are a great "get" for cities, but it's really up to each individual program if there's a benefit to them. I think KU is mistaken that there's no net gain for them in continuing the tradition (give them a couple years and some hard cord KC-area lobbying and they might see it differently). Mizzou will be just fine on it's own though.
 
Old 01-19-2012, 10:21 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,758 posts, read 9,485,099 times
Reputation: 2791
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
I'm talking about now, not over the past 100 games, It sure seems like MU has a much better football program, bigger stadium, more fans etc while KU has the better basketball program, more sellouts, more fans etc, although MU seems to be ranked quite often up there with KU, I fully understand that MU is not the basketball powerhouse that KU is.
Right now doesnt matter in the grand scheme of things. College programs go up and down so fast that a couple of years is just a drop in the bucket. KU's basketball program is far better than any program MU has. MU's football program is on a huge upswing because of Gary Pinkel. He will leave eventually when someone like Texas calls with 4 million a year and they will be as mediocre as they ever were and with KU bringing in Weis, they will likely experience an upswing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
That big KU/MU game was not on TV everywhere, it was a national game feed, but it seemed like few picked it up. We get both DC and Baltimore ABC affiliates and both showed a different game and even though the game was a HUGE deal in KC, ESPN barely even covered the highlights of the game. I know, we really wanted to watch it and couldn't and it was difficult to even find post game coverage. I'm not sure why, but that game at arrowhead is never on TV out here.
Some affiliates may not have picked it up but that happens with a lot of sports games but it was a national game and it was available for most of the nation to see. Werent you still living in KC then? That was in 2007, I believe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
I'm not going to try to argue with you on the economics of why KU won't play. I don't know enough about it. You are probably right. But it still seems odd for KU to step away and not play games in KC. Kansas City, MO is KU's "big city" and where they play in big city venues and where they have a great deal of alumni. Just like StLouis is to Mizzou. I just thought they would want to keep that going.
KU plays an annual game in KC every year in basketball and has for years. The Border War game in KC was only for 4 years, it was a new thing. KU will continue to play their annual game at the Sprint Center.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
So with MU no longer in the big 12, does that mean KU will basically stop playing games at both Sprint Center and Arrowhead? With those venues being in a state that is not part of the big 12, it seems like MIZZOU leaving the big 12 has sort of ripped out the carpet from under KU taking away their home away from home venues. I can understand that resentment. I would just hope something can be worked out.
Probably not Arrowhead but they will still play at the Sprint Center. In football you only get 4 non-con games and you want to get as many of those as you can at home in your own stadium because they could very well determine your bowl eligibility.

Why would you work something out with a business partner that screwed you over. MU walked out in the middle of a contract and jeopardized the league's new TV contract in the process. Why would you do business with someone like that.

The Big 12 North schools agreed to stick together and with the conference until it sunk and then MU was having back door dealings with the SEC. They are not a good business partner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
Sounds like MU will continue to play games in KC, they just may not be against KU. I think they have a better chance of filling arrowhead and bringing a lot more revenue to KC anyway if they played somebody like Arkansas or LSU. I don't know if MU will be able to compete with those guys or not, but it would be good for KC. Same deal with basketball. Bring some new teams to the city with traveling fans and fill the hotel rooms with people driving from further than Overland Park. This could be a good thing for KC or at least a wash if KC loses the big 12 tourney.
MU is going to have to bring in some big time opponents to make it work and big time opponents have traveling fans and it could quickly turn into an away game for MU.
 
Old 01-19-2012, 10:24 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,758 posts, read 9,485,099 times
Reputation: 2791
Quote:
Originally Posted by aragx6 View Post
I think KU is mistaken that there's no net gain for them in continuing the tradition (give them a couple years and some hard cord KC-area lobbying and they might see it differently). Mizzou will be just fine on it's own though.

What exactly do they gain? They can sellout the Sprint Center playing anybody so why play a game where they would have to split 50-50 with MU?

In football, why would you play MU when you can play someone like Murray State in non-con and get a win to pad your bowl eligibility. It sucks college football works like that but it is a very flawed system. MU wants to play KU right now but once KU has an upswing and are competitive again, they will not want to anymore. They are now playing in the SEC and are going to have a hard time getting conference wins which means they need to sweep their non-con to get into bowls.
 
Old 01-19-2012, 10:56 AM
 
48,891 posts, read 39,370,650 times
Reputation: 30547
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
Chamber of Commerce sees ways for Missouri to still play games in KC - KansasCity.com (http://www.kansascity.com/2012/01/18/3377920/mus-alden-meets-with-kc-chamber.html - broken link)

I'm not a huge college sports fan, but the KU/MU thing is part of KC's culture and one of the most intense rivalries in all of sports.

What is the deal with KU and KU fans being so mad at MU for leaving the big12? Seems like this is a great opportunity for MU to rise to a new level and get more national exposure and they could do that while keeping the KS/MO rivalry intact.

I just find it funny reading all the comments etc about this topic and seeing how the KU fans are like "don't let the door hit you on your way out".

I guess it's a good thing because KU football seems to me like it's a much lower level program. Bring in a powerhouse from the SEC and fill arrowhead stadium every year rather than waste time with KU and a game that can't be seen outside of the KC area. The game a few years ago when they were both ranked 1 and 2 was not even on tv outside of KC. So that's sort of KU's loss by no longer wanting to play MU.

But the two schools are more equal in basketball (I know KU has the better program there), so why not try to play that game in kc once a year?

MIZZOU plays Illinois in StLouis every year.

Anyway, I just think KU fans and KU itself it being a bit short sighted here.
MU made a decision to join the SEC to boost their $$$ and football program. As a result, there is some blowback that hurts KCMO.

However, you blame KU for not still playing MU and helping them out financially despite MU being the one that chose to leave the conference?

This is fallout from MU's unilateral decision to leave the conference. They weren't kicked out, they left....but this is somehow the fault of KU and their fans.
 
Old 01-19-2012, 10:59 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MO
5,758 posts, read 9,485,099 times
Reputation: 2791
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
MU made a decision to join the SEC to boost their $$$ and football program. As a result, there is some blowback that hurts KCMO.

However, you blame KU for not still playing MU and helping them out financially despite MU being the one that chose to leave the conference?

This is fallout from MU's unilateral decision to leave the conference. They weren't kicked out, they left....but this is somehow the fault of KU and their fans.
Exactly. When the MU board was making this decision, the guys on it from KC which I believe are only like two of them were very much against it. Our governor which is a St. Louis guy had everyone else in his pocket and they finally pushed for the moved and screwed over their second biggest city.
 
Old 01-19-2012, 11:00 AM
 
48,891 posts, read 39,370,650 times
Reputation: 30547
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcmo View Post
I'm talking about now, not over the past 100 games, It sure seems like MU has a much better football program, bigger stadium, more fans etc while KU has the better basketball program, more sellouts, more fans etc, although MU seems to be ranked quite often up there with KU, I fully understand that MU is not the basketball powerhouse that KU is.

That big KU/MU game was not on TV everywhere, it was a national game feed, but it seemed like few picked it up. We get both DC and Baltimore ABC affiliates and both showed a different game and even though the game was a HUGE deal in KC, ESPN barely even covered the highlights of the game. I know, we really wanted to watch it and couldn't and it was difficult to even find post game coverage. I'm not sure why, but that game at arrowhead is never on TV out here.

Now, we get lots of MU and KU games on TV out here, but for some reason, that border war game is never on out here.

I'm not going to try to argue with you on the economics of why KU won't play. I don't know enough about it. You are probably right. But it still seems odd for KU to step away and not play games in KC. Kansas City, MO is KU's "big city" and where they play in big city venues and where they have a great deal of alumni. Just like StLouis is to Mizzou. I just thought they would want to keep that going.

So with MU no longer in the big 12, does that mean KU will basically stop playing games at both Sprint Center and Arrowhead? With those venues being in a state that is not part of the big 12, it seems like MIZZOU leaving the big 12 has sort of ripped out the carpet from under KU taking away their home away from home venues. I can understand that resentment. I would just hope something can be worked out.

Sounds like MU will continue to play games in KC, they just may not be against KU. I think they have a better chance of filling arrowhead and bringing a lot more revenue to KC anyway if they played somebody like Arkansas or LSU. I don't know if MU will be able to compete with those guys or not, but it would be good for KC. Same deal with basketball. Bring some new teams to the city with traveling fans and fill the hotel rooms with people driving from further than Overland Park. This could be a good thing for KC or at least a wash if KC loses the big 12 tourney.
It's important to note that MU made this decision with MU's best interests at heart. There may be a gain or a loss to KCMO as a result but rest assured that MU doesn't give a fig other than how it impacts their revenues and football program exposure.

Just something to mull over when considering whom to *blame*.
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