118 violations recorded by city's red-light cameras (how much, drivers license, car)

[domino]

Originally Posted by Steve Bagu

The "relevance" as you stated pertains to the length in secs the yellow is showing. The time entering the intersection with the yellow on could be short enough so that a person is still in the intersection when turning RED...thus considerd running a RED light.

Entering the intersection after the light turns RED is a NO NO and warrants a ticket. Big difference.

I sat (front car) at a signal waiting for a left turn with a green light at a 4 way intersection. Cross traffic and oncoming traffic had the GREEN light for THREE cycles while we waited for our turn. Cars were backing up behind me and probably were inpatient as was I. Sooooo they do malfunction.

Steve

My understanding of the law is that if you are in the intersection when the light turns red you ARE breaking the law, no matter what color the light was when you entered the intersection. When the light is red, someone else has a green light, thus the problem.

If the law states that the color of the light when you enter the intersection determines whether or not you have broken the law, surely the cameras record that moment, rather than a later moment in the intersection. Or am I being too logical?

[Steve Bagu]

I would call it "reasoning". Upon entering a intersection with the light being yellow you are in essence LEGAL. The technical part is how large is the intersection?...how many secs. does the yellow stay lit? at normal legal speed how many ft per sec does a car travel thru the intersection during the balance in secs. of the yellow light?

Invarably the driver is getting the screws. Every intersection is different while the traffic light is programmed (supposedly) the same.

Bottom line is REVENUE and not to control traffic which should be the main factor.

We could go on for ever on the subject...anyway BIG BROTHER is around the corner.

Steve

[domino]

Not to beat a dead horse, but how is this any different than when a live policeman catches you in the aforementioned situation? You can argue that the yellow light was not long enough, but does it change the circumstance that you were in the intersection when the light was red?

If the law is that you are legal if you enter the intersection when the light is not red, the camera can catch this moment just as well, if not better, than a live policeman can.

I don't want to pay more taxes to have a policeman monitoring every intersection, but I wouldn't mind paying taxes for a few effective cameras if it will reduce traffic accidents.

[_yb]

The mayor of Albuquerque got caught shorting yellow light times to generate more revenue from this scam. Some of the yellow light times were as low as 1.7 seconds.

Redflex actually trains the phony judges that work for the city in it's kangaroo court.

[Steve Bagu]

Lets go into a little direction for a change.

As a pedestrian you have the green light and also the (small pedestrian image) to cross the street.

15 ft across the street and the yellow light is flashing for cars...What do you do? Turn around and run back to the curb? Do you continue ahead as the traffic light turns RED? A person can only walk or run so fast getting the rest of the way across. Should a cop give a ticket for walking against a RED light?

Be it a car or pedestrian in the wrong spot at a RED light turning on should not be ticketed.

The hypocrisy is obvious.

Steve

[mortimer]

domino understands:

> ... that if you are in the intersection when the light turns red you ARE
> breaking the law, ...

That's NOT how I understand it. If you have the slightest millimeter of your front bumper in the intersection whilst the light is still yellow, you are clear to proceed.

It's also this way when you are turning left against an unprotected green. You proceed into the intersection and if you are the first one, you are guaranteed to make your left turn. (*)

> When the light is red, someone else has a green light, thus the problem.

I've never seen an intersection that didn't have simultaneous red lights after one of them went from green > red. I'm not saying that there isn't an intersection somewhere that has instantaneous switching, but I've never seen one. Ever.

(*) That is why lights are red in BOTH directions for a second or two.

The cross traffic has to wait for the ONE left turner to make their turn. In Albuquerque and many other cities, people pile on after the ONE legal left turner goes so that cross traffic often has to wait for a line of cars who are running the light. The first car is NOT running the light and has time to clear the intersection before the cross traffic light turns green.

[Cali-girl]

To Steve Bagu:

As a Californian who also lives in LC, I would like to state that although red-light cameras are VERY CONTROVERSIAL in Cali, the CA Court of Appeals (4th District) defended their use in a ruling last year. AFAIK, opponents have been successful in Orange County in getting some restrictions placed on the things and some communities are reviewing their use altogether due to complaints of inaccuracy.

Citizen efforts to get rid of them continue on and knowing Cali (lol), this whole situation will never end. Nonetheless, somewhere, somehow, someday, some law student or attorney will crack the code, so to speak, and get the things banned on one basis or another.

Anyway in Cali, like the speed-detection devices, questions regarding red-light cameras has been centered on proper settings and proper maintenance in order to ensure legal accuracy, which has been debated for at least 10 years now.

In any event, NM law needs to make provision for proper maintenance and testing, both of which should be verifiable through paper records kept with signatures thereon.

~Cali-girl

[Steve Bagu]

Well Cali-Girl...have driven in the LA area 50 yrs so can attest to the workings of traffic signals. Never a ticket tho.

Problem...complaints of inaccuracy...needs of proper settings and maintenance.............meanwhile many are paying thru the nose for these flaws.

I would gather you have never paid for one of these "Red camera tickets" otherwise I would hear a different story.

Next time you get a ticket (hope not) look carefully at it for mistakes. I received one from a arrogant cop in San Ysidro Ca and noticed a PERJURY he committed. I told the judge the C.P.C. # and the cop was transferred or fired (I hope). Have not seen him since. They do make mistakes and so does the camera. As I said in a earlier post that all intersections are not the same and the LAW is too quick to find a person GUILTY for the MONEY.

I was in your fair city 20 yrs ago and a motor officer gave me a stupid warning ticket for being so many feet to close to the intersection where there were no curb markings...no sign...area desolate...no traffic...no pedestrians...edge of town. He wanted to show this Calif car that he was the MAN and showed me so. A stupid waste whereas he could nicely pointed out the whatever was on his mind.
A ticket with no fine...nothing against my record...just a big hoop de do to show his watch commander he was on the ball. Lack of public relations for sure. Never been back and never will be.

Steve

[Cali-girl]

Originally Posted by Steve Bagu

Well Cali-Girl...have driven in the LA area 50 yrs so can attest to the workings of traffic signals. Never a ticket tho.

Problem...complaints of inaccuracy...needs of proper settings and maintenance.............meanwhile many are paying thru the nose for these flaws.

I would gather you have never paid for one of these "Red camera tickets" otherwise I would hear a different story.

Next time you get a ticket (hope not) look carefully at it for mistakes. I received one from a arrogant cop in San Ysidro Ca and noticed a PERJURY he committed. I told the judge the C.P.C. # and the cop was transferred or fired (I hope). Have not seen him since. They do make mistakes and so does the camera. As I said in a earlier post that all intersections are not the same and the LAW is too quick to find a person GUILTY for the MONEY.

I was in your fair city 20 yrs ago and a motor officer gave me a stupid warning ticket for being so many feet to close to the intersection where there were no curb markings...no sign...area desolate...no traffic...no pedestrians...edge of town. He wanted to show this Calif car that he was the MAN and showed me so. A stupid waste whereas he could nicely pointed out the whatever was on his mind.
A ticket with no fine...nothing against my record...just a big hoop de do to show his watch commander he was on the ball. Lack of public relations for sure. Never been back and never will be.

Steve

Hey Steve:

Glad to know that you've been driving L.A. for 50 years now imo, the Legislature needs to have a Freeway Survivor license plate for those of us who've managed to survive the commute on the 101, 405, 91, 210, 5, 605 etc.

As a fourth-generation Californian, I can attest to how things have changed. Ex: part of our family property used to be where the 91 fwy at Lemon currently is located.

Yeah, I've heard of the stories of drivers "paying through the nose" for tickets, however, you can get Miles Berman to argue out of it if you have $$. Anyway, whether you self-represent or have an attorney, the key seems to be raising a court challenge to the verified accuracy and maintenance records that the law requires to be kept on each camera.

Glad you got just a warning - that was actually very nice of the officer, not sure about your comments - are you still in California?

Best,
~Cali-girl

[Poncho_NM]

Originally Posted by domino

My understanding of the law is that if you are in the intersection when the light turns red you ARE breaking the law, no matter what color the light was when you entered the intersection.

That is not true with the Red-Cams in Albuquerque.

"No, only vehicles that enter the intersection after the light has turned red will be cited. The automated system uses ground loops to determine the vehicles that will not stop prior to the intersection." APD | FAQ


Rich