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Old 01-05-2008, 05:09 PM
 
1,755 posts, read 3,690,776 times
Reputation: 228
Quote:
Originally Posted by AAPoolServiceLV View Post
I worked at a school district in CA and the "honor students" were Asian Indian or Chinese for the most part. Income really didn't play too much of a factor but it seemed more of a cultural doctrine. If you look at most tech firms in Silicon Valley they are domiated by Indian/Pakistani or Chinese/Tiawan based from an engineering point of view (software and hardware)
So, does this hold true in LV?
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Old 01-05-2008, 07:28 PM
 
57 posts, read 88,920 times
Reputation: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chest Rockwell View Post
It's also a stereotype to say that the kids on a particular side of town are difficult to teach. This is something that should be discussed on a class by class basis or a student by student basis. It's a slippery slope that ends with comments like minorities or the poor are harder to teach.

Obviously, subs have the freedom to take only the jobs they want, but I disagree with the notion that any job east of this street or north of that street will be bad.
Why avoid the slippery slope if it's true? Just go look at the stats on the CCSD website. Look which schools have the attendance problems, the weapon problems, the violence problems and the worst grades - almost 100% are in the E and NE zones. "minorities and the poor" are not by nature harder to teach, but parents of kids in these areas tend to place a much lower emphasis on the merits of learning. It's not the kid's fault, it's the culture at home that holds them back.

Still, the fact remains, subs get paid more out east and NE and I know from repeated personal experience that after a day of pointless futility at some school like Fremont, Valley, Chapperall, Mojave, Roy Martin, I come home with a hammering headache and an oath on my lips never to be lured by the extra pay again. What I usually do is work out east on a Friday so my spirits are up again by Monday after the weekend. I have never had a class out east or NE that was anything even approaching good. By constrast I have had ONE single bad class in the remaining zones around the valley. There's plenty of "minorities" in these schools too and they do just fine.
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Old 01-05-2008, 07:32 PM
 
57 posts, read 88,920 times
Reputation: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by gulfer View Post
That and I think Substitute Teachers have it harder from 'students' in gereral. It's been awhile since I've been in high school, but we looked forward to substitude day because we knew we weren't going to learn anything new, that the sub didn't have their degree in the subject they were subbing for, that there would be no homework, etc... But, we weren't uncontrollable because that earned us a visit to the VP's office for a crack on the bum!
It depends on the sub - im 6ft 4 and pretty intimidating. My wife's a teacher and I know all the procedures for dealing with trouble makers. I have only ever sent three kids to the dean (and I got a group of four a day of in house suspension once too) and these have all been in the South West Zone - but the reason I can single these trouble-makers out is because they are the exception - There's usually one or two class clowns, oblivious talkers etc in the nicer schools - at a lousy school it is one big social occasion and nothing you can do will help - there's no fear of consequences, nothing.
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Old 01-05-2008, 07:41 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas, NV
2,428 posts, read 5,211,607 times
Reputation: 783
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheriff View Post
So, does this hold true in LV?
I don't know because i don't have any kids in school. The demographics here are also much different than Northern California. Some schools in Cupertino (Apple computer country) are dominated by Asians and whites are complaining they are taking all the top scholarships. I'm going to assume if all were equal, Asians would also domiate LV schools if that were the case. But if I had kids and was worried about the quality of the education they were getting, I would send them to a private school.
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Old 01-05-2008, 08:26 PM
 
Location: Issaquah, WA
818 posts, read 2,563,493 times
Reputation: 234
Quote:
Originally Posted by nemspy View Post
Why avoid the slippery slope if it's true? Just go look at the stats on the CCSD website. Look which schools have the attendance problems, the weapon problems, the violence problems and the worst grades - almost 100% are in the E and NE zones. "minorities and the poor" are not by nature harder to teach, but parents of kids in these areas tend to place a much lower emphasis on the merits of learning. It's not the kid's fault, it's the culture at home that holds them back.

Still, the fact remains, subs get paid more out east and NE and I know from repeated personal experience that after a day of pointless futility at some school like Fremont, Valley, Chapperall, Mojave, Roy Martin, I come home with a hammering headache and an oath on my lips never to be lured by the extra pay again. What I usually do is work out east on a Friday so my spirits are up again by Monday after the weekend. I have never had a class out east or NE that was anything even approaching good. By constrast I have had ONE single bad class in the remaining zones around the valley. There's plenty of "minorities" in these schools too and they do just fine.
Well, it can't be geography that causes students to be less attentive. It has to be a socioeconomic or cultural thing. You are definitely on to something when you say there's a culture at home that doesn't value education. There's also a culture at home that doesn't value respect or personal responsibility in some homes. I also think it may have something to do with your preconceived notion that the class you're entering will be like the ones you've been in before, since you phrase things in such concrete terms.

If I seem a bit defensive, it's because I went to Valley and I was an excellent student who studied in classes full of attentive and hardworking kids and I'm sure there are plenty of excellent students at all of those schools you've just mentioned. Obviously, you're in the trenches and your opinion probably mirrors that of many teachers who would rather not teach at such schools if they had the choice, but these are still stereotypes and cannot apply to all kids in all of these schools.
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Old 01-05-2008, 08:44 PM
 
57 posts, read 88,920 times
Reputation: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chest Rockwell View Post
Well, it can't be geography that causes students to be less attentive. It has to be a socioeconomic or cultural thing. You are definitely on to something when you say there's a culture at home that doesn't value education. There's also a culture at home that doesn't value respect or personal responsibility in some homes. I also think it may have something to do with your preconceived notion that the class you're entering will be like the ones you've been in before, since you phrase things in such concrete terms.

If I seem a bit defensive, it's because I went to Valley and I was an excellent student who studied in classes full of attentive and hardworking kids and I'm sure there are plenty of excellent students at all of those schools you've just mentioned. Obviously, you're in the trenches and your opinion probably mirrors that of many teachers who would rather not teach at such schools if they had the choice, but these are still stereotypes and cannot apply to all kids in all of these schools.
Of course they dont apply to all kids and yes it is totally socioeconomic and in some cases cultural that places the low value on academic achievement and respect for authority figures. Not the kid's fault at all - it is all they know in many cases.

None of this has anything to do with pre-conceived notions - when I got my sub license I thought "why would I ever not teach out east if it pays more for the same job". My wife teaches out east - Great, we'd car pool and I'd teach with her at her school as often as possible. If a class is good, believe me i'll say so and I'll enjoy my day. No amount of dislike of working in "at-risk" or lower achieving schools out east/NE will prevent me from noticing a good class out there. It really -is- that stark of a difference. And yes, there's good kids at all the schools I listed, I would never pretend that everyone was bad, just as I wouldn't pretend everyone was an angel elsewhere. It's what the whole group adds up to that becomes "how my day was". I leave Canarelli, Sierra Vista, Durango etc with a spring in my step, feeling like I have accomplished something. I leave Valley, Fremont etc feeling like I just stepped out of a warzone and reaching for the Tylenol. (I should point out that Valley's IB classes are great)

Most fellow subs I talk to flat out refuse to take jobs E and NE, the ones that I meet out in those regions are ones who work every day at the same school because it's close to home.
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Old 01-08-2008, 05:10 AM
 
Location: South Strip, NV --> Philly (Fall 2009)
2,404 posts, read 7,268,017 times
Reputation: 572
That's a real surprise that you say leaving Sierra Vista at the end of the day leaves you accomplished...the only people that I know that have been expelled have either been expelled from Sierra Vista or ended up having to go there because they got expelled from another school...
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Old 01-08-2008, 05:55 AM
 
Location: Land O Lakes, FL
1,662 posts, read 1,555,584 times
Reputation: 1126
Hmmm...maybe time to meet some other people?? Just making fun here. I would think that nemspy would have a much better idea of what goes on, as he is actually doing this.
I still feel that teachers are extremely underpaid. But I would think if I were to teach (which I absolutely know I don't have the patience for) I would try to find accomplishment in that percentage that you feel you got thru to.
Interesting that you continue to read articles from parents that blame the school, teachers, etc... when they could look in the mirror and find the real blame.
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Old 01-08-2008, 06:16 PM
 
Location: Henderson, NV 89012
697 posts, read 2,309,609 times
Reputation: 176
It is getting tougher to get a teaching job here from my experience. I am entertaining the idea of teaching after I am done with college but with statewide budget cuts, it is gonna get tougher I think.
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Old 01-12-2008, 08:45 PM
 
Location: Leaving fabulous Las Vegas, Nevada
1,469 posts, read 3,283,462 times
Reputation: 928
I work for the district, the incentives are mostly for special education programs and they are drying up. I have seen teachers on those track given bad advice. You have to keep up with your classes AND the information they the program advisors give you. Every year it seems to become more difficult.
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