[ScoopLV]

Originally Posted by clutchcargo777

I can secretly smoke high on a mountain top or on a deserted beach and there will be someone who complains.

Who is throwing their butts into my driveway from their cars every day? Non-smokers? I guess I pick up all the butts from inconsiderate non-smokers every few days on the curb by my house, too.

Yes, there are plenty of considerate smokers. But there are plenty more who simply don't give a damned about anything other than their next fix. And that's why all these laws are enacted. Try to see it from the perspective of the non-smoker who hates the smell of smoke and picking up other people's garbage.

[clutchcargo777]

Originally Posted by ScoopLV

Who is throwing their butts into my driveway from their cars every day? Non-smokers? I guess I pick up all the butts from inconsiderate non-smokers every few days on the curb by my house, too.

Yes, there are plenty of considerate smokers. But there are plenty more who simply don't give a damned about anything other than their next fix. And that's why all these laws are enacted. Try to see it from the perspective of the non-smoker who hates the smell of smoke and picking up other people's garbage.

I was recently attacked by a Californian jogger on a foggy beach near Venice who took the time to stop and call me everything she could think of for mucking up her air. I was enjoying an E-cig. I was amazed. She didn't want to hear that what I was emitting was no different then the fog she was huffing as she jogged,

I'm an E-cig smoker, you will never find any butt's from me up in your East Las Vegas neighborhood. You will also never smell my smoke in your restaurant.

The point is, you should be supporting E-cigs, they solved all your complaints! People wanting to ban E-cigs are showing their ass. They are trying to remove the obvious path to better health. They are tipping their hand at what they really want.

[irisheyzs]

I never blamed non smokers for being annoyed with smokers. It's a dirty, smelly, nasty addiction...but boy did I enjoy it! I still would love to sit on my deck on a Saturday morning with a cup of coffee and a cigarette. What bothers me the most about this "anti smoking" campaigns is what it will lead to. One hospital in our area will not hire smokers, my employer...another large hospital...is going to charge an extra $50 a pay for smokers. IMHO this is going to open a can of worms for everyone. Addiction is addiction is addiction. It's just which poison you pick. So what will they charge for next? Will you have to pay extra for health insurance if you are over weight? Not get hired because you are considered obese? Like bacon with your eggs? Watch that cholesterol! It's gonna cost ya! Have a glass of wine with dinner...no, no, no! People who drink alcohol can develop health issues. Take anxiety medication? Hmmm...don't want to risk hiring you. Where will it end? I'm all for quitting smoking but it just feels wrong the way things are going...it won't end well for any of us.

[logline]

Originally Posted by clutchcargo777

I think the attack on E-cigs is the most telling thing I have ever seen about peoples control motivation. Think about it. Smokers have gone from the majority to the minority in about 10 years. I cannot be a considerate smoker enough to satisfy the anti-smoker crowd. I can secretly smoke high on a mountain top or on a deserted beach and there will be someone who complains.

We have removed EVERY SINGLE reason anti's complained about it, but its not enough. Now just looking like we are enjoying our vice is just as bad as doing what they complained about. Anti's need to admit this was all about control. What else can it be about? If it's about hurting ourselves with nicotine, they need to look at their caffeine addiction. Because mark my words, they are next.

Not true. I was a big "anti" (as you refer to it) for years. In fact, you could probably find some of my anti-smoking rants on this very message board.

That was until e-cigs came around. Now I'm totally "pro". I have no problem with them whatsoever.

[DianeV]

Originally Posted by Dale Cooper

Pssssssttttttttttttt: There isn't any tobacco in ecigs.
Now you know.

Which was discussed earlier in the thread.

[ScoopLV]

Originally Posted by clutchcargo777

I was recently attacked by a Californian jogger on a foggy beach near Venice who took the time to stop and call me everything she could think of for mucking up her air. I was enjoying an E-cig. I was amazed. She didn't want to hear that what I was emitting was no different then the fog she was huffing as she jogged,

I'm an E-cig smoker, you will never find any butt's from me up in your East Las Vegas neighborhood. You will also never smell my smoke in your restaurant.

The point is, you should be supporting E-cigs, they solved all your complaints! People wanting to ban E-cigs are showing their ass. They are trying to remove the obvious path to better health. They are tipping their hand at what they really want.

I never said I don't support them. But let's call a spade a spade -- it's the equivalent of methadone for nicotine addicts. (I absolutely recognize that the only similarity between heroin and cigarettes is the difficulty kicking the habit.) If a business doesn't want people doing drugs on their property. That's one thing.

And I concur that much of the rabid "anti-vapor" sentiment is a puritanical, Scarlet Letter, punish the sinners mentality. A control freak is a control freak -- doesn't matter if they want to control what we eat, who we have sex with, or what kind of birth control we practice. They're more concerned with power than a happy society.

But just keep in mind that the eCigs fall into two categories -- the ones that look like the user is smoking a crack pipe; and the ones that look like the user is smoking a blue-tipped cigarette.

[aggrofish]

Originally Posted by ScoopLV

I never said I don't support them. But let's call a spade a spade -- it's the equivalent of methadone for nicotine addicts. (I absolutely recognize that the only similarity between heroin and cigarettes is the difficulty kicking the habit.) If a business doesn't want people doing drugs on their property. That's one thing.

And I concur that much of the rabid "anti-vapor" sentiment is a puritanical, Scarlet Letter, punish the sinners mentality. A control freak is a control freak -- doesn't matter if they want to control what we eat, who we have sex with, or what kind of birth control we practice. They're more concerned with power than a happy society.

But just keep in mind that the eCigs fall into two categories -- the ones that look like the user is smoking a crack pipe; and the ones that look like the user is smoking a blue-tipped cigarette.

Either way it's no different then drinking a monster energy drink or caffeine in some other form. caffeine is a drug maybe they should ban than too. How about aspirin?

I can understand cigarettes - second hand smoke, etc. but water vapor? Give me a break. If that jogger lady told me off she'd be ripped a new one and would definitely think twice before opening her mouth again about something that doesn't concern her.

[ScoopLV]

Originally Posted by aggrofish

Either way it's no different then drinking a monster energy drink or caffeine in some other form. caffeine is a drug maybe they should ban than too. How about aspirin?

I can understand cigarettes - second hand smoke, etc. but water vapor? Give me a break. If that jogger lady told me off she'd be ripped a new one and would definitely think twice before opening her mouth again about something that doesn't concern her.

I don't think you're getting my point. A lot of people are just sick of smokers -- picking up their butts, smelling their smoke wafting up from the hotel balcony, etc. I am not condoning the rabid "zero tolerance" policy on all nicotine products. But I am trying to show you why that zero-tolerance policy exists.

Hell, I just got back from a concert by the former members of the Grateful Dead and the concert hall had a "no smoking, and that includes vaporizers" policy. That's EXACTLY what the sign said. And people next to us were thrown out for vaping. The REASON for this rabid anti-smoking sentiment is that smokers have worn out their welcome in many places -- carelessly tossing their butts all over the place and displaying a "[censored]-you, I need my fix" mentality when it comes to smoking in public places.

[aggrofish]

Originally Posted by ScoopLV

I don't think you're getting my point. A lot of people are just sick of smokers -- picking up their butts, smelling their smoke wafting up from the hotel balcony, etc. I am not condoning the rabid "zero tolerance" policy on all nicotine products. But I am trying to show you why that zero-tolerance policy exists.

Hell, I just got back from a concert by the former members of the Grateful Dead and the concert hall had a "no smoking, and that includes vaporizers" policy. That's EXACTLY what the sign said. And people next to us were thrown out for vaping. The REASON for this rabid anti-smoking sentiment is that smokers have worn out their welcome in many places -- carelessly tossing their butts all over the place and displaying a "[censored]-you, I need my fix" mentality when it comes to smoking in public places.

I get it, it's still just wrong though. Stupid people ruin a lot of things. Fact is, people should be embracing Vaping ( hell I even think it's stupid when I see some guy toking away on a bong looking device in a store or some other replace) due to the fact that you DONT have any of the byproduct of cigarettes - no butts, no second hand smoke, etc.

But because of stupid people toking away at their leisure in places where the people around them probably don't know the difference is the reason everyone suffers.

It's the same with Starbucks banning firearms. Once the idiots with their long rifles started showing up to support the company's support of the second amendment, Starbucks bans firearms.

Idiots rule the world.

[ScoopLV]

Originally Posted by aggrofish

Idiots rule the world.

Only because we mollycoddle idiots. We're so afraid of hurting their feelings when they spout off stupid crap about chemtrails, the moon landing hoax, and humans and dinosaurs once interacting, that we don't call them on their willful ignorance. In addition, these same people have a ridiculous sense of entitlement. They're entitled to have their miserable little rat dogs anointed as service animals so that they can take them into markets and restaurants. They're entitled to handicap placards because they have "that pain in their arm" so they can get the good parking spaces and avoid lines at airports. They're entitled to get their nicotine fix wherever and whenever they damned well please.

By saying (and doing) nothing, we enable these people. And now we're enjoying the fruits of out inaction -- a government shutdown and a citizenry filled with hopelessly entitled, mouth-breathing, knuckle-dragging morons.