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My response points out the gaping hole in your argument. Lol....it's ok because it's for population growth? What a steamer that one is.
Seems funny that we can all agree that poaching and massive incentives are bad.....when KS does it. When the spotlight shines on another state then here come the excuses.
It's just really hypocritical to see the blind eye being turned to the tax cuts and incentives when it's not comfortable.
P.S. I wonder if it was you that left me the anonymous rep recently with the message or one of the other two posters that like to make fun of kids and their families when they die in KS?
It was not me.
You have this uncanny ability, no matter how a debate goes, to declare victory anyway. I guess the secret is just to put words in everyone else's mouths.
Are you trying to make the case that ALL tax incentives are bad? So when the government gives you a kickback to take your house solar, that's bad because the local utility company suffers?
Tax incentives, in and of themselves, are not bad. They're just a tool, and can be wielded wisely or foolishly. They can be used competitively or collaboratively, to harm others or to benefit the public at large.
That being said, a little competition between states or cities is par for the course. And even what goes on between Kansas and Missouri in the KC area cannot be labeled "unfair" in objective terms. I've never said it was unfair, and neither has kcmo. But we have said it's idiotic. Because none of the poaching, going either direction, stands to benefit the people of those cities. And when governments spend loads of money on programs that don't benefit their own people, it may still be within their rights to do it, but philosophically speaking it's unethical.
Even the biggest KCMO boosters on this forum are a bit flummoxed by KCMO's participation in the border war. We wish they could have kept their hands clean. But we will maintain that Kansas is undoubtedly the initiator, the aggressor, and the worst offender, going by the numbers.
One could argue that the tax incentives have played no part in Kansas' current fiscal crisis. Nevertheless, it sure would be nice if they could get those hundreds of millions of dollars back now. Maybe they wouldn't have to cut school funding. At least not by so much.
I used to live in the KCMO area. I remember back in the late 90s on one of the FM sports talk shows there was a discussion on why KU got a lot more attention than MU in regards to sports. The host of the show said that at the time there were something like triple the KU grads in the area as opposed to MU grads. If that is even remotely true that probably explains why KU spends more money in the area promoting itself.
That's not true at all. The numbers are much closer
I wouldn't be surprised if the LS store closed just based off watching these large retail chains close stores. If the LS store is not performing very well (I have no idea if it is or not), then it could close because they would get the most return by being able to write off a much longer or more costly lease / construction loan since is a newer store. I think Macy's is pretty strong in the KC area. The one in Independence always seems busy.
The under construction Cabellas in Lee's Summit is also expected to close if the Bass Pro merger happens. I mean, it's slightly smaller than the tiny Wichita store.
That's not true at all. The numbers are much closer
The numbers are much closer, but:
Lawrence is 32 miles west of downtown Kansas City.
Columbia, about 125 miles east.
If KU weren't in Lawrence and thus keeping the lion's share of Douglas County residents employed there, Douglas County would probably be part of the Kansas City MSA now.
That as much as anything else, IMO, accounts for any difference in the emphasis on the sports teams. Attending a Jayhawks game is an easy commute. Attending a Tigers game is a day trip.
But don't forget we were also talking about the University of Kansas Hospital. KU's medical school has been in Kansas City ever since Dr. Simon Bell donated the land and the money to build its teaching hospital in 1905. That makes both KU Medical Center (still part of the university and home to its health professions schools) and the Hospital (now independent of the university but still its teaching hospital) part of the metropolitan area in a way MU (the flagship campus as opposed to UMKC) isn't. Yet another reason for the difference in ad spending.
You have this uncanny ability, no matter how a debate goes, to declare victory anyway. I guess the secret is just to put words in everyone else's mouths.
Are you trying to make the case that ALL tax incentives are bad? So when the government gives you a kickback to take your house solar, that's bad because the local utility company suffers?
Tax incentives, in and of themselves, are not bad. They're just a tool, and can be wielded wisely or foolishly. They can be used competitively or collaboratively, to harm others or to benefit the public at large.
That being said, a little competition between states or cities is par for the course. And even what goes on between Kansas and Missouri in the KC area cannot be labeled "unfair" in objective terms. I've never said it was unfair, and neither has kcmo. But we have said it's idiotic. Because none of the poaching, going either direction, stands to benefit the people of those cities. And when governments spend loads of money on programs that don't benefit their own people, it may still be within their rights to do it, but philosophically speaking it's unethical.
Even the biggest KCMO boosters on this forum are a bit flummoxed by KCMO's participation in the border war. We wish they could have kept their hands clean. But we will maintain that Kansas is undoubtedly the initiator, the aggressor, and the worst offender, going by the numbers.
One could argue that the tax incentives have played no part in Kansas' current fiscal crisis. Nevertheless, it sure would be nice if they could get those hundreds of millions of dollars back now. Maybe they wouldn't have to cut school funding. At least not by so much.
How can I put words in peoples mouths when they can't keep from getting their posts deleted? **cough**
BTW....this was a great thread...especially the 2nd poster claiming they don't bash JOCO either....do you feel that was truthful? I wonder if that was before or after they posted making fun of the KS kid killed by a pig. I'd link that too but it got deleted.
You might ask yourself what caused me to be more contentious and even post in this forum when I didn't use to. Um....weekly garbage attack threads that have had to be deleted would probably be a big reason and boy the hypocrisy backlash from the posters here was astounding when given a small taste back.
Tell you what, do a search on threads started by your pal and those are the mild ones that aren't erased then come back and tell us if we're unduly riled up?
We agree that the poaching is bad, I'm willing to drop it with you at this point. Let's table the branson tax haven thing too, but ask yourself who made out in that move? I'd say developers and landowners in that area were the ones that wound up enriched by the tax incentives albeit indirectly. I do agree with your point that there is a line where incentives of any kind make no sense, it depends how egregious the benefit it so again I agree with you there.
Mathguy, you and Luziane are obsessed with this "pig" thread, so I'll post it for you. It was not very difficult to find, actually, I'm sure you already found it, but chose not to quote it because no where did I "make fun of the KS kid killed by a pig"
The thread was not even deleted, it was locked. Yea, not one of my best threads. I get tired of how "KC" is portrayed in the national media and Kansas seems to have a more negative impact on KC's image than anything in the actual city itself. It is what it is. But I dozens or even hundreds of very well though out and informative threads. Even those that JoCo people hate get lots of positive feedback from people that actually understand that paying AMC 50 million to move from Downtown to Leawood is asinine.
I'll be posting a new thread soon with links etc about the state line poaching. You won't like it and you will find every reason you can think of to defend what KS does no matter what I post, but if I cared about that, I would have stopped posting this stuff a long time ago.
It has never been my goal to please people from KS or JoCo since most don't like what I post except the few that actually want to see Metro KC thrive rather than only sprawl into Kansas and become totally irrelevant.
KCMO was a great American top 15-20 city for decades long before JoCo was not much bigger than Grain Valley. Today with much of KC's wealth, businesses etc in JoCo, KC has never been ranked lower nationally. It's barely a top 30 city and is a very slow growth city and metro.
It's no coincidence.
The state line has and continues to do great harm to KC's ability to compete and thrive. I'm always amazed that KCMO does as well as it does with Topeka and Jeff City working against it and half the metro constantly trying to destroy it for their own gain.
^^^^ Well, people have been fleeing to Kansas from Missouri since before the Civil War. Slaves ran from Missouri, a slave state, to Kansas, a free state. Now businesses flee Missouri for Kansas. Nothing new here.
^^^^ Well, people have been fleeing to Kansas from Missouri since before the Civil War. Slaves ran from Missouri, a slave state, to Kansas, a free state. Now businesses flee Missouri for Kansas. Nothing new here.
I don't think black people flee to JO County today, let alone in 1940. I'm pretty sure JOCOUNTY kept blacks out which is why they migrated to raytown, Southland, grand view and now Lee's summit. I have a racially mixed family and moving to the burbs meant Lee's summit. No way would they move to jo county. They don't like it there. These are affluent people. Explain that.
Mathguy, you and Luziane are obsessed with this "pig" thread, so I'll post it for you. It was not very difficult to find, actually, I'm sure you already found it, but chose not to quote it because no where did I "make fun of the KS kid killed by a pig"
The thread was not even deleted, it was locked. Yea, not one of my best threads. I get tired of how "KC" is portrayed in the national media and Kansas seems to have a more negative impact on KC's image than anything in the actual city itself. It is what it is. But I dozens or even hundreds of very well though out and informative threads. Even those that JoCo people hate get lots of positive feedback from people that actually understand that paying AMC 50 million to move from Downtown to Leawood is asinine.
I'll be posting a new thread soon with links etc about the state line poaching. You won't like it and you will find every reason you can think of to defend what KS does no matter what I post, but if I cared about that, I would have stopped posting this stuff a long time ago.
It has never been my goal to please people from KS or JoCo since most don't like what I post except the few that actually want to see Metro KC thrive rather than only sprawl into Kansas and become totally irrelevant.
KCMO was a great American top 15-20 city for decades long before JoCo was not much bigger than Grain Valley. Today with much of KC's wealth, businesses etc in JoCo, KC has never been ranked lower nationally. It's barely a top 30 city and is a very slow growth city and metro.
It's no coincidence.
The state line has and continues to do great harm to KC's ability to compete and thrive. I'm always amazed that KCMO does as well as it does with Topeka and Jeff City working against it and half the metro constantly trying to destroy it for their own gain.
Lol in the very post after I say that I agree the poaching is bad for the umpteenth time....you post saying how I will defend it. Classic hogwash from the guy that says he doesn't bash JOCO and makes outlandish statements and doesn't source them....which is a great trick....one that I've borrowed. Thanks!
LOL....trying to destroy KC. "Want to see the metro thrive" lol.....you guys complain when anything from KS pays money to advertise in MO and especially funny is that there is yet another attack thread because the KS lottery paid the Royals for endorsement recently because basically the OP says there is nothing in KS worth filming about. Nice!
^^^^ Well, people have been fleeing to Kansas from Missouri since before the Civil War. Slaves ran from Missouri, a slave state, to Kansas, a free state. Now businesses flee Missouri for Kansas. Nothing new here.
You may have finally scraped the bottom of the barrel. Congratulations. 150 years ago, half the state of Missouri was claimed by the Confederacy, and people flooded into Kansas to make sure it didn't follow suit. People came from everywhere to accomplish this.
By no means was it a case of migration from a less-desirable state to a more-desirable one. And it still isn't. But the two scenarios are on separate planets.
Not only are you completely off-base with this, it's just plain offensive.
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What a steamer that one is. 
