[Daddys///M3]

Originally Posted by Nodaclu

Well, no such luck, as I'm not the kind of person who "cheats" like that. As soon as I stopped payments, I moved out. I won't live somewhere if I'm not paying for it.

Of course, when I told this to the lender, my reward was for them to report me to my homeowners insurance company, who immediately canceled my policy.

Always remember, no good deed goes unpunished.

As mentioned, we've brought ELEVEN offers to the table. There have been no second or third passes with any individual offer, as CW has refused to even counter any of the offers. Each prospective buyer has walked away in disgust because of CW's complete unwillingness to move even an inch to get a deal done.

Meanwhile, every living thing on that property that I spent three years bringing back to life, is going to die in the next few months - further reducing the value of the property.

"Well, what the hell do you care, you don't live there any more!!"

Right?

Well, believe it or not, not everyone on this planet exists solely to see how much they can "leech" off the system, or "get away with" through loopholes.

There are still a handful of us left who are honest, hardworking people who made the fatal error of trusting another human being, without having a lawyer check every single word in the contract. I thought I was safe from all that by working with the largest lender in the country.

Never again.

This isn't necessarily directed at you olecapt. It's more of a "heads up" to everyone in this thread, who is intellectually arguing the merits of their particular positions, while sometimes forgetting about the real people that are being swept up in this tidal wave.

It truly bothers me that so many people *assume* I am taking advantage of the situation by continuing to live in a home I am no longer paying for.

Honesty and integrity still exists in this world. I know that sounds hypocritical to hear from someone who has basically walked away from a contractual obligation.

But until you've walked a mile in my moccasins, I ask that you think twice before making any broad assumptions about a particular person or their situation.

I applaud your conviction and ethics. + rep for you.

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by jpk

I understand your frustration with Countrywide. I was a buyer of a CW repo and they were painfully slow to deal with. And apparently I did much better than most in forcing a "quick" acceptance and closure of the deal. Some have posted here that it has taken months from offer to closing.

The only thing I can suggest is you find what realtor is representing the property on behalf of Countrywide and implore them to give Countrywide a kick in the ass the next time an offer is on the table. A good selling agent will know who to work at CW to make things happen faster. Don't take anything lying down, ask them to get in touch with the boss if the asset manager isn't responding. If they don't know the boss, then you have a bad realtor representing your home and it will be painful.

CW actually was going to miss signing on the closing date after we had entered escrow and I had already signed papers and put all of my funds for the purchase into escrow. They apparently screwed up all manner of paperwork related to the original foreclosure and wanted another month to get their house in order. I told them I'd be happy to extend 30 days if they paid me interest on my money plus damages for every incidental expense related to the delay, or they could visit me in court and pay my attorneys fees on top of that. We closed that day.

We do enough of that to know our way around. There is no agent who can get CW to move. We, personally and corporately, have deep ties with CW and Wells Fargo. Even senior bank managers cannot get performance.

The most effective technique is certain clericals, often in escrow companies, who have deep ties into the clericals of the lenders. They are the only thing that works that I know of.

Other than that it is a crap shoot. I am still sitting on a short since January...that has been very well tracked and the lender haunted by a skilled short sale operative. We are still sitting with an answer due next week...yet again.

[gulfer]

Nodaclu,
I remember your post for a while back. I'm sorry that it is still hanging over your head. Can I ask a question or two?
Wasn't there issues with the IRS as well? Also, if you can get 250 on an asking price but CW will only go to 265K, could you possibly have the remaining 15K on a loan for you? I know things are probably tight with all of this going on. But 15K spread over 5 years and having that house gone seems like it could happen. Just a thought.

Again, good luck.

[airics]

hey jpk, was the countrywide issue with a house in henderson? who was the closing agent for countrywide... i had issues also and it was their branch and closing agent in henderson that was awful..

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by Nodaclu

Well, no such luck, as I'm not the kind of person who "cheats" like that. As soon as I stopped payments, I moved out. I won't live somewhere if I'm not paying for it.

Of course, when I told this to the lender, my reward was for them to report me to my homeowners insurance company, who immediately canceled my policy.

Always remember, no good deed goes unpunished.

As mentioned, we've brought ELEVEN offers to the table. There have been no second or third passes with any individual offer, as CW has refused to even counter any of the offers. Each prospective buyer has walked away in disgust because of CW's complete unwillingness to move even an inch to get a deal done.

Meanwhile, every living thing on that property that I spent three years bringing back to life, is going to die in the next few months - further reducing the value of the property.

"Well, what the hell do you care, you don't live there any more!!"

Right?

Well, believe it or not, not everyone on this planet exists solely to see how much they can "leech" off the system, or "get away with" through loopholes.

There are still a handful of us left who are honest, hardworking people who made the fatal error of trusting another human being, without having a lawyer check every single word in the contract. I thought I was safe from all that by working with the largest lender in the country.

Never again.

This isn't necessarily directed at you olecapt. It's more of a "heads up" to everyone in this thread, who is intellectually arguing the merits of their particular positions, while sometimes forgetting about the real people that are being swept up in this tidal wave.

It truly bothers me that so many people *assume* I am taking advantage of the situation by continuing to live in a home I am no longer paying for.

Honesty and integrity still exists in this world. I know that sounds hypocritical to hear from someone who has basically walked away from a contractual obligation.

But until you've walked a mile in my moccasins, I ask that you think twice before making any broad assumptions about a particular person or their situation.

If I remember correctly you moved to facilitate a sale. A bad call. Your heart may have been in the right place but your head was not. You gave up a good bit of leverage to feel better about yourself I suppose. If you wanted to pay CW they would not have turned down your money. Then you could have been both moral and in posssession.

Note that I was not going to go there...but you are wrapping yourself in goodness. This is business. It is likely when you vacated you moved yourself to the bottom of the pile.

I am very sympathetic to those who, through no fault of their own, are way underwater on a rationale purchase. Even if they can pay - should they? Likely not if they will eventually have to walk away. These are the people I would like to see get some relief...though it does not look like it is going to happen.

[Nodaclu]

Originally Posted by olecapt

If I remember correctly you moved to facilitate a sale. A bad call. Your heart may have been in the right place but your head was not. You gave up a good bit of leverage to feel better about yourself I suppose. If you wanted to pay CW they would not have turned down your money. Then you could have been both moral and in possession.

I moved for many reasons, one of the biggest was the fact that the home had been on the market for 17 months at that time. I had a large IRS debt piling up (I ran into problems about 90 days after buying the house and it quickly became a choice - I could pay my mortgage, or the IRS, but not both) and decided the time had come to make a clean break and try a completely different approach, since what I had been doing for the previous year and a half was obviously not working, and I needed to start catching up with Uncle Sam before they started coming after me.

You know what they say about doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

That doesn't change the simple fact that I refuse to live in a place i'm not paying for. I'm sorry if you just can't understand how someone could possibly do that, since you only see it as a "poor business decision" and nothing else.

I do find it interesting that you chose to take a patronizing tone with my moral and ethical choices. I shouldn't be surprised I suppose. This city has more people with no moral or ethical base then any place I've ever visited (28 states) or lived in (4 states on both coasts).

Daddys///M3 - Thank you for your kind words. It's nice to know there is one person in this valley who "gets it".

Note that I was not going to go there...but you are wrapping yourself in goodness. This is business. It is likely when you vacated you moved yourself to the bottom of the pile.

No disrespect intended, but this statement above makes me wonder if you've just been "in the business" too long.

This is my life. This is my wife's life. This is the life of my 11 year old daughter.

It may be business to you. It may be business to CW, but this was my life. This is what I worked the last 20+ years of my life to achieve - home ownership.

I bought in early 2005 - right near the top of the bubble. I knew it was a risk. I also knew I was in position to buy a home, and it might be my only chance in my life to be a homeowner.

As a result of this decision, my financial life has basically been destroyed.

I'm not trying to wrap myself in "goodness". I'm only trying to do my best for everyone involved, and that includes CW.

I'm truly sorry if you've grown so cold that you can no longer see through the "business" aspects of Real Estate to find the living, breathing human beings involved.

I know you stated in your last paragraph that you were "sympathetic" toward people in my position, but your previous paragraphs come off as so condescending, that it basically negates your final one.

Take a break from the game. Immerse yourself in the real world with real people for awhile. Try to re-learn that without people - there is no business. When you come back, I promise you will be a much better agent for it.

I am very sympathetic to those who, through no fault of their own, are way underwater on a rationale purchase. Even if they can pay - should they? Likely not if they will eventually have to walk away. These are the people I would like to see get some relief...though it does not look like it is going to happen.

[olecapt]

Originally Posted by Nodaclu

I moved for many reasons, one of the biggest was the fact that the home had been on the market for 17 months at that time. I had a large IRS debt piling up (I ran into problems about 90 days after buying the house and it quickly became a choice - I could pay my mortgage, or the IRS, but not both) and decided the time had come to make a clean break and try a completely different approach, since what I had been doing for the previous year and a half was obviously not working, and I needed to start catching up with Uncle Sam before they started coming after me.

You know what they say about doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

That doesn't change the simple fact that I refuse to live in a place i'm not paying for. I'm sorry if you just can't understand how someone could possibly do that, since you only see it as a "poor business decision" and nothing else.

I do find it interesting that you chose to take a patronizing tone with my moral and ethical choices. I shouldn't be surprised I suppose. This city has more people with no moral or ethical base then any place I've ever visited (28 states) or lived in (4 states on both coasts).

Daddys///M3 - Thank you for your kind words. It's nice to know there is one person in this valley who "gets it".

No disrespect intended, but this statement above makes me wonder if you've just been "in the business" too long.

This is my life. This is my wife's life. This is the life of my 11 year old daughter.

It may be business to you. It may be business to CW, but this was my life. This is what I worked the last 20+ years of my life to achieve - home ownership.

I bought in early 2005 - right near the top of the bubble. I knew it was a risk. I also knew I was in position to buy a home, and it might be my only chance in my life to be a homeowner.

As a result of this decision, my financial life has basically been destroyed.

I'm not trying to wrap myself in "goodness". I'm only trying to do my best for everyone involved, and that includes CW.

I'm truly sorry if you've grown so cold that you can no longer see through the "business" aspects of Real Estate to find the living, breathing human beings involved.

I know you stated in your last paragraph that you were "sympathetic" toward people in my position, but your previous paragraphs come off as so condescending, that it basically negates your final one.

Take a break from the game. Immerse yourself in the real world with real people for awhile. Try to re-learn that without people - there is no business. When you come back, I promise you will be a much better agent for it.

You come here and complain because the business world is screwing you. Then you admit you did what would maximize the screwing. If you chose to suffer to feel moral that is your choice. I do however question your infliction of that pain on your daughter.

What you find condescending is simply telling you how the world is...not how you would like it to be.

Suffer in peace.

[jpk]

Originally Posted by airics

hey jpk, was the countrywide issue with a house in henderson? who was the closing agent for countrywide... i had issues also and it was their branch and closing agent in henderson that was awful..

Yep, Countrywide and their closing agent in Henderson were horrible. Not sure if it was just complete incompetence, disinterest, or what.

I was buying right at the time Countrywide was at risk of going bankrupt and I thought they'd be falling overthemselves to get the deal closed and take my money. Nope, the sky was falling and they didn't even look outside.

It seemed at first that there was an asset manager that was on top of things. Whomever was initially on the other side of the transaction was counter-offering within hours and meeting me in the middle. But then that person disappeared after two days and it took weeks to get anyone to actually sign the counter offer and enter escrow. It was complete amateur hour as they refused to sign their own counter offer, asked for standard purchase agreement forms to be re-written because they didn't understand the terms, and generally acted like they had never sold a property before and were lost.

Then their closer at the title company seemed equally befuddled, perhaps because of missteps Countrywide took in preparing the repo for resale.

[airics]

was her name Josephine Pagliarulo? worst agent i have ever worked with, how she has a job is beyond me.. my house was supposed to close on feb 15, i flew to vegas on the 22nd, and it didnt close till the 29th.. argh.. i wasted a week because of this b****. she kept blaming it on the title company when it was her.

[Nodaclu]

Originally Posted by olecapt

You come here and complain because the business world is screwing you. Then you admit you did what would maximize the screwing. If you chose to suffer to feel moral that is your choice. I do however question your infliction of that pain on your daughter.

What you find condescending is simply telling you how the world is...not how you would like it to be.

Suffer in peace.

Wow. What on earth is wrong with you?

I'm really grateful that I don't live in your world. I would truly be suffering then. I'm stunned and saddened by your cold callousness. You are truly a reflection of where the world is heading, and the planet is worse for it.

But enough. I came here seeking advice, so I won't engage you in this silly, useless argument any longer.

If anyone else has some thoughts or advice that are actually constructive and useful, please feel free to share.