[airics]

Originally Posted by the bad seed

I live in North Carolina . You're calling a person a thief . Did you drive over to the property and look at the scope of work ?

Are you the person who hires illegal laborers ?

you need to chill... in vegas things are different from North Carolina... ALOT of people use the illegals.

[Robustus]

Originally Posted by the bad seed

I live in North Carolina . You're calling a person a thief . Did you drive over to the property and look at the scope of work ?

Are you the person who hires illegal laborers ?

Nice to meet you, kind sir. I lived in North Carolina for a few years.

Whoever does the job adequately for the cheapest price gets my business. And, by the way, I'm a US-based software developer. Obviously software engineering is one of the most outsourced of all businesses. I say, that's fine, inevitable, and just. If you can't retool or innovate, someone else will do the work, and that's the way it should be. Capitalism can be brutal, but you can't have it both ways, and that's the underlying incentive driving advancement.

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by the bad seed

Reading threads like this are amazing to me . Everyone complains about how illegal laborers are ruining this country and then you read posts like this condoning the behavior of hiring them . I would love to see anyone charge $12.00 an hour for labor and operate a business . I guess having business expenses such as insurance and workman's comp as well as taxes aren't a concern for the consumer . I hope the undercut laborers don't do more damage to your property than you are paying them . Are there bad contractors ? Sure , but a few calls to references can solve that quick enough and you can get more than one estimate too . The folks replying to this thread can't possibly tell you what your job is going to cost ; you have a very vague scope of work . What does quite a few shrubs mean ? sq. ft of lawn ? height of trees ? Are the posters in your geographic area comparing similar wage requirements ? Get a few estimates from reputable companies .

How do you know that the day laborer is illegal? Particularly the ones that drive around. I happen to know the guy I use is legal...but when he brought in an expert to cut my palm trees was I supposed to ask to see his papers?

Now my guy does want cash so it may well be he is not reporting all his income...but I am not sure that is my task to control either. The last guy who repaired a block wall took cash. Did he report it? Got some lights fixed and installed. In that case a check...made out to him personally.

I would very much doubt it should cost any where near $200- plus the gravel and related. That is a little more than I would pay with a max half acre. But I would I think pay for it by the hour. And if he does not work reasonably hard I would not use him again.

I have also done these by phone where I had not seen the actual job and got it to work out pretty well. So it can be roughly priced after you have seen a few and the good landscapers generally don't bs about the work involved.

Note by the way that the gringo firms here have virtually totally hispanic work forces. And if you presume all are legal you are naive. Actually the ones hired for a long time are always good....it is their legality that is in doubt.

[Prosze]

Not specific enough for all I know you could have some really tall trees to trim....

shop around/negotiate.

[Buzz123]

I get email everyday from people ranting about illegals, and it is so obvious that they really mean Mexicans, even though they are lumping all Hispanics under one label. The funny part is that most of the mail comes from people who live in eastern states that are almost totally white, and wouldn't know a Mexican from an Iranian. But to them, all brown people are illegal, and they want to ship them all back to "Mexico" even though they might be American, Salvadoran, Honduran, Chilean, Guatemalan, or whatever .... and even though they have a legitimate work visa.

[the bad seed]

Originally Posted by Robustus

Nice to meet you, kind sir. I lived in North Carolina for a few years.

Whoever does the job adequately for the cheapest price gets my business. And, by the way, I'm a US-based software developer. Obviously software engineering is one of the most outsourced of all businesses. I say, that's fine, inevitable, and just. If you can't retool or innovate, someone else will do the work, and that's the way it should be. Capitalism can be brutal, but you can't have it both ways.

You are one hundred percent correct . So how is a legitimate company supposed to compete in the environment that you state ? I can't outsource my labor ( even H2B you need to pay a company to provide the service ) so what all of you folks who are breaking the law claim is it's okay as long as you get a better deal . It doesn't matter geographically if it happens in NC or Vegas . They don't call it illegal because it's legal . You're right as far as Capitolism can be brutal but it should be on an even playing field within our borders and granted , since I don't compete globally ; you got me there . I feel sorry for you folks that can't grasp this concept but if your job gets outsourced to another country and you lose your job than maybe you'll get the message . I bet your opinion will change on this subject instantly . FYI , my laborers that don't legally reside in the USA are documented laborers . So for me being a legitamate business and playing by the rules I should be penalized for doing so by not getting your business because it costs more for me to do so ? I'm not trying to start an argument ; just trying to get you to see that what you are doing and condoning is an illegal / unfair practice . I'm not a nasty person at all . I'm not wealthy by any means so let your illegal worker contribute to the several charities and do volunteer work in your community that my company does in our community ; guess I'll just work for nothing and give nothing back in return like he does . That will make our country better . I'm off my soapbox . Just go get some estimates like I suggested .

[the bad seed]

Originally Posted by airics

you need to chill... in vegas things are different from North Carolina... ALOT of people use the illegals.

Not really . The workers come back and forth from Florida and North Carolina . Most work in agriculture and manufacturing .

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by the bad seed

You are one hundred percent correct . So how is a legitimate company supposed to compete in the environment that you state ? I can't outsource my labor ( even H2B you need to pay a company to provide the service ) so what all of you folks who are breaking the law claim is it's okay as long as you get a better deal . It doesn't matter geographically if it happens in NC or Vegas . They don't call it illegal because it's legal . You're right as far as Capitolism can be brutal but it should be on an even playing field within our borders and granted , since I don't compete globally ; you got me there . I feel sorry for you folks that can't grasp this concept but if your job gets outsourced to another country and you lose your job than maybe you'll get the message . I bet your opinion will change on this subject instantly . FYI , my laborers that don't legally reside in the USA are documented laborers . So for me being a legitamate business and playing by the rules I should be penalized for doing so by not getting your business because it costs more for me to do so ? I'm not trying to start an argument ; just trying to get you to see that what you are doing and condoning is an illegal / unfair practice . I'm not a nasty person at all . I'm not wealthy by any means so let your illegal worker contribute to the several charities and do volunteer work in your community that my company does in our community ; guess I'll just work for nothing and give nothing back in return like he does . That will make our country better . I'm off my soapbox . Just go get some estimates like I suggested .

YOu mix issues that are quite unrelated and do not belong in this thread.

Certain fields in Las Vegas and in much of the SW are dominated by hispanics. That is how it is. There is no rational way for a consumer to determine if an hispanic is legal or not and anyone suggesting that you ask is bordering on racist. That is likely OK in NC but not here. When you call the white contractor in a suit are you going to ask him to see his passport?

Note that the vast majority of the firms with contractors licenses in this field are hispanic or mostly hispanic workers.

Now why don't you take your xenophobic race baiting to the illegal immigration thread where it belongs...

[bepperoo]

Thanks for all the responses. Didn't mean to get anyone heated up though. I was pretty vague in my description of my yard so I understand that no one can really answer my question very truthfully. My front yard is really quite small and is all stones and desert landscape. The problem is that it is just such a mess right now. Lots of dead leaves and debris in the rocks and around the base of the bushes. He will bring the gravel and of course remove all of the debris. The trees and palms will require a ladder but probably no more than a 6 feet one. I actually had another company come out and only give me a quote on the front yard and he quoted 350. so I figure that my yard must be pretty bad looking to them.

I will not go to Stars and hire a day laborer. Its just against my principles to hire someone who won't pay taxes on their earnings. My brother is in construction and he works very hard for his money and has to compete with day laborers so I will not support them just to save myself some money. Keeping Americans working is more important to me.

[the bad seed]

Originally Posted by Buzz123

I get email everyday from people ranting about illegals, and it is so obvious that they really mean Mexicans, even though they are lumping all Hispanics under one label. The funny part is that most of the mail comes from people who live in eastern states that are almost totally white, and wouldn't know a Mexican from an Iranian. But to them, all brown people are illegal, and they want to ship them all back to "Mexico" even though they might be American, Salvadoran, Honduran, Chilean, Guatemalan, or whatever .... and even though they have a legitimate work visa.

You forgot the illegals from the former Soviet Block ( I won't even attempt to list the new countries ) that I was including . Illegal is illegal no matter of orgin or ethnic backround . When I use the word illegal it's just that , anyone that is here and registered to work here I don't consider illegal or better yet anyone I can legally hire .