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Old 07-30-2011, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Durham UK
2,001 posts, read 2,462,765 times
Reputation: 1026

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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
Advising the OP to study nursing in order to get into the USA is setting the OP up for disappointment.

Here is what is actually GOING ON when it comes to nursing in the USA.

No nursing jobs
I am not advising anyone to study nursing.
Nursing is a very special job and only certain people make good nurses-hence the reason that Nursing in the US is listed as a shortage profession and has been since the 80s.
The OP was from Scotland and I certainly wouldn't advise anyone to go into nursing as a career there. The USA nurses winge and moan, but boy they have it good compared to many!

It was another poster that first mentioned nursing and I gave information regarding nursing in the US, just as I'm doing now.
I also suggested other healthcare occupations and directed the OP to the DOL ONet site which will say if a job has a "bright outlook" amongst other things.
Acute care RNs, Nurse Practitioners, Physicians assistants and Physical therapists all fall into that category.
This DOL link gives lots of information regarding wages, geographical concentrations etc
Registered Nurses*

I read the CD thread (well- I read a few posts that were "I know this many people who can't get a job -etc etc) and thought it would be better to post some hard facts re the employment outlook for RNs as well as the Healthcare industry in General.


According to the American National Council of State Boards of Nursing, the number of U.S. trained nurses has been increasing over the past decade:
In 2000, 71,475 U.S. trained nurses became newly licensed. In 2005, 99,187 U.S. trained nurses became newly licensed. In 2009, 134,708 U.S. trained nurses became newly licensed. Therefore, a 9.8% annual increase of newly licensed U.S. nurses has been observed each year over the past 9 years.
While the number of U.S. trained licensed nurses has increased each year, the projected nursing demand growth rate from 20082018, as reported by the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics is anticipated to be a 22%, or 2.12% annually. Therefore, the 9.8% annual growth of new R.N.'s exceeds the current new position growth rate by a net of 7.7% per year with the assumption of consistent growth figures over the next decade.

HOWEVER- The US population is projected to grow at least 18% over two decades in the 21st century, while the population of those 65 and older is expected to increase three times that rate.[7] The current shortfall of nurses is projected at over 1 million by the year 2020.[7]

YearSupplyDemandShortagePercent20001,890,7002,001, 500-110,800-6%20051,942,5002,161,300-218,800-10%20101,941,2002,347,000-405,800-17%20151,886,1002,569,800-683,700-27%20201,808,0002,824,900-1,016,900-36%US: Supply versus Demand Projections for FTE Registered Nurses
Source: Data from the Bureau of Health Professions. (2004)

Also from the Current Employment statistics Highlights for June 2011(from Bureau of labor and statistics
[LEFT]Health care employment continued to increase in June.[/LEFT]
[LEFT] The industry has added 369,000 jobs since total nonfarm reached a trough in
February 2010 and has accounted for slightly more than 1 of every 5 nonfarm jobs added since then.[/LEFT]
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Old 08-01-2011, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
15,856 posts, read 17,116,131 times
Reputation: 6523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatsthenews View Post
I am not advising anyone to study nursing.
Nursing is a very special job and only certain people make good nurses-hence the reason that Nursing in the US is listed as a shortage profession and has been since the 80s.
The OP was from Scotland and I certainly wouldn't advise anyone to go into nursing as a career there. The USA nurses winge and moan, but boy they have it good compared to many!

It was another poster that first mentioned nursing and I gave information regarding nursing in the US, just as I'm doing now.
I also suggested other healthcare occupations and directed the OP to the DOL ONet site which will say if a job has a "bright outlook" amongst other things.
Acute care RNs, Nurse Practitioners, Physicians assistants and Physical therapists all fall into that category.
This DOL link gives lots of information regarding wages, geographical concentrations etc
Registered Nurses*

I read the CD thread (well- I read a few posts that were "I know this many people who can't get a job -etc etc) and thought it would be better to post some hard facts re the employment outlook for RNs as well as the Healthcare industry in General.


According to the American National Council of State Boards of Nursing, the number of U.S. trained nurses has been increasing over the past decade:
In 2000, 71,475 U.S. trained nurses became newly licensed. In 2005, 99,187 U.S. trained nurses became newly licensed. In 2009, 134,708 U.S. trained nurses became newly licensed. Therefore, a 9.8% annual increase of newly licensed U.S. nurses has been observed each year over the past 9 years.
While the number of U.S. trained licensed nurses has increased each year, the projected nursing demand growth rate from 20082018, as reported by the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics is anticipated to be a 22%, or 2.12% annually. Therefore, the 9.8% annual growth of new R.N.'s exceeds the current new position growth rate by a net of 7.7% per year with the assumption of consistent growth figures over the next decade.

HOWEVER- The US population is projected to grow at least 18% over two decades in the 21st century, while the population of those 65 and older is expected to increase three times that rate.[7] The current shortfall of nurses is projected at over 1 million by the year 2020.[7]

YearSupplyDemandShortagePercent20001,890,7002,001, 500-110,800-6%20051,942,5002,161,300-218,800-10%20101,941,2002,347,000-405,800-17%20151,886,1002,569,800-683,700-27%20201,808,0002,824,900-1,016,900-36%US: Supply versus Demand Projections for FTE Registered Nurses
Source: Data from the Bureau of Health Professions. (2004)

Also from the Current Employment statistics Highlights for June 2011(from Bureau of labor and statistics
[LEFT]Health care employment continued to increase in June.[/LEFT]
[LEFT] The industry has added 369,000 jobs since total nonfarm reached a trough in
February 2010 and has accounted for slightly more than 1 of every 5 nonfarm jobs added since then.[/LEFT]
While the "supply, demand" make nursing look like a reasonable option in the "statistical world," in the real world the hospitals prefer to operate in a shortage-situation when it comes to nurses, deliberately understaffing. Hospital administrators get bonuses based on how lean they can run the hospital with the least amount of staff. For example, it is almost unheard of for a nurse to be replaced if s/he calls in sick. The others left on the shift have to "make do." They often have "open" positions that they deliberately do not fill.
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Old 08-01-2011, 09:32 PM
 
Location: Durham UK
2,001 posts, read 2,462,765 times
Reputation: 1026
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
While the "supply, demand" make nursing look like a reasonable option in the "statistical world," in the real world the hospitals prefer to operate in a shortage-situation when it comes to nurses, deliberately understaffing. Hospital administrators get bonuses based on how lean they can run the hospital with the least amount of staff. For example, it is almost unheard of for a nurse to be replaced if s/he calls in sick. The others left on the shift have to "make do." They often have "open" positions that they deliberately do not fill.
I'm a scientist and an RN and I like hard facts ie statisitics and evidence.
I'm aware that all businesses have to balance their books, but think deliberately understaffing isn't quite how it is. Who decides on minimum patient/staff ratios? Only a few states have them and really it depends on the requirements of the type of patients being cared for.
You say that it is almost unheard of for a nurse to be replaced if s/he calls in sick, but in NC I see many jobs advertised for float staff who are used for that purpose and to cover PTO etc.
How can you dispute data that says x number of jobs were added to the healthcare industry last month.
Where's your figures/evidence?
Many US nurses will argue that they are short staffed, but in fact they have it far better than nurses in other countries where the ratios are much lower and nurses have far more autonomy and responsibility.
I would give my right hand to work on a floor that has a nursing secretary, CNAs, families allowed to stay overnight, state of the art equipment including electronic medication administration and only 6 patients to look after.
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Old 08-02-2011, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
15,856 posts, read 17,116,131 times
Reputation: 6523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatsthenews View Post
I'm a scientist and an RN and I like hard facts ie statisitics and evidence.
I'm aware that all businesses have to balance their books, but think deliberately understaffing isn't quite how it is. Who decides on minimum patient/staff ratios? Only a few states have them and really it depends on the requirements of the type of patients being cared for.
You say that it is almost unheard of for a nurse to be replaced if s/he calls in sick, but in NC I see many jobs advertised for float staff who are used for that purpose and to cover PTO etc.
How can you dispute data that says x number of jobs were added to the healthcare industry last month.
Where's your figures/evidence?
Many US nurses will argue that they are short staffed, but in fact they have it far better than nurses in other countries where the ratios are much lower and nurses have far more autonomy and responsibility.
I would give my right hand to work on a floor that has a nursing secretary, CNAs, families allowed to stay overnight, state of the art equipment including electronic medication administration and only 6 patients to look after.
Go tell it to the practicing US nurses on allnurses.com.
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Old 08-02-2011, 07:16 PM
 
Location: NJ
2,203 posts, read 4,331,159 times
Reputation: 2070
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatsthenews View Post
It will again within the next few years.
You don't have enough good quality training programmes here and once the GOVT creates a number of visas specifically for RNs -(like they did in 2005) then it will help to be a RN.

Once hospitals know that there are visas available again they will employ experienced foreign nurses rather than US newly qualified Associate degree RNs with only 400 clinical hours that they have to babysit for a year.
It makes sense for them as businesses.

Also they realise that RNs from other countries are used to having a lot more autonomy and responsibility ( and accept that) despite the fact that the $$$ rewards are often much lower than here in the USA.

You have to look into the future!
The problem with this theory is that unlike in 2005 there is currently over 9% official unemployment, unofficially much higher. There is already a political backlash against such things as H1-B visas and the public suspicion that employers are using it to drive down wages rather than employ locals. I find it highly unlikely in this current climate and with Americans rushing to retrain in supposedly high demand fields such as nursing, that any such visas will be created in the near or even the far term.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatsthenews View Post
Many US nurses will argue that they are short staffed, but in fact they have it far better than nurses in other countries where the ratios are much lower and nurses have far more autonomy and responsibility.
I would give my right hand to work on a floor that has a nursing secretary, CNAs, families allowed to stay overnight, state of the art equipment including electronic medication administration and only 6 patients to look after.
The main complaint nurses seem to make here isn't about the equipment or the families or the CNAs it's about the incessant paperwork that takes them away from caring for patients. Part of living in a litigious society dominated by insurance companies that have different rules and who try not to pay for anything. That plus having no job security in work at will states.
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Old 08-03-2011, 08:31 AM
 
Location: Durham UK
2,001 posts, read 2,462,765 times
Reputation: 1026
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnthonyB View Post
The problem with this theory is that unlike in 2005 there is currently over 9% official unemployment, unofficially much higher. There is already a political backlash against such things as H1-B visas and the public suspicion that employers are using it to drive down wages rather than employ locals. I find it highly unlikely in this current climate and with Americans rushing to retrain in supposedly high demand fields such as nursing, that any such visas will be created in the near or even the far term.

The unemployment rate for healthcare professionals is around 3% and for healthcare support workers around 6%
That's the problem- the public are suspicious and don't see that it's mainly some of the big manufacturing companies eg Krispy Creme that are using illegal practices to secure H1-bs for people that don't qualify for H1-bs and for jobs that don't either.
This isn't the case for most professionals,who compete for a US job in an open market and secure the job because they have the most relevant education, experience, knowledge and skills.
I-love-LI-but posted;
in the real world the hospitals prefer to operate in a shortage-situation when it comes to nurses, deliberately understaffing. Hospital administrators get bonuses based on how lean they can run the hospital with the least amount of staff.
If the hospitals are cost conscious then it's more cost effective to employ an experienced foreign RN than a US newby with only 400 clinical hours via ADN from some crappy community college.
Maybe they will actually reduce the training required for RN to one year in the future in order to address the nursing shortage of the future and maybe Americans would prefer that .
Let's remember t that the US health service is the way it is because the people with the most influence and money have been happy for it to be that way for decades.


The main complaint nurses seem to make here isn't about the equipment or the families or the CNAs it's about the incessant paperwork that takes them away from caring for patients. Part of living in a litigious society dominated by insurance companies that have different rules and who try not to pay for anything. That plus having no job security in work at will states.
Again- a litigious society that has been fostered by many with no thought as to how that actually affects healthcare.
BTW- paperwhork for RNs is almost as bad in the UK, but the RNs have more responsibility and autonomy and less support than in the USA.
Job security is no better and at most hospitals the staff are charged to park their cars but not guaranteed to be able to get parked-and I'm not talking about just the bigger inner city hospitals.
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Old 08-03-2011, 08:33 AM
 
Location: Durham UK
2,001 posts, read 2,462,765 times
Reputation: 1026
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
Go tell it to the practicing US nurses on allnurses.com.
I do!
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Old 08-03-2011, 11:50 AM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
15,856 posts, read 17,116,131 times
Reputation: 6523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatsthenews View Post
I do!
Well then, what say we get back to the topic at hand, which is helping the OP brainstorm appropriate subjects to study at school?
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Old 08-03-2011, 12:43 PM
 
2,060 posts, read 3,096,038 times
Reputation: 1588
The issue is what jobs are hiring from overseas rather than what jobs are in demand. The two are not the same. The OP needs to focus on an industry that often hires from outside the US, and that is going to be something they can excel at.
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Old 08-05-2011, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Durham UK
2,001 posts, read 2,462,765 times
Reputation: 1026
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
Well then, what say we get back to the topic at hand, which is helping the OP brainstorm appropriate subjects to study at school?
Yep- I did that several posts ago. Maybe you could offer something now?
No sign of the OP anyway. Probably just a flight of fancy
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