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Old 08-13-2011, 11:51 AM
 
Location: IN
22,179 posts, read 38,704,699 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itsMeFred View Post
Correct me if I'm mistaken, but you DID say "northeast KS near Kansas City metro"

In which case, if you're in the "rural" areas around KC metro, it's only rural if you're comparing it to downtown. lol
More importantly, do you see all the light green to red areas of this map?-- File:Kansas population map.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
For my opinion, when you have that many people, that crowded together, it's not particularly "rural."

But I realize my vision of "rural" is considerably less populated that most everyone else's around here. I learned a long time ago that people tend to appreciate their neighbors more when they can't see into each other's yard, hear their dogs bark, etc.

Consequently, I heartily disagree with the notion that if one must live in Kansas they should locate themselves somewhere in the vicinity of KC.
Lets look at population density. The census bureau defines a frontier county as one that is 7 or fewer people per square mile. Most of the counties in western Kansas fit that description. The majority of rural counties in northeast KS (non-micropolitan) have less than 30 people per square mile- which is lower than the majority of rural non-micropolitan counties in the eastern US. However, I grew up in Johnson County, KS (density as of 2010 1,140 people per sq/mile. WAY TOO CROWDED for me. I like rural areas, just not remote frontier isolated places. I know that is what you like, Fred

For example, eastern KS does have some frontier counties as well in the Flint Hills based on population density. Those are: Chase, Greenwood, Elk, Chautaqua, and Woodson. Those are all just about as rural as Cheyenne county.

Last edited by GraniteStater; 08-13-2011 at 12:24 PM..
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Old 08-13-2011, 11:53 AM
 
Location: IN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VixenKS View Post
Compared to where I am, you betcha. Rural is a subjective term, maybe, but the drive I can make from the alpaca farm up there in the northeast to the airport ain't bad at all. The area surrounding this alpaca farm is quite rural with lots of wide open space. Then again, I'm comparing that distance to what I have to drive currently. Also by "northeast" I'm not talking up by White Cloud or up that far... although it's rural up there, too.

When I say "rural", I mean "not urban" and "not suburban" and houses spread way apart. You might see them, but you can't hear a darn thing.

Your last sentence is okay if that's what you like. I don't like western Kansas, I don't like southern Kansas, I don't like central Kansas (with a few exceptions), and I don't like southeast Kansas. Southeast Kansas actually is pretty, but it's the people I don't like--though I am trying to.
Southeast KS has a massive brain drain problem and most of the cities and towns lose much of their smart and talented people to urban areas or other states. Many of those places have what I would call an "Ozarks" kind of feel which I really don't care for. Way too much social conservatism as well. I generally don't recommend that area.
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Old 08-13-2011, 02:10 PM
 
Location: Western Nebraskansas
2,707 posts, read 5,653,946 times
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Quote:
Lets look at population density. The census bureau defines a frontier county as one that is 7 or fewer people per square mile.
And so far as I'm concerned, that's still pretty crowded.
Anywhere with a density of more than about 1-2 people per square mile means you can't truly see the night sky without a glow from some community... (Kansas doesn't have any genuinely remote areas, btw. I'd have to move back up to the Nebraska Sandhills to find that much space. )

Cheyenne county is actually one of the more densely populated counties I've lived in. ...In four states. lol
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Old 08-13-2011, 02:18 PM
 
Location: IN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itsMeFred View Post
And so far as I'm concerned, that's still pretty crowded.
Anywhere with a density of more than about 1-2 people per square mile means you can't truly see the night sky without a glow from some community... (Kansas doesn't have any genuinely remote areas, btw. I'd have to move back up to the Nebraska Sandhills to find that much space. )

Cheyenne county is actually one of the more densely populated counties I've lived in. ...In four states. lol
In terms of any accesibility, how easy is it to get into some of the most remote areas of the Nebraska Sandhills? I would like to explore more of that area.
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Old 08-13-2011, 02:59 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GraniteStater View Post
Southeast KS has a massive brain drain problem and most of the cities and towns lose much of their smart and talented people to urban areas or other states. Many of those places have what I would call an "Ozarks" kind of feel which I really don't care for. Way too much social conservatism as well. I generally don't recommend that area.
You're right, it does. Ozark/Appalachian kind of atmosphere, you nailed it. Southeast Central Kansas (SEK) is similar, but the people have just enough "smarts" to be dangerous.

I might be what you would consider socially conservative, but I'm also a bit "live and let live" as well. If people don't agree with me, well, okay. I'll still be your neighbor. If you need a cup of sugar or a ride somewhere or a babysitter, I'm here. Oh, and I don't care what your last name is.

People in most of Kansas are so stuck in their ways. I just cannot describe it. It's not even a conservative vs. liberal thing; it's a different mindset altogether. You can show them something that would make their lives a hundred times easier and/or safer, but they won't change one thing because... it's how they've always done it. And how their parents did it. And how their grandparents did it. You get the idea. I can't stand it.

Also inside many of the rural towns, I can't believe how many children grow up in squalor. You don't often see it on the outside of the houses (though you sometimes do) but the inside. Wow. Government intervention always makes things worse though, so I have no solution. And maybe I just notice it more because I'm not used to it, but it seems parents *scream* to communicate with their children. There is no in between of silence and screaming.

What kind of people ARE these??
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Old 08-13-2011, 03:03 PM
 
34 posts, read 96,506 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by itsMeFred View Post
And so far as I'm concerned, that's still pretty crowded.
Anywhere with a density of more than about 1-2 people per square mile means you can't truly see the night sky without a glow from some community... (Kansas doesn't have any genuinely remote areas, btw. I'd have to move back up to the Nebraska Sandhills to find that much space. )

Cheyenne county is actually one of the more densely populated counties I've lived in. ...In four states. lol
There's rural, and then there's RURAL, lol.
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Old 08-13-2011, 03:56 PM
 
Location: IN
22,179 posts, read 38,704,699 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VixenKS View Post
You're right, it does. Ozark/Appalachian kind of atmosphere, you nailed it. Southeast Central Kansas (SEK) is similar, but the people have just enough "smarts" to be dangerous.

I might be what you would consider socially conservative, but I'm also a bit "live and let live" as well. If people don't agree with me, well, okay. I'll still be your neighbor. If you need a cup of sugar or a ride somewhere or a babysitter, I'm here. Oh, and I don't care what your last name is.

People in most of Kansas are so stuck in their ways. I just cannot describe it. It's not even a conservative vs. liberal thing; it's a different mindset altogether. You can show them something that would make their lives a hundred times easier and/or safer, but they won't change one thing because... it's how they've always done it. And how their parents did it. And how their grandparents did it. You get the idea. I can't stand it.

Also inside many of the rural towns, I can't believe how many children grow up in squalor. You don't often see it on the outside of the houses (though you sometimes do) but the inside. Wow. Government intervention always makes things worse though, so I have no solution. And maybe I just notice it more because I'm not used to it, but it seems parents *scream* to communicate with their children. There is no in between of silence and screaming.

What kind of people ARE these??
A lot of this stems from systemic issues related to a lack of jobs, income, and not much focus being placed on education. Other issues that impact lower SES of the populace are at play as well. SEK suffers the most in terms of income and wages in a right to work state IMO. Poverty has increased nearly every single year in most of those counties for the last 10-15 years. Also, Kansas is not a low tax state either and many have to drive longer distances to get to work as well. All that adds up.
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Old 08-14-2011, 08:51 AM
 
Location: Western Nebraskansas
2,707 posts, read 5,653,946 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GraniteStater View Post
In terms of any accesibility, how easy is it to get into some of the most remote areas of the Nebraska Sandhills? I would like to explore more of that area.
There's really nowhere that's INaccessible. However, we've lived on ranches that included directions like "Go 20 miles down the one-lane tar mat. Cross 5 autogates...." etc.
Far enough from town and other neighbors that mail only came out every other day. But even the place we lived on where the last two miles where a track through a pasture was still accessible...

(Some friends from the eastern part of the Sandhills came out when we lived on that ranch. AJ got out of the car and said, "Guys--There's a difference between living in the country and living the BOONIES")

If you can contact the owners of the various fishing lakes, you'll usually find they allow visitors.
There are also several state rec. areas around the various lakes in the western Hills.

Quote:
What kind of people ARE these??
The same kind you find EVERYWHERE, Vixen.
It's just that in an area with a smaller population, people aren't as able to segregate themselves, physically, into classes...
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Old 08-14-2011, 09:56 AM
 
11,205 posts, read 11,266,563 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GraniteStater View Post
A lot of this stems from systemic issues related to a lack of jobs, income, and not much focus being placed on education. Other issues that impact lower SES of the populace are at play as well. SEK suffers the most in terms of income and wages in a right to work state IMO. Poverty has increased nearly every single year in most of those counties for the last 10-15 years. Also, Kansas is not a low tax state either and many have to drive longer distances to get to work as well. All that adds up.
another problem with parts of SEK is housing blight. I believe in Pittsburg or Crawford county it was said that 5% of the population owns over half the houses. Its not uncommon for one person to own 100 rental homes. I think the old adage was to own 1 house for every day of the month as a retirement plan. It was assumed that one man could spend a few hours after work each day maintaining one of these dumps to keep up his investment.

Last edited by thriftylefty; 08-14-2011 at 10:13 AM..
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Old 08-14-2011, 12:13 PM
 
Location: IN
22,179 posts, read 38,704,699 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thriftylefty View Post
another problem with parts of SEK is housing blight. I believe in Pittsburg or Crawford county it was said that 5% of the population owns over half the houses. Its not uncommon for one person to own 100 rental homes. I think the old adage was to own 1 house for every day of the month as a retirement plan. It was assumed that one man could spend a few hours after work each day maintaining one of these dumps to keep up his investment.
I've heard this as well. Situations like that where you have a few landlords owning most of the housing stock in entire towns or counties never ends very well. It takes even longer to see improvement when you have unfortunate situations like that. Also, many areas of SEK are underlayed by derelict zinc and lead mines from the more than 100 years ago. You end up with lots of contaiminants in the soil and other issues that makes properties worth next to nothing.
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